Brett Rosebury-Umpire | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Brett Rosebury-Umpire

graystar1

Tiger Legend
Apr 28, 2004
6,077
661
From the site that cannot be mentioned today explains quite a bit on how difficult it is to umpire today.
Just a snippet, but good to read.
1626995861057.png
 

DavidSSS

Tiger Legend
Dec 11, 2017
6,705
8,676
Melbourne
He has added a bit of mayo there but the number of tackles is much higher:

Tackles per game 1999-2021 R18.jpg

But you have to ask why tackles are higher. I'm not sure exactly how they count these but in the old days the umpires would call a stoppage once a pack started to form, now they leave it for half an hour. Plus, do they count the second player coming in to tackle as another tackle?

I reckon a fair amount of the issue here, as with a number of the other issues, is how they adjudicate the game now - letting a lot of infringements go to keep the free kick numbers down, not penalising holding the man most of the time etc.

This is a problem the AFL have brought upon themselves.

DS
 
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AngryAnt

Tiger Legend
Nov 25, 2004
24,278
10,209
Whichever way you measure it that's a huge increase in tackles, which personally I don't mind as I love tackles.
 

Baloo

Delisted Free Agent
Nov 8, 2005
40,435
11,321
Whichever way you measure it that's a huge increase in tackles, which personally I don't mind as I love tackles.

tackles or tackle? Asking for a friend who also lived in Indonesia for a while.
 
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zippadeee

Tiger Legend
Oct 8, 2004
39,026
14,493
How hard is it?
There's 3 flogs on the ground now.
'If the player gets tackled and dosent release the ball by foot or hand will be penalized'
There's 20 throws a game that go without been penalized.
In the back never gets paid anymore.
One umpire gives a player 20 seconds to release the ball while others ping the player going for the ball immediately.
Umpiring is driving people away from the game
 

DavidSSS

Tiger Legend
Dec 11, 2017
6,705
8,676
Melbourne
Whichever way you measure it that's a huge increase in tackles, which personally I don't mind as I love tackles.

I don't mind tackling, I just get shitty with the number of players held before they have the ball.

Throws need to be reined in too, a more strict adjudication of the handball rules, and some consistency (yeah, dream on) is sorely needed.

And, FFS, call a ball up as the pack forms, the game flowed so so much better when they did that years ago.

DS
 
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AngryAnt

Tiger Legend
Nov 25, 2004
24,278
10,209
If it's too hot, get out of the kitchen.

Or is this remark from an experienced umpire a veiled criticism of the AFL hierarchy?

Sounds like an ump expressing the reality of the situation to me.
 
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AngryAnt

Tiger Legend
Nov 25, 2004
24,278
10,209
I don't mind tackling, I just get shitty with the number of players held before they have the ball.

Throws need to be reined in too, a more strict adjudication of the handball rules, and some consistency (yeah, dream on) is sorely needed.

And, FFS, call a ball up as the pack forms, the game flowed so so much better when they did that years ago.

DS

yeah, except these days a ball-up can result in another ball-up, as players will get over to the contest. Holding is a tough one... nothing worse than a random hold being paid to a forward 50 metres off the ball.

I remember umps in the old days picking out a random free kick to a defender if there were too many ball ups in a muddy forward pocket.
 
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DavidSSS

Tiger Legend
Dec 11, 2017
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Melbourne
yeah, except these days a ball-up can result in another ball-up, as players will get over to the contest. Holding is a tough one... nothing worse than a random hold being paid to a forward 50 metres off the ball.

I remember umps in the old days picking out a random free kick to a defender if there were too many ball ups in a muddy forward pocket.

Aah, but the answer to the random hold free being paid, is to stop paying the random frees and pay every free that is observed by the umpires.

It is crystal clear that the umpires are not paying every infringement that they see, the number of players held at the centre bounce, even before the ball is bounced, is absurd. If you want the game to flow, allow the good rovers to go for the ball without being impeded by an illegal hold. Simples.

DS
 
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BrisTiger24

Chimp's Love of the Tiger
Oct 16, 2003
13,464
3,318
Brisbane
He has added a bit of mayo there but the number of tackles is much higher:

View attachment 12876

But you have to ask why tackles are higher. I'm not sure exactly how they count these but in the old days the umpires would call a stoppage once a pack started to form, now they leave it for half an hour. Plus, do they count the second player coming in to tackle as another tackle?

