A Preseason Preview - Part 1 of 16 - Richmond | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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A Preseason Preview - Part 1 of 16 - Richmond

Thoroughly enjoyed the read Phanto.
When you do the other poor souls preview (other clubs), any chance it can be on a comparative basis to the Tigers for more relevance? Side by side? Heck, even go all out and put your crystal balls on the table and predict probable results (pretty hard I know, but it could be fun to see what the diverse opinion here brings). :D
 
pharace said:
Thoroughly enjoyed the read Phanto. 
When you do the other poor souls preview (other clubs), any chance it can be on a comparative basis to the Tigers for more relevance?  Side by side?  Heck, even go all out and put your crystal balls on the table and predict probable results (pretty hard I know, but it could be fun to see what the diverse opinion here brings). :D

I'll do my best. Reckon I'll do Hawthorn on Friday.
 
sorry phanto you have got the ruck wrongboth simmonds and knobel in their prime stafford old ie me thinks you are robbing peter to pay paul.the worrying thing with the rucks there are no juniors.
 
Just a big thanks for the effort, Phanto.

A great read - looking forward to seeing how the other teams pan out.

I reckon we're in for some surprises. It will also be interesting to see if those teams that have the most players peaking in their various age and height brackets are the most successful teams on the field.
 
Phantom said:
Hi all,
Now that the various drafts are over and all clubs have secured their lists, I intend to look at each one of the lists to see how each stack up. Starting from the bottom my first will be the Tigers, slowly working my way through all the teams up to Port Adelaide. The Tigers will probably be my most indepth as it is the club I know most about. Already I've noticed some strange happenings or skews on some teams' lists. Also please excuse some of the formatting again. It is difficult to cut and paste a word document containing tables onto this message board. Anyway heregoes.

Richmond – Tigers rebuild, but there’s some way to go.

The Tigers have seemingly got themselves back on course in 2005. Yet this statement will become more credible once the team actually starts to perform consistently on the field. A new coach in Terry Wallace. New assistants in Brian Royal, David King and Steve Alessio. Wheadon has been retained but in a new role. The list has also been revised to include 10 new players on the senior list, on top of the addition of 9 or 10 last year, depending on how you deem Moore’s movement onto the senior list.

Surname Ht Wt Age
Stafford 203 105 30
Knobel 202 102 25 New
Pattison 198 90 19 New
Richardson196 105 30
Simmonds196 97 27 New
Hall 196 97 24
Archibald 194 91 19
Gaspar 193 90 29
Morrison 193 90 24
Schulz 193 92 20
McGuane 192 77 18 New
Limbach 192 77 17 New
Thursfield191 76 19 Rookie
Graham 190 90 32 New
Kellaway 190 90 29
Moore 190 86 21
Campbell 189 88 32
Bowden 188 90 27
Tuck 188 89 23
Deledio 188 81 18 New
Coughlan 187 88 23
Jackson 187 87 19
Polo 187 78 18 New
Johnson 186 86 27
Hilton 186 90 26
Tivendale 186 86 26
Pettifer 184 84 23
Hyde 184 84 22
Gilmour 184 77 19
Roach 184 78 19
Brown 183 80 27
Newman 183 84 23
Meyer 183 70 18 New
Raines 181 76 19
Tambling 181 74 18 New
Chaffey 180 82 28
Hartigan 180 74 20
Foley 177 71 20 Rookie
Krakouer 174 77 22
Rodan 171 82 21

To get a better analysis of the entire Tiger list let’s look at the spread of their players.
Twilight = 28+yo
Prime = 25-27yo
Development = 22-24yo
Junior = 18-21yo

<180 Small Runners
Twilight: 0
Prime: 0
Development: Krakouer 22,
Junior: Rodan 21, Foley 20,

180-184 Smaller Mediums
Twilight: Chaffey 28
Prime: Brown 27,
Development: Pettifer 23, Newman 23, Hyde 22,
Junior: Hartigan 20, Gilmour 19, Roach 19, Meyer 18, Raines 18, Tambling 18,

185-189 Taller Mediums
Twilight: Campbell 32
Prime: Bowden 27, Johnson 27, Hilton 26, Tivendale 26,
Development: Tuck 23, Coughlan 23,
Junior: Jackson 19, Deledio 18, Polo 18,

