Australia Day - 26th January? | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Australia Day - 26th January?

Should Austrlalia Day be on the 26th of January?


  • Total voters
    42
  • Poll closed .

DavidSSS

Tiger Legend
Dec 11, 2017
10,523
17,874
Melbourne
You always have to try and divert don't you Lee?

What has happened to indigenous Australians since our forebears took over this country is disgusting and your excusing it using the "look over there, look what they did" strategy is similarly disgusting.

Disgusting, but typical unfortunately.

DS
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
33,186
11,546
Melbourne
Never said you did, you just did your usual diversion tactic.

Get back in my box? Yeah, free speech is only for those you agree with, I get it.
Do you always have to make it about ME? You're such an incorrigible *smile* lefty.

This thread is full of people raising little-known facts. Someone else took a comment on the origin of the public holiday and drew a link to Aboriginal massacres. I just provided a link demonstrating that many massacres were carried out by Aboriginals themselves, which probably comes as a shock to some.

There were only around 1000-2000 settlers in Queensland at that time with the bulk in Brisbane.

Huts were usually made with barricaded windows and doors against Indigenous attack. Others describe the standard windows as ‘port holes’ that shut like the hatch of a ship. Walls were generally pierced with augur holes to shoot the blacks if they made a raid.

"The women practiced at targets with firearms, and the men would ride home with a sinking feeling in their hearts, fearing for their wives and children. Often I heard father describe how each evening coming in from the run, he used in cold fear to mount the hill overlooking the humpy, and draw free breath when he saw it lying quiet and unharmed."
https://epress.lib.uts.edu.au/journals/index.php/mcs/article/view/4218/4491

Such was life in Australia at the time.

Always happy to entertain a history discussion. I put it to you that it's you who is deflecting.
 
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tigerman

It's Tiger Time
Mar 17, 2003
24,150
19,618
There are plenty of sources that state the Native Police embraced their work with relish. Think about those numbers - 24K the low estimate for the Queensland Native Police alone.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austr... 40,000 Indigenous,settlers died in the wars.

That doesn't leave all that many for the white settlers.

As someone else said, if people want to shine a light, tell the whole story warts and all and not just the bits that suit. Not sure it will make anyone feel better, although the people in the article wanted the story told. There are now as many people identifying as indigenous as at the time of the First Fleet, so perhaps the key to getting Aboriginals aboard is for them to see themselves as survivors rather than victims... similar to the early convicts.
There's a bit of a contradiction on how many were killed.

"If you examine Australian history, you can see that the brutality of ongoing invasion and colonisation fits in this definition of genocide in several ways. Firstly, the killing members of the group, if you look at the work of Professor Lyndall Ryan and her research team has found that there were at least 270 frontier massacres over 140 years of Australian history, as part of a state-sanctioned and organised attempts to eradicate First Nations people (3). For Ryan’s work, a massacre is defined as the deliberate killing of six or more defenceless people in one operation. If you investigate some of these massacres in depth you can see how systematic they were. Ryan’s work is in no means comprehensive as many massacres were not documented and many others covered up. Because of colonial genocidal actions like state-sanctioned massacres, the First Nations population went from an estimated 1-1.5 million before invasion to less than 100,000 by the early 1900s (4)."

 
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LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
33,186
11,546
Melbourne
There's a bit of a contradiction on how many were killed.

"If you examine Australian history, you can see that the brutality of ongoing invasion and colonisation fits in this definition of genocide in several ways. Firstly, the killing members of the group, if you look at the work of Professor Lyndall Ryan and her research team has found that there were at least 270 frontier massacres over 140 years of Australian history, as part of a state-sanctioned and organised attempts to eradicate First Nations people (3). For Ryan’s work, a massacre is defined as the deliberate killing of six or more defenceless people in one operation. If you investigate some of these massacres in depth you can see how systematic they were. Ryan’s work is in no means comprehensive as many massacres were not documented and many others covered up. Because of colonial genocidal actions like state-sanctioned massacres, the First Nations population went from an estimated 1-1.5 million before invasion to less than 100,000 by the early 1900s (4)."

Genocide is a controversial term. You won't find many historians in agreeance, although their number is rising. I dare suggest if that had been the aim, they would've succeeded.

The Cambridge History of Australia (2013) combines the efforts of 70 historians over two volumes and 1500 pages. The word 'genocide' does not appear.

99223.jpg
 
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MD Jazz

Don't understand football? Talk to the hand.
Feb 3, 2017
13,329
13,711
The modern left just doesn't understand that burying indigenous infants up to their necks then knocking their heads off was all fine and dandy back in the day.