I reckon a fair amount of the issue here, as with a number of the other issues, is how they adjudicate the game now - letting a lot of infringements go to keep the free kick numbers down, not penalising holding the man most of the time etc.

This is a problem the AFL have brought upon themselves.

DS
But dropping off in the last few years in what has to be the SHocking effect...
 

AngryAnt

Tiger Legend
Nov 25, 2004
24,278
10,209
Aah, but the answer to the random hold free being paid, is to stop paying the random frees and pay every free that is observed by the umpires.

No, I'm talking the good old days when the umps made up a free kick to break up congestion. And that was fine.

They should pay the first free seen, forget about every free. This is what they do in the round ball game - first free kick is paid, if someone breaks someone's leg after that then they get a red card but the previous free stands.
 

DavidSSS

Tiger Legend
Dec 11, 2017
6,705
8,676
Melbourne
No, I'm talking the good old days when the umps made up a free kick to break up congestion. And that was fine.

They should pay the first free seen, forget about every free. This is what they do in the round ball game - first free kick is paid, if someone breaks someone's leg after that then they get a red card but the previous free stands.

Nah, those defensive clearing frees were all there ;). Actually, the funny thing about it is, since I do remember the old days, whenever I hear the whistle close to goal I expect a defensive clearing free, but these days it seems to go more to the forwards (except Jack and Tom, they get reamed).

Pay the first free seen, wow, that ain't difficult is it? Just seems very difficult for AFL umpires. It is the only way, then if the players get stroppy the umpire just says "I paid the first infringement I saw". Much simpler than the current approach where the umpires, under instruction to reduce the number of free kicks given, either wait until it is so ridiculous that they have to pay a free, or, they ball it up which creates more congestion than a quick free kick. Neither of the current strategies reduces the number of stoppages which is meant to be something they want, nor does it reduce the congestion, quite the contrary.

DS
 
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St Kevin

Tiger Legend
Apr 1, 2014
5,629
2,917
I think the bigger issue is how long they take to throw the ball up following a tackle, largely due to the ruck nomination rule. This means more numbers flow around the ball, particularly defensively.

Eliminate the need for ruckmen to put their hands up like they're in primary school, allow two players to compete in the ruck (if a third jumps in, blow for a free kick) and the umpires could throw the ball up quicker and not allow congestion to build around the contest.
 
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The Big Richo

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 19, 2010
6,003
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The home of Dusty
Eliminate the need for ruckmen to put their hands up like they're in primary school, allow two players to compete in the ruck (if a third jumps in, blow for a free kick) and the umpires could throw the ball up quicker and not allow congestion to build around the contest.

How do you then stop other mids from bodying the ruckman and stopping them getting at the ball?
 
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The Big Richo

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 19, 2010
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The home of Dusty
Simple, enforce the rules. That would be an illegal shepherd.

DS

It would be illegal on a ruckman but it's not illegal to put body on another player around a stoppage.

And if you don't nominate then how do you tell?

The only way it could possibly work would be to change the rules so that no player was allowed to make contact with anyone around a stoppage, and that would be a very strange rule.
 

The Big Richo

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 19, 2010
6,003
8,480
The home of Dusty
But you have to ask why tackles are higher.

I think tackles are higher because there is more emphasis placed on it now, players have better techniques, more strength and have the fitness to cover more of the ground for more of the game.

If you have 30 players in the 50 metre arcs then it stands to reason there is going to be less space and more tackles. Nowadays players can get up and back and do that all game.

In 1989 Allan Jeans asked Hawthorn to tackle like they never had in their lives and they had less than 50. If you did that now you'd be on St Kilda beach at 5:30am the next day.
 
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No left foot

Tiger Cub
Aug 30, 2020
37
77
How do you then stop other mids from bodying the ruckman and stopping them getting at the ball?
Have 4 players from each team nominate before the game that they will contest in the ruck. No-one else permitted. Those 4 players are then indemnified from getting reported in any ruck contest, except against the opposing teams ruck. They are then clear to clock any shortarse who gets in their way at a ball up or boundary throw in.
 
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