190-194 Mobile Key Position
Twilight: Graham 32, Gaspar 29, Kellaway 29
Prime: 0
Development: Morrison 24,
Junior: Moore 21, Schulz 20, Archibald 19, Thursfield 19, McGuane 18, Limbach 17,

195-199 Key Position/ Ruck
Twilight: Richardson 30
Prime: Simmonds 27,
Development: Hall 24,
Junior: Pattison 19,

200+ Ruck
Twilight: Stafford 30
Prime: Knobel 25,
Development: 0
Junior: 0

The previous list gives a spread of the reasonable distribution of a playing list over its varying ages and heights. It gives an indication of the evolution and development of a football list and where potential weaknesses exist. We will use this list to analyse other teams as well. The ages of these players are based on what age, I believe, they will be for most of the 2005 season.

From the spread you can see that tends to be 2 main groups at Tigerland. The first group is either in the twilight phase of their careers, 28yo+, or just about to move into the twilight phase, 27yo. The second group is in the junior phase of their careers, equal to or less than 21yo. The area in between, the development and prime age groups, ie 22-27yo, looks thin. This is especially evident in the area of prime age running players. The tigers will be forced to play boys from the junior group to make up for their dearth in prime runners and mobile key position players.

Another device to analyse is putting down the list in team order to see how many or what positions can be covered when injuries occur.

B: Chaffey 28 Gaspar 29 Kellaway 29
  Newman 23 Hall 24   Moore 20
                Thursfield19

HB: Bowden 27 Graham 32 Hyde 22
      Hilton 26 Schulz 20 Polo 18
              McGuane 18

C: Jackson 19 Coughlan 23 Tivendale 26
Deledio 18 Hartigan 20 Tuck 23

HF: Campbell 32 Simmonds27 Pettifer 23
Roach 19 Morrison 24 Raines 18
Meyer 18 Pattison 19

F: Stafford 30 Richardson30 Krahouer 22
Archibald 19 Limbach 17 Rodan 21

R: Knobel 25 Johnson 27 Brown 27
           Tambling 18 Foley 20
    Gilmour 19

The back half looks reasonably covered for injury. However once you move onto the centre line, the forward half and the ruck it is quite clear that there is a definite lack of experience if the team is tested by injuries to its front line players.

Conclusion:
Using history as a predicting tool, the last time Tigerland went through such a big turnover of players was the 1992/1993 seasons. In 1993, John Northey took over the reins and drastically reformed the playing list. New names such as Duncan Kellaway, Jamie Tape, Matthew Richardson, Matthew Rogers and others were given a try. Some succeeded, others didn’t.
In 1993 the Tigers had a big Pre-season making, but losing by 10 points to Essendon, the Final of the Wizrad Cup equivalent. However the length of the season proper found them out. Already in late 2004 the Tigers, under Wallace, have been training very intensely. I predict that they will come out of the blocks with the same intensity, but the length of the season proper will find old legs, and some inexperienced ones, out.

( Edit: I would be grateful for your honest comments re this analysis, either in style, content or accuracy.)
Good post Phanto but I have this theory that with a substantially larger mass of skilled and committed players than before and with a greatly improved coaching staff plus a better qualified technician in charge of forward planning,that our progress can be achieved more quickly, than it would be if we just had to rely upon the separate parts.???
The goal to goal line could be Hall, Bowden,Coughlan,Richo and Shultz. Why play Bowden on a hbf when he is our best performed chb since Des Rowe?
Imo our year all depends on our midfield.This will be Coughlans 3 rd big year,potentially. Also Roden,Hyde, Krakour, and Gilmour all looked to have improved dramatically. Add in our recruits for say 6 games min from Deledio, Raines and Tambling at least while of our mainstays allowing pehaps for only Cambell and Stafford? to go backwards..
Throw in some aggression from Simmons and Knobel and I really believe that you are being pessimistic.?s
 
pharace said:
Thoroughly enjoyed the read Phanto. 
When you do the other poor souls preview (other clubs), any chance it can be on a comparative basis to the Tigers for more relevance?  Side by side?  Heck, even go all out and put your crystal balls on the table and predict probable results (pretty hard I know, but it could be fun to see what the diverse opinion here brings). :D
I think that's a great idea. Will add more relevance to the Tiges thus make it a more interesting read. Have fun Phanto. :)
 
thanks phanto for this insight into the playing group one query is your hgft wgt listings appear to be from 2004 any idea when the boys will have theif official weigh ins for season 2005 as has been reported that some of the youngsters have grown up a bit and some of the old fells r.e richo have droppped a bit
 
