Global Warming

[Coburgtiger]

TM, it's good you're thinking on global scales, but your logic is arse backwards.

Around 250 million years ago, climate change wiped out 97% of the species on this planet.

If an event like that happens again, we're done. We don't survive that. Life will adapt, humans won't.

There is no denying climate change is something that happens throughout geological time periods. There's no denying that it's devastating to life on this planet. There's also no denying that human actions are right now contributing to it.

So the question is, do we make it worse? Do we do nothing? Do we try to give ourselves a bit longer so our kids and grand kids get to live in the world too?

Nah, China's got lots of people, so *smile* our children.

 

[Nico]

I reckon give up coal, oil and the other big pollutants and double down on renewables and if down the track we discover that climate change isn't man made after all, then at least we'll have a clean planet. Added bonus is the Saudis will be screwed.

If we continue down the coal, oil route and it's eventually determined that climate change IS unequivalently man made (even by the most fervent sceptics), then it's too late and our children, grandchildren will be royally shafted.

 

[Giardiasis]

I reckon give up coal, oil and the other big pollutants and double down on renewables and if down the track we discover that climate change isn't man made after all, then at least we'll have a clean planet. Added bonus is the Saudis will be screwed.

If we continue down the coal, oil route and it's eventually determined that climate change IS unequivalently man made (even by the most fervent sceptics), then it's too late and our children, grandchildren will be royally shafted.

But if renewables send us broke, how are you going to pay the police to raid people’s homes and put them in prison for petrol possession?

 

[Nico]

But if renewables send us broke, how are you going to pay the police to raid people’s homes and put them in prison for petrol possession?

Disclaimer. This is the first post I have made on this thread, and I haven't read any previous posts.

I have to say, what a bizzare post Giardiasis

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

I reckon give up coal, oil and the other big pollutants and double down on renewables and if down the track we discover that climate change isn't man made after all, then at least we'll have a clean planet. Added bonus is the Saudis will be screwed.

If we continue down the coal, oil route and it's eventually determined that climate change IS unequivalently man made (even by the most fervent sceptics), then it's too late and our children, grandchildren will be royally shafted.

If push comes to shove they will enhance carbon capture technology which is currently not remotely cost effective. But that is many centuries away, if at all.

 

[Giardiasis]

Disclaimer. This is the first post I have made on this thread, and I haven't read any previous posts.

I have to say, what a bizzare post Giardiasis

Yes, indeed it was. Have another read of your post and perhaps you will see the same quality.

 

[eZyT]

Yes, indeed it was. Have another read of your post and perhaps you will see the same quality.

I thought Nicos post was perfectly logical, concise and rational.

dare I say, a no brainer.

there's always a small proportion of people who can't see the logic in no brainers

Like some people cant see a number 33 obscured in red and green dots on a card.

funny that.

 

[Giardiasis]

I thought Nicos post was perfectly logical, concise and rational.

dare I say, a no brainer.

there's always a small proportion of people who can't see the logic in no brainers

Like some people cant see a number 33 obscured in red and green dots on a card.

funny that.

See this is why we need to be able to have a way to secede politically from each other. I have no desire to be in a political union with people that want to trash liberty and property rights and think immoral ideas are no brainers.

 

[eZyT]

See this is why we need to be able to have a way to secede politically from each other. I have no desire to be in a political union with people that want to trash liberty and property rights and think immoral ideas are no brainers.

I think collections of ghettoes of people who all agree with each other has been done with extremely limited success.

immoral solar panels and wind turbines? I think you can probably consider yourself an intellectually island G.

 

[lamb22]

But if renewables send us broke, how are you going to pay the police to raid people’s homes and put them in prison for petrol possession?

Really, the little you know continually amazes me.

Renewables to be cheaper than coal even without climate policy, CSIRO says

The CSIRO and energy market operator say existing coal plants are still the cheapest form of power but new wind and solar farms will soon be cheaper, even without a carbon price.

www.smh.com.au

Renewable energy versus coal-fired stations: which is the cheaper electricity choice?