It is unfair of the left to judge historical norms like rape, murder, genocide, enslavement and theft through a modern prism.
Yeh, that's what I was referring to. Remarkable any blackfellas survived. How about we find the whities ancestors and get some payback?
 

LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
33,186
11,546
Melbourne
Calling them wars might be a bit of a stretch.
It's not traditional history but has become quite fashionable these days. Some activists want the dead recognised as fallen soldiers.

State government asks if Anzac Day should recognise Aborigines attacked by early settlers (paywalled)​


THE state government says it has ruled out recognising Aborigines who were killed fighting white settlers in ‘frontier conflicts’ on Anzac Day despite commissioning a survey asking Victorians if they supported move.

The Sunday Herald Sun can reveal that Premier Daniel Andrews’ department has surveyed people to see if the so-called “frontier wars” should be marked at the nation’s most important war commemoration event.

The survey by the Premier’s department quizzed Victorians on their participation in and attitudes towards war commemorations across a broad range of issues, including whether there was “interest in recognition of the frontier conflicts as part of Anzac and Remembrance Day commemorative activities’’.
 

AngryAnt

Tiger Legend
Nov 25, 2004
27,017
14,792
Very common ploy by colonial regimes to divide and conquer - use people from different areas to kill/subjugate others. Happened Dutch East Indies, in Latin America, in British India and no doubt in other colonised areas.

It's just another aspect of the genocidal activities that many colonial regimes executed.
 
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Djevv

Tiger Champion
Feb 11, 2005
3,091
252
NT
www.youtube.com
Why are invasion day protests anti Australian ?
Words and phrases like 'decolonise' and 'abolish the day' and 'abolish Australia' seem to me to make the claim that Australia should not exist due to its chequered colonial past. To me Australia day is about celebrating what is good about the place and promoting a spirit of unity.

I hasten to add they have every right to protest and say as they please but they annoy the hell out of me!
 

Sintiger

Tiger Legend
Aug 11, 2010
18,199
17,593
Camberwell
Words and phrases like 'decolonise' and 'abolish the day' and 'abolish Australia' seem to me to make the claim that Australia should not exist due to its chequered colonial past. To me Australia day is about celebrating what is good about the place and promoting a spirit of unity.

I hasten to add they have every right to protest and say as they please but they annoy the hell out of me!
The views may not be what some people agree with or want to hear but to say they are anti Australian is just plain wrong.
 

DavidSSS

Tiger Legend
Dec 11, 2017
10,523
17,874
Melbourne
Words and phrases like 'decolonise' and 'abolish the day' and 'abolish Australia' seem to me to make the claim that Australia should not exist due to its chequered colonial past. To me Australia day is about celebrating what is good about the place and promoting a spirit of unity.

I hasten to add they have every right to protest and say as they please but they annoy the hell out of me!

I was at the Invasion Day demo on Tuesday, nowhere, absolutely nowhere, did I see anyone calling for Australia to be abolished. I'm sure there would be some social media with some slogan like this, but everything is somewhere on social media. At the demo: no.

Abolish Australia Day, or at least shift it when we deserve to shift it as Stan Grant recently wrote, yes. Haven't seen any references to decolonisation either, after all, as a settler colony with a majority settlers, decolonisation has no meaning.

DS
 
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glantone

dog at the footy, punt rd end
Jun 5, 2007
1,386
433
...... To me Australia day is about celebrating what is good about the place and promoting a spirit of unity.

I hasten to add they have every right to protest and say as they please but they annoy the hell out of me!

The indigenous Australians are the conquered. To expect the conquered to celebrate the very day that symbolically marks their subjugation and all of the actual *smile* that followed no matter how much governments in our life time have since tried to right wrongs is at best denial, from my pov.

Do Northern Irish Catholics celebrate the 12th July Orange Walk or Indigenous Americans celebrate en masse Thanks Giving? Should they?Why would Indigenous Australians be the exception?

Who would celebrate losing everything? The whole thing's bogus. It’s so stupid.
 
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Djevv

Tiger Champion
Feb 11, 2005
3,091
252
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The views may not be what some people agree with or want to hear but to say they are anti Australian is just plain wrong.
Just answering a few posts here.

The day is not about celebrating colonialism or invasions its about celebrating winning the lottery of life living in Australia. Modern Australia is composed of the original inhabitants and the boat people who came afterwards. That's why it seems appropriate to me to celebrate on Jan 26th.

Maybe we need another national holiday to celebrate our indigenous heritage?

Sin the messages I highlighted are objectively anti-Australian. But tbh its a few days ago and I am over it.