Kaelan said:
thanks phanto for this insight into the playing group one query is your hgft wgt listings appear to be from 2004 any idea when the boys will have theif official weigh ins for season 2005 as has been reported that some of the youngsters have grown up a bit and some of the old fells r.e richo have droppped a bit

Yes, you're right on the ball. Until the AFL update the weight listings I can only go by the last published lists, which were 2004.
 
Phantom said:
( Edit: I would be grateful for your honest comments re this analysis, either in style, content or accuracy.)

Phantom, it is with great interest that I read another 'pre-season' review from you - This time Richmond.
How many games do you think we will win? / Position ladder?

The breakdown of the player list & categories reveals some interesting information. The Frawely Regime set back Richmond 5 years (the length of TW's contract).

For Richmond to taste success, they have to 'nail it' with the 2004 Nat. Draft, included another successful draft in 2005. Within the list of players like Hartigan, Jackson, Roach, Raines, Gilmour & Archibald, at least 4/6 must develop into 5-10 players. Another four from last years draft and again, 4 from 2005.

My theory reads like this..."For every 10 draftees selected, teams must achieve a strike rate of greater than 33% (players who will play for 5-10 years). This must be achieved consecutively for three (3) years, to enhance the 're-building' phase."

There have been many examples of this, but none better than the "baby" bombers from 77 - 81. This batch produced players that would give Essendon premierships in 84 & 85. The bomber's re invented the wheel again with shrewd recruiting between 90 - 92 - Followed by a premiership in 93. And again, between 97 - 99, smart recruiting 'consequetively' got them another flag in 2000.

Recruitment is the key...it's a "skill" and if you dont understand it, you wont succeed!
 
Mick McGuane's thoughts (footyvoice.com.au)

Tigers
Pride and patience

Last year:
16th position
4 wins, 12 loses

Can Terry Wallace make the Tigers a force again, or will it be a 3-5 year project?

Tiger supporters will have to be patient. But they will be entertained by watching the young Tigers play a ‘run and carry’ brand of football. They will play with a lot of freedom, risk taking and energy. Theirs will be a bolder playing style with lots of attacking footy. That is the Wallace way.

The Tigers are young, and with youth will come fluctuating performances. But youth also generates great enthusiasm. The likes of Richard Tambling and Brett Deledio will be energetic and brave. They will try things and not be restricted, allowing their natural football instincts to come to the fore. This will have a positive effect on the senior players.

The current scenario at Richmond reminds me so much of what Leigh Matthews had to do at Collingwood in 1987. In that year Matthews tried 41 players. By 1988 his list had played in two finals. This proves that a coach can fast-track talent with the right training, conditioning and style of play.

Despite a promising start, the Tigers were ordinary on too many occasions last season. The team was adequate in some areas, such as clearances. They were ranked eight in the league and this figure would have improved further had Mark Coughlan played more than his seven games. Kane Johnson, Andrew Krakouer, Nathan Brown and Wayne Campbell are all noted ball-winners and can get first hands on the footy. The problem in 2004 was what happened after the first possession.

The Tigers kicked poorly with one in four kicks missing the intended target. This may be as a direct result of the players being too Matthew Richardson conscious. Opposition defenders always gravitate to the Richardson area or contest. From the resultant spillages, the team looked to manufacture ‘hard goals’, relying on Krakouer or Brown to weave some magic.

The recruitment of Troy Simmonds is both timely (given the departure of Ottens) and clever. The arrival of Knobel gives Wallace greatly flexibility with his talls. Knobel in the ruck, allows Stafford and Simmonds to play close to goal, and frees up Richardson. Simmonds can provide a strong marking option for long kicks to the forward as his 35 goals and 96 marks (22 contested) at Fremantle demonstrates. He will be a very valuable addition to the Tigers.

