5 years ago - A decision in hindsight

[pahoffm]

I watched both games this evening -

Tigers V Crows

&

Dogs V Hawks

I cast my mind back to when we appointed a new coach nearly 5 years ago and asked myself the question - had we had taken Eade instead of Wallace could that team in red white and blue that anihilated the Hawks tonight and is now a real flag contender - could - just could they have been dressed in Yellow and Black?

Eade's brand of football - his desire to draft and trade good players - his player development - could that have happened at Richmond instead of the Western Bulldogs?

It is all hypothetical and I don't begrudge the Doggies one bit (after all their last premiership was the same year I was born - and I'm an old fart) but wouldn't it be fantastic to see a Tiger team play like the Doggies played tonight?

"They say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one........"

I'll tell you why there would not have been a difference.

When Eade stepped into Footscray in 2005, he stepped into a club that had an infrastructure, including a stable recruiting department. There was a core of hardened recruiting professionals at the Bullies that we never had. And a stable football department too.
The may have discontinued Rohde's contract as coach, but they had most other things needed to develop juniors. Also note that the Western Oval refurbishment has been completed some time ago. Ours is still yet to start.

Wallace, and he wasn't my preferred choice, did not have the luxury of any infrastructure within the football department of the RFC. There was no recruiting department. It had all been lost in the haemorrage of Clinton Casey's deficits. No junior development either.

So, the decision on Eade over Wallace itself, I believe, wouldn't have made that bigger difference.

But now, with better finance, facilities & infrastructure - recruiting & development - our next coach will have alot more going for him.

 

[IrockZ]

I'll tell you why there would not have been a difference.

When Eade stepped into Footscray in 2005, he stepped into a club that had an infrastructure, including a stable recruiting department. There was a core of hardened recruiting professionals at the Bullies that we never had. And a stable football department too.
The may have discontinued Rohde's contract as coach, but they had most other things needed to develop juniors. Also note that the Western Oval refurbishment has been completed some time ago. Ours is still yet to start.

Wallace, and he wasn't my preferred choice, did not have the luxury of any infrastructure within the football department of the RFC. There was no recruiting department. It had all been lost in the haemorrage of Clinton Casey's deficits. No junior development either.

So, the decision on Eade over Wallace itself, I believe, wouldn't have made that bigger difference.

But now, with better finance, facilities & infrastructure - recruiting & development - our next coach will have alot more going for him.

Eade was cheaper so maybe we could of improved our other areas quicker instead of giving it all to the salesman and being left with 5c for recruiting.

 

[Tango]

thats all icing on the cake and excuses phantom
there is still no reason why we kept trading picks and recruiting certain types of players - "small athletes" and run and carry flankers
when clearly regardless of our finances and development of juniors and all the other crap if we had of kept our picks and drafted footballers with height and skill and played them at the expense of some of our HIGH profile individual prima donnas....
trained harder in the gym and got fitter over the summer, and played disciplined team orientated footy we would be in far better shape than we are now
wallace was a mistake and a *smile* artist who has never accepted any responsibility

There is no reason why a team cannot become one of the fittest and highest tacklers in the comp over a summer - "IF" you respect that part of the game more than cheap kicks, hanballs and meaningless stats.....

 

[Willo]

Eade was cheaper so maybe we could of improved our other areas quicker instead of giving it all to the salesman and being left with 5c for recruiting.

Fair point.
It was mentioned that Clarkson was happy to accept a lower wage and the extras (in lieu of his full wage) he was "allocated," enabled him to attract more (or better support staff).
TW kept the lot for himself.
Differing philosophies, but I guess one was a high profile coach and one a battler keen to get a coaching job. Different results as well.

 

[Bill James]

Lost a bet to a mate that Wallace would bet better than Eade. Lost it early, lost it hard. To be fair it was more on the basis that I didn't like Eade. Eade lost the plot towards the end of his tenure in Sydney. Maybe he has matured.

 

[doherz]

I watched both games this evening -

Tigers V Crows

&

Dogs V Hawks

I cast my mind back to when we appointed a new coach nearly 5 years ago and asked myself the question - had we had taken Eade instead of Wallace could that team in red white and blue that anihilated the Hawks tonight and is now a real flag contender - could - just could they have been dressed in Yellow and Black?

