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Coronavirus

Coburgtiger

Tiger Champion
May 7, 2012
3,414
1,764
Are you too daft to infer "Leaving aside the suffering of the populace due to being confined to their homes..."

Or do you just enjoy being a *smile*?


No idea what either one of you are carrying on about.

Just pointing out that these decisions have to be more than economic.

Interesting that quarantine failures in Victoria are Dan's fault. But quarantine failures in Adelaide are the traveller's fault.

When in reality, both are the virus's fault, and everyone is doing admirably given the challenge.

But blaming the victim is standard 'rightism'. That's the word we're using now, isn't it? Try and make opinion seem like a religious following?
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
28,828
6,676
Melbourne
Just pointing out that these decisions have to be more than economic.

Interesting that quarantine failures in Victoria are Dan's fault. But quarantine failures in Adelaide are the traveller's fault.

When in reality, both are the virus's fault, and everyone is doing admirably given the challenge.

But blaming the victim is standard 'rightism'. That's the word we're using now, isn't it? Try and make opinion seem like a religious following?
Funny I get raked over the *smile* coals for mentioning left/right and here's you insisting on it post after *smile* post. Have a look in your own backyards for once.

But since you mentioned it - Dan insisted on dodgy rented security which carelessly and negligently turned the virus loose on the public. The ADF and police didn't fail in their duty in South Australia.

Our international borders should be the front lines - not hotels in the middle of capital cities. Yes, I believe Morrison should've enforced this and said so at the time. But that's not the way things are done. Might be time for a rethink on just what citizenship entitles you to in an emergency such as this.
 
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Coburgtiger

Tiger Champion
May 7, 2012
3,414
1,764
Funny I get raked over the *smile* coals for mentioning left/right and here's you insisting on it post after *smile* post. Have a look in your own backyards for once.

But since you mentioned it - Dan insisted on dodgy rented security which carelessly and negligently turned the virus loose on the public. The ADF and police didn't fail in their duty in South Australia.

Our international borders should be the front lines - not hotels in the middle of capital cities. Yes, I believe Morrison should've enforced this and said so at the time. But that's not the way things are done. Might be time for a rethink on just what citizenship entitles you to in an emergency such as this.

So you're saying Adelaide was just unlucky, but Victoria was incompetence?

Or maybe things just go tits up sometimes?

Especially when dealing with an issue that no government on earth has beaten.
 
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DavidSSS

Tiger Champion
Dec 11, 2017
3,969
4,411
Melbourne
Where do you get your information? They all get ripped off with "crap" wages do they?

Staggers me some of the misinformation those of the left persuasion throw out regarding wages/taxes etc.
Maybe not ALL of them, but there have been some high profile cases of wage under payment, particularly 7 eleven.

Yeah, I read newspapers and it has been widely reported at a number of employers.

Staggering some of the facts those of the alt-right perspective like to ignore.

DS
 

LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
28,828
6,676
Melbourne
So you're saying Adelaide was just unlucky, but Victoria was incompetence?

Or maybe things just go tits up sometimes?

Especially when dealing with an issue that no government on earth has beaten.
Incompetence at the top, yes. There were multiple flagrant breaches of protocol. Clearly the wrong people/firms were engaged for the job.

I don't know what happened in Adelaide. Was it a cleaner? I don't know if negligence was involved or even if the investigation has commenced.

The difficulties are reason enough to conduct quarantine offshore as they did initially. Getting the likes of Tom Hanks to spend two weeks on Manus is... problematic.
 

Sintiger

Tiger Legend
Aug 11, 2010
12,796
2,966
Camberwell
Rather than blaming the cleaner or the returning O/S traveller/expat for the SA outbreak it's the fault of the system we are still using.
At a time when the rest of the world is increasingly dangerous from an infection perspective the Feds and the States agreed to lift caps on returnees.
Higher risk & more returnees and using a system that's proven to be flawed?
Dumb, just dumb.
Returning travellers/expats should be confined to dedicated quarantine facilities manned by staff who live on site and have to quarantine before they are allowed back into the general population.
It's been months, there's been ample time to set this up.
There's a lack of spine in federal and state politics that is to blame.
I wonder where the view that every state was perfect except for Victoria because we stuffed up Hotel quarantine fits into this? the caps on returnees from OS have been lifting for a number of weeks now

Maybe you can set up the dedicated sites if you think it is so easy. Where will they be?
Incompetence at the top, yes. There were multiple flagrant breaches of protocol. Clearly the wrong people/firms were engaged for the job.

I don't know what happened in Adelaide. Was it a cleaner? I don't know if negligence was involved or even if the investigation has commenced.

The difficulties are reason enough to conduct quarantine offshore as they did initially. Getting the likes of Tom Hanks to spend two weeks on Manus is... problematic.
just as an aside if we have quarantine offshore or well outside cities how do we provide medical care for people who test positive?
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
28,828
6,676
Melbourne
I wonder where the view that every state was perfect except for Victoria because we stuffed up Hotel quarantine fits into this? the caps on returnees from OS have been lifting for a number of weeks now

Maybe you can set up the dedicated sites if you think it is so easy. Where will they be?

just as an aside if we have quarantine offshore or well outside cities how do we provide medical care for people who test positive?
The first planeloads went to Christmas Island.

"Easy" is your word, I didn't mention it. Having an entire state locked down isn't easy. Make a choice.

If I'm the government, you got four weeks' grace from March 17. After that you stay put and we'll provide support as best we can.
 