With a ‘run and carry’ mentality, the Tigers will increase the supply to their forwards. Last season Richmond had the 3rd lowest return from inside their 50-metre entries. They only averaged 46 entries compared to 56 for the Lions. To make matters worse they allowed the opposition an average of 54 entries per game. In the 12 games lost, the Tigers became ‘handball happy’ which made it difficult for the forwards to read the play and lead with purpose.

On paper, the Tigers have the side that will be extremely competitive from the centre forward, but it is their backline that will need to stand tall. This is where Wallace’s tactical nous will be tested.

http://footyvoice.com.au/ourvoice/corrArticle.php?corr_id=15
 
This side offers a myraid possible permutations in 2005 with an all new coaching staff, inevitable new game plan and evolving style, structure and personnel. ATM I'm entirely satisfied with the succession planning of the past two drafts and believe that the tigers are two drafts into a ...(ahem)... five year plan.

They are well placed for a rapid revival. This is one of the reasons Wallet selected the Y and B over the Hawks.

The Backs

The backline in 2004 suffered through injuries to D.Gaspar, B.Ottens and G.Stafford. Ray Hall was doing well for the first eight or so games at full back before injury forced him to be used as a stop gap up the ground. Notwithstanding the injuries already sustained in this preseason, the Tiges have abundant personnel to match the Carltons of this world for KPPs and are far too strong in this department for Footscray or North Melbourne.

The minor cracks in the backline are opened by the need to fill the ravines up the park.

If C.Newman, J.Bowden, K.Johnson (changing), B.Hartigan, D.Jackson, and C.Hyde were free to take suitable positions as backs, they along with J.Shulz, D.Gaspar, R.Hall, A.Kellway and M.Graham, they would comprise a solid defensive septet.

But the cream of this crop will be required to fill holes up the ground. Basically the leftovers will be used back. A 2004 midfield that was one of the worst of recent times has already been depleted by the loss of its emerging first rover. One of the group defender will be required to offset his loss, probably Hartigan at least part time. K.Johnson will not get much rest from midfield duties while Mark Coughlan completes his rehab starting then changing forward.

C.Hyde will continue his development as an immature starting midfielder instead of taking the path through a defensive role like Tyson Edwards or Jared Crouch. The cost to Hyde's development is unclear but not so his cost to the defence. Paul Chapman, Alan Didak, Graham Johncock, Ashley McGrath et al would have been roles suited to Hyde but he'll have tougher tasks.

Hall, who is resuming from a hip injury, should have been first choice full back in 2005 following his good form there in 2004 but it appears he has much to prove to the new coaching panel. Schulz's injury affords him the opportunity. (Perhaps he is due in Sydney next year.)

Newman and Jackson look like the players most likely to be left back for the bulk of the season and it appears that Tivendale will be played back (a likely failure IMO). It's not clear as yet whether A.Kellaway, M.Graham or D.Jackson will play #3 back. Probably all at different times. You've got to wonder why Mark Graham was recruited if not to play on the third tallest forward. That leaves A.Kellaway at the city oval.

It would have been nice to see J.Bowden continue his fine 2004 form at CHB but Terry has made it clear that Joel is required in other roles, probably midfield changing back. From the glimpse of J.Schulz I've had agin the Pies, I'm confident he can pass the CHB test on his way up the ground. He provided solid support for Gaspar against Rocca while casually pantsing C.Cloke (his senior by six months).

From what I've been able to glean from TW's comments and the preseason games we'll have a backline that looks a bit like this for the first half of the season. (I expect Schulz to be ready to resume in some form by round 12-16.)

FB-

  • FB C.Newman...R.Hall.....M.Graham
  • HB D.Jackson..D.Gaspar...CHANGE
  • Bowden, Hartigan maybe Johnson to change back. G.Tivendale, M.Chaffey or A.Kellaway interchange.

  • FB C.Newman...R.Hall.....D.Jackson
  • HB CHANGE.....D.Gaspar...G.Tivendale
  • Bowden, Hartigan maybe Johnson to change back. A.Kellaway, M.Graham or M.Chaffey interchange

We know TW rolls a lot of guys through the midfield but that looks about the shape of the backiline depending on matchups.