Eade's brand of football - his desire to draft and trade good players - his player development - could that have happened at Richmond instead of the Western Bulldogs?

It is all hypothetical and I don't begrudge the Doggies one bit (after all their last premiership was the same year I was born - and I'm an old fart) but wouldn't it be fantastic to see a Tiger team play like the Doggies played tonight?

"They say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one........"

Hard to tell - but i think our recruiting, development and general all round resourcing (or lack there of) is a big part of Wallace's failings and would have led Eade to early retirement also.

 

[mb64]

Wallace is responsible for the Bulldogs list, so he tells us.

And if we have any success in the next 5 years he'll be reponsible for that

 

[TakeAPunt]

And Wallace is quite simply a bulls..t artist, who was probably a very good tactical coach early on. He could not however build a list, and at Tigerland coached for himself and not to the benefit of the club.

I am ashamed of being one of his unabashed supporters when he first came. He really did turn the Bulldogs into the most fearsome unit in the game and should have won a flag. But he seemed to take a different approach with us and somehow made us softer and less team oriented.

Most clubs don't let "coaches", and coaches "only" build a list - the recruiting is part of a football department that researches, approves and rejects candiates based on criteria. This didn't happen at Richmond because our football department was a mess (or to sum up - consisted of Greg Miller in a compomised position). But hey - lets demonise the guy who did his best to make this club great again. In "hindsight" - he has failed - but his failure is also a reflection on the football department as a whole didn't the do the job nearly as well as other clubs.

But hey, it bloody fun to lynch coaches - at the very least, it stays consistent with the fan culture of the club. Very sad.

 

[RemoteTiger]

Most clubs don't let "coaches", and coaches "only" build a list - the recruiting is part of a football department that researches, approves and rejects candiates based on criteria. This didn't happen at Richmond because our football department was a mess (or to sum up - consisted of Greg Miller in a compomised position). But hey - lets demonise the guy who did his best to make this club great again. In "hindsight" - he has failed - but his failure is also a reflection on the football department as a whole didn't the do the job nearly as well as other clubs.

But hey, it bloody fun to lynch coaches - at the very least, it stays consistent with the fan culture of the club. Very sad.

I agree with the fact that our Footy Dept was *smile* poor - but the buck stops with the head coach - and if the head coach does not yell and scream for more money or resources into the footy department then he is not running the show properly. Wallace wanted all the money himself - and reckoned he and his mate Miller could do the job - time has proven him incorrect.

Over at the Bullies - if Phantom is right Eade inherited a great footy dept - from Rhodes and before him Wallace - so Wallace has experience in these structures but he did not introduce that here at the RFC. Therefore he must share a large portion of the blame - you are right he is not the total blame - there are others in the footy department who must also cop it on the chin - plus the faction fighting (if true) internal to the RFC must also be seen as responsible.

Its the coach who takes the applause for directing a team to a premiership therefore it is also the coach who should be seen as the director of failure too.....

 

[the claw]

I'll tell you why there would not have been a difference.

When Eade stepped into Footscray in 2005, he stepped into a club that had an infrastructure, including a stable recruiting department. There was a core of hardened recruiting professionals at the Bullies that we never had. And a stable football department too.
The may have discontinued Rohde's contract as coach, but they had most other things needed to develop juniors. Also note that the Western Oval refurbishment has been completed some time ago. Ours is still yet to start.

Wallace, and he wasn't my preferred choice, did not have the luxury of any infrastructure within the football department of the RFC. There was no recruiting department. It had all been lost in the haemorrage of Clinton Casey's deficits. No junior development either.

So, the decision on Eade over Wallace itself, I believe, wouldn't have made that bigger difference.

But now, with better finance, facilities & infrastructure - recruiting & development - our next coach will have alot more going for him.

hmm very good post and agree. still remember the debates on here about getting list management and recruiting right.
the gaping holes in the list and the processes we werent going thru had me going on about these things at the end of 02.

just on eade and the players drafted to the dogs in his time or players who are still there since the 04 draft. 04 griffen and williams. 05 morris higgins addison. 06 akermanis everitt hill lynch. 07 harbrow grant ward reid wood bouman okeefe callan hudson. 08 welsh cordy roughhead jones.