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Althom

Tiger Matchwinner
Jul 23, 2016
732
610
I wonder where the view that every state was perfect except for Victoria because we stuffed up Hotel quarantine fits into this? the caps on returnees from OS have been lifting for a number of weeks now

Maybe you can set up the dedicated sites if you think it is so easy. Where will they be?

just as an aside if we have quarantine offshore or well outside cities how do we provide medical care for people who test positive?
Never had the view that every state except Victoria was perfect. You seem to be a bit confused as to who has posted what.
In regards Western Australia - Garden Island Naval Base, Pearce Air Force Base or rededicate Rottnest to what it was 6 months ago. Rottnest was set up as a quarantine facility when COVID first hit with about 2 weeks notice.
In regards Victoria - what's wrong with setting up a facility at Point Cook. The RAAF barely use it these days.
Most other states have the same sort of locations relatively close to their capitals
Dongas available all over Australia from vacant mining camps or readily available at approx $30k/ensuite room.
Never suggested offshore quarantine because it obviously would be much more expensive and passengers would have to transit through Australia anyway and as for well outside cities - who suggested that? Facilities need to be within relatively quick ambulance access to hospitals.
As for the lifting caps on O/S travellers/expats - yes they've been lifted - at precisely the same time as COVID has exploded across the rest of the world. The risk of increased numbers and increased risk of infection should have triggered a rethink on methodology - surely?
 

MD Jazz

Tiger Legend
Feb 3, 2017
5,744
2,718
Yeah, I read newspapers and it has been widely reported at a number of employers.

Staggering some of the facts those of the alt-right perspective like to ignore.

DS
Alt-right? Hope that's not directed at me.

Unfortunately there do exist people running companies that exploit workers. Hopefully these types get hit by the karma bus one day. In general they take so many shortcuts they inevitably fail. In my experience in the main employers/business owners are massively hard working, risk-taking, fair treating people just trying to make a buck. Like most things its the few who like to spoil it for the many. Publicly listed companies operate under high scrutiny and regulation.

Big business/listed companies exploiting or short-changing workers inevitably get in trouble (see the recent Woolworths/Rockpool scandals). Or hopefully they do.
 
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Sintiger

Tiger Legend
Aug 11, 2010
12,796
2,966
Camberwell
Never had the view that every state except Victoria was perfect. You seem to be a bit confused as to who has posted what.
In regards Western Australia - Garden Island Naval Base, Pearce Air Force Base or rededicate Rottnest to what it was 6 months ago. Rottnest was set up as a quarantine facility when COVID first hit with about 2 weeks notice.
In regards Victoria - what's wrong with setting up a facility at Point Cook. The RAAF barely use it these days.
Most other states have the same sort of locations relatively close to their capitals
Dongas available all over Australia from vacant mining camps or readily available at approx $30k/ensuite room.
Never suggested offshore quarantine because it obviously would be much more expensive and passengers would have to transit through Australia anyway and as for well outside cities - who suggested that? Facilities need to be within relatively quick ambulance access to hospitals.
As for the lifting caps on O/S travellers/expats - yes they've been lifted - at precisely the same time as COVID has exploded across the rest of the world. The risk of increased numbers and increased risk of infection should have triggered a rethink on methodology - surely?
It was a general comment that had been made time and time again by many that Victoria is bad because all other states have not had a problem and therefore security guards are bad and police/ADF are good. It’s an incredibly simplistic view but if it is not one you expressed then please ignore it.
You cannot run a proper positive COVID hospital in anything that is not currently a major hospital for those that require ICU, ventilation and proper care by infectious diseases doctors and properly trained nurses. You may be able to run a general hospital for not so sick people at a place like point cook but you would be better off having patients in a public hospital rather than there. My point is more about the idea of some of some rural camp or mining camp or whatever. It’s a quarantine facility and would need major medical support.
 

MD Jazz

Tiger Legend
Feb 3, 2017
5,744
2,718

Oldish article about why NSW was coping better with covid. Supports what you have suggested Sing about the differences in health systems favouring NSW ability to respond to outbreaks.
 

22nd Man

Tiger Legend
Aug 29, 2011
6,175
1,466
Essex Heights
And there are plenty here whose visa does not permit them to work. No one should employ them on any wage at all. But we like cheapish fruit and veg and $5 noodles delivered so we all turn a blind eye. I would be happy to see any business with agovt certificate saying we pay award wages and only employ those entitled to work in Aust.
 
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22nd Man

Tiger Legend
Aug 29, 2011
6,175
1,466
Essex Heights
75% of jobs lost due to COVId are back I just heard. I also think at least 60% of the population are financially better off than in Feb. That is the group whose income was Not impacted or even increased and added to that virtually everyone has forcibly spent less (at worst they have just transferred spending from holidays eating out entertainment to furniture, cars) or simply decreased debt) yes lots of other downsides like denial of visiting family members, missing weddings etc but financially good.
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
28,828
6,676
Melbourne
Better late than never I guess but should have been done when the outbreak was first discovered earlier this week. Not sure why the delay but I hope no carriers crossed the border whilst they were ruminating.
Apparently prompted by the virus showing up in water tests in Benalla and Portland. Dan should sleep uneasily tonight.
 

jb03

Tiger Legend
Jan 28, 2004
28,255
2,891
Melbourne
What has happened to our contrarian mates in Sweden? Haven't read a Sky News linked tweet about how good they've done so assume things have turned out worse than the earlier wraps
 
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jb03

Tiger Legend
Jan 28, 2004
28,255
2,891
Melbourne
It's grossly inconsistent. We have Tennis Australia organising for a multitude of tournaments to be held in Victoria and citing quarantine arrangements to the players, apparently without clearing things with the government. And Andrews has (rightly) said, hang on a minute...

We either take the virus seriously or we don't. And events have shown that when we don't, it's going to bite us.
I'm still bemused how all the international horses and contingents seem to be allowed in to Victoria so easily
 
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