The debate over the cost of renewables versus coal generation is firing up ahead of May's federal election as the Liberals and Nationals spar over coal.

www.energymatters.com.au

Renewables Cheaper Than 75 Percent of U.S. Coal Fleet, Report Finds

e360.yale.edu

Renewable Energy Is Now The Cheapest Option - Even Without Subsidies

Over recent years the march towards an energy industry ruled by renewables has been on the agenda of many countries and international bodies. Aside from their non-depleting and replenishing nature, renewable energy is poised to lessen the world's carbon footprint and reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

www.forbes.com

 

[Sintiger]

See this is why we need to be able to have a way to secede politically from each other. I have no desire to be in a political union with people that want to trash liberty and property rights and think immoral ideas are no brainers.

Serious question. Based on your definition of liberty is there anywhere on planet Earth that you believe provides it ?

Just trying to get a working example

 

[lamb22]

Renewables over the coming decades will be cheaper, better for the planet (and us) and create more wealth and jobs than coal.

And yet some 'geniuses' still argue AGAINST them!!

 

[Giardiasis]

Serious question. Based on your definition of liberty is there anywhere on planet Earth that you believe provides it ?

Just trying to get a working example

Different places provide different degrees of liberty, but none provide it fully.

Serious question, but do you think anyone in early 19th century America needed a working example of slavery not existing somewhere to figure out that it was a bad idea for structuring society?

 

[Giardiasis]

Renewables over the coming decades will be cheaper, better for the planet (and us) and create more wealth and jobs than coal.

And yet some 'geniuses' still argue AGAINST them!!

Primarily the argument is against using the government to substitute central planning for the market not against renewables per se. This is a political argument.

The secondary argument is an economic one and if what you’re saying is true then fantastic. All those that backed renewables and made a profit from market outcomes should be rewarded by it. However the problem is that most of those that are making a profit from it can only do so through political means, not by better meeting customer demand. I wouldn’t put $1 in the enterprise because of what I know about the power market, the physical limitations of the transmission network and because I understand that what matters is not cost but the spread between cost and revenue.

 

[lamb22]

Primarily the argument is against using the government to substitute central planning for the market not against renewables per se. This is a political argument.

The secondary argument is an economic one and if what you’re saying is true then fantastic. All those that backed renewables and made a profit from market outcomes should be rewarded by it. However the problem is that most of those that are making a profit from it can only do so through political means, not by better meeting customer demand. I wouldn’t put $1 in the enterprise because of what I know about the power market, the physical limitations of the transmission network and because I understand that what matters is not cost but the spread between cost and revenue.

Cool . Let's get rid of the $30 billion in subsidies fossil fuels get in Australia.

As usual your argument is based in la la land rather than reality.

Global fossil fuel subsidies reach $5.2 trillion, and $29 billion in Australia

IMF says fossil fuel subsidies in Australia amount to nearly $1,200 per person, or a total of $29 billion.

reneweconomy.com.au

 

[Sintiger]

Different places provide different degrees of liberty, but none provide it fully.

Serious question, but do you think anyone in early 19th century America needed a working example of slavery not existing somewhere to figure out that it was a bad idea for structuring society?

Ah I get it. Because you say it’s right it is.
Righto

 

[Giardiasis]

Ah I get it. Because you say it’s right it is.
Righto

Said every slavery advocate ever.

 

[Giardiasis]

Cool . Let's get rid of the $30 billion in subsidies fossil fuels get in Australia.

As usual your argument is based in la la land rather than reality.

Global fossil fuel subsidies reach $5.2 trillion, and $29 billion in Australia

IMF says fossil fuel subsidies in Australia amount to nearly $1,200 per person, or a total of $29 billion.

reneweconomy.com.au

Try looking back in this thread, I’ve already addressed this predictable myth.

 

[Sintiger]

Said every slavery advocate ever.

Oh dear

 

[DavidSSS]

Oh dear

Yeah, not worth it. He believes in liberty, but only as defined by Giardiasis.

DS