 

[Matiger]

Most clubs don't let "coaches", and coaches "only" build a list - the recruiting is part of a football department that researches, approves and rejects candiates based on criteria. This didn't happen at Richmond because our football department was a mess (or to sum up - consisted of Greg Miller in a compomised position). But hey - lets demonise the guy who did his best to make this club great again. In "hindsight" - he has failed - but his failure is also a reflection on the football department as a whole didn't the do the job nearly as well as other clubs.

But hey, it bloody fun to lynch coaches - at the very least, it stays consistent with the fan culture of the club. Very sad.

That is half the story Mr Punt. I couldnt agree more that Eade had a better football dept. and that made his job easier.

What you are not taking into account is Wallaces terrible game plan (or lack therof). His game plan was totally unsuited to the type of players we have.
But the most galling point is that he really seems to accept no responsibilty for this mess at all. Wallace tried to make himslef look good, why is it only now that we are playing our youngsters, and pensioning off players like Bowden Simmonds Pettifer McMahon.

He IS responsible for selection, even if not the whole recruiting department.

Wallace said alot of things, I will make this club great again may have been one of them (I dont rememeber him saying this directly but he would have said something along those lines) but it was his actions (coaching/selections) that went totally against that.

You are kidding if you think that Wallace should not get some stick on here for this mess. And you are kidding if you think this makes this club's supporter base sad. A few hard decisons, instead of his self serving ones, would have gone a long way for Wallace fnding respect here on this forum.

We WERE duped by a bulls..t artist. I think its sad you cant see that.l

 

[SpaceAce]

Perhaps we would have been far better off putting the fat paycheck that either Wallet or Rocket received into recruiting and development. Maybe gone for a cheap n nasty first year coach like a Clarko or Hardwick type.
Our biggest problem over the last four and a half years or even the last thirty years hasn't been the coach it's been the lack of professional system and funding of our recruitment and development.

If our yearlong review of everything football hasn't set up the systems and structures required to run a professional football club from now on going forward then you can bet your left one we will continue to chase ourselves round in circles until we disappear up our own irrelevance.

The first proof we will see over the next couple of months that we have changed things for the better is our coaching appointment.
If the board and footy department cave in to the K.B. get Sheedy circus then we're in deep proverbial.
If they follow correct procedures and appoint the best possible coach to grow and develop our team then maybe we will finally be a chance to take this club back up the ladder.

Excellent post mate, I totally agree! RFC's chief priority over the next couple of years must be the development of a culture of professionalism with respect to how the club is run. For example crucial areas such as the football department need to recieve adequate funding on a consistent basis. Additionally, the board needs to stand firm and make intelligent decisions, NOT be sucked in by hype and public pressure. Sheedy had his chance to come back to Richmond in 1998- This is when we really needed him. Instead he used Richmond as a bargaining chip to get a better deal with Essendon. Now he wants to help the club........what a joke!

 

[bullus_hit]

despite the vitriol directed at Wallace I don't believe he has set the club back to pre 2003 levels but he hasn't helped himself by neglecting key areas in list management - something which marked his Bulldogs days and and something which still haunts the Bullies to this day. I remember personally trawling through forums in 2003 trying to get an unbiased view of his former supporters and the one constant was his inability to develop taller players.

To some degree, I think he even avoided this shortcoming by continually opting for his bread and butter types, players who he knew he could manage and possibly get the best out of. With all the psychological testing that accompanies the draft, one wonders to what extent a coach's shortcomings can influence the results.

I have no doubt that players such as Franklin, Clark and Tippet were all placed in the too hard basket by Wallace and this ultimately led to others being selected who were clearly not addressing list needs. The likes of JON, Edwards and Tambling all seem to fit neatly into Wallace's comfort zone when it comes to player development yet were clearly not players who we could safely assume were the 'the best available'.

So in the wash-up, Wallace has opted for the easy route and as a result, has contributed to his own downfall. Given his experience with the Dogs, one would have hoped he had learnt a lesson or two but this has clearly not been the case. The Wallace legacy as I see it, will be dependant on how we address the gaping hole with our tall timber - sadly with GC17 coming in to the competition, a fair bit of luck will be required along the way.