Did we finish to high last year?

[bowden4president]

Why is it after every really bad year (like 2004) we jump a few places and finish higher than we probably should, and miss out on Draft picks that we really need?

we seem to have done it a couple of times, and we get stuck in a visious circle of floating between 9th and 16th and never gain the players required to make that next step.

 

[Tygrys]

Yes we did. Hate to say it but Dermott Brereton was right, we rebuilt too quickly. Chances are that we basically did what Carlton had done the year before last and wasted a year with a mid-ladder performance that wasn't sustainable and which in the long run cost us draft picks. Basically a year lost in our rebuilding program.

Personally though I think the one that really hurt was our last gasp round 21 win against Hawthorn. We gave that Tiger legend Mark Graham a rousing victorious send off against his old team and made sure that the Hawks didn't get a sixth victory that would have cost them a priority pick. If we had lost that either Dowler or Ryder would probably have slipped to pick seven which might have gone a long way to rectifying our impending key position crisis. Yep the victory was great, too bad we'll be paying for it for years to come...

 

[The_General]

Geelong never bottomed out, and they're a pretty handy side.

 

[AEK Yellow n Black]

We never finish High Enough unless we win the Flag then we have finished high enough. 8) 8) 8)

But seriously competetive sport is always about doing your absolute best. Our finish last year was because we played the way we played. maybe some of us would have preffed to lose more games and get better picks....

Lets stop talking this rubbish, they do that over at Talking Carlton. You play to win and reap the rewards of winning and when you lose you hope you learn something from it. The way ( we ) so many supporters of the game talk about tanking and draft picks just makes me sick at times... I remember the glory days the days we had players who put in, players who were unknown and became legends. It wasn't about draft picks saving your club, it was about the blokes wearing the jumper playing for the jumper looking after the club.

IMO Draft picks should only ever come up for discusssion as a solution at seasons end, until then no point spruking potentials, and who and what we need for the future... Thats done in the off season... Right now lets just worry about winning games and giving ourselves every chance of trying to be the best we can with the ( hacks :hihi :hihi ) players we have.

We play to win and hey we won 10 games last year, too many ? , no way i would of loved more.... Oh well.....

 

[interested]

1. You played the Bulldogs at their home ground. The Bulldogs are a running side who, once they get on top, are hard to stop. The scoreline was not nearly reflective of the difference between the two sides.
2. Foley, Deledio, Hughes, Hyde, Jackson, Limbach, McGuane, Meyer, Moore, Newman, Pattison, Polo, Raines, Roach, Schulz, Tambling Thursfield. Thats 17 players on a senior list with very little experience. Compare this to the Bulldogs, and you'll notice the difference.

 

[kiwitiger]

I know this has all been said before but ,yes you are right we wouldve been better off losing,which makes a mockery of the whole system.

A crucial mistake in the draft system from the AFL,how the hell are you supossed to support a team when you know you are better off losing.

 

[Ian4]

Geelong never bottomed out, and they're a pretty handy side.

yeah, and they happily accepted our number 8 pick for craig biddiscombe

 

[interested]

Geelong managed to keep a very healthy mix. They never had a huge clean out like Richmond.

 

[Rosy]

Geelong managed to keep a very healthy mix. They never had a huge clean out like Richmond.

We'd be far unhealthier if we didn't have the cleanouts.

As for the question... Tha answer is no. We didn't finish high enough.

 

[The_General]

Realistically, Geelong have never had to have big clean outs, because they've managed their list a whole lot better than we have over the past 10 years. Times are changing though

 

[craig]

Yes we did. Hate to say it but Dermott Brereton was right, we rebuilt too quickly. Chances are that we basically did what Carlton had done the year before last and wasted a year with a mid-ladder performance that wasn't sustainable and which in the long run cost us draft picks. Basically a year lost in our rebuilding program.

Personally though I think the one that really hurt was our last gasp round 21 win against Hawthorn. We gave that Tiger legend Mark Graham a rousing victorious send off against his old team and made sure that the Hawks didn't get a sixth victory that would have cost them a priority pick. If we had lost that either Dowler or Ryder would probably have slipped to pick seven which might have gone a long way to rectifying our impending key position crisis. Yep the victory was great, too bad we'll be paying for it for years to come...

Tygrys we havent rebuilt too quickly as to have rebuilt means to have finished which most sane people would agree that the club is far far from even being rebuilt. The tigers needed more picks last draft as well as a good draft this year and even in 07 6to rebulid properly. The duds must be gotten rid of once and for all.
Going to the national draft with 3 picks last year was an absolute disgrace of the highest order for a club with a list such as ours and Miller should not be allowed to forget this one.
The tigers must go to this years national draft with up to 7-8 picks without a doubt and get fair dinkum like the Hawx in an effort to rebuild quality into the club lists.

 

[Tygrys]

Yes we did. Hate to say it but Dermott Brereton was right, we rebuilt too quickly. Chances are that we basically did what Carlton had done the year before last and wasted a year with a mid-ladder performance that wasn't sustainable and which in the long run cost us draft picks. Basically a year lost in our rebuilding program.

Personally though I think the one that really hurt was our last gasp round 21 win against Hawthorn. We gave that Tiger legend Mark Graham a rousing victorious send off against his old team and made sure that the Hawks didn't get a sixth victory that would have cost them a priority pick. If we had lost that either Dowler or Ryder would probably have slipped to pick seven which might have gone a long way to rectifying our impending key position crisis. Yep the victory was great, too bad we'll be paying for it for years to come...

Tygrys we havent rebuilt too quickly as to have rebuilt means to have finished which most sane people would agree that the club is far far from even being rebuilt. The tigers needed more picks last draft as well as a good draft this year and even in 07 6to rebulid properly. The duds must be gotten rid of once and for all.
Going to the national draft with 3 picks last year was an absolute disgrace of the highest order for a club with a list such as ours and Miller should not be allowed to forget this one.
The tigers must go to this years national draft with up to 7-8 picks without a doubt and get fair dinkum like the Hawx in an effort to rebuild quality into the club lists.

I meant rebuilt too quickly more in the sense of where we rebounded and finished on the ladder in terms of the draft as opposed to overall list management. You're absolutely right 3 picks was a disgrace. The only way I can rationalise Millers inaction is that he didn't rate the last draft and the Tigers are gearing up for a big effort come this years 'superdraft'. Time will tell on that score.

As for using Geelong as a model for rebuiling a team - it's true they didn't bottom out like some teams and they are 'handy' and very even, but the main concern about them is do they have the star talent to pull off a premiership? It's interesting that their two most lauded players came via the Father-Son rule ie Ablett and Scarlett, and that they got so worked up about getting Travis Varcoe because they rated him a top five pick - something they pointed out they hadn't had before.

Plus let's not forget the home ground advantage that they have with Kardinia Park. It would be on a par with what the Crows have with Football Park or the Lions with the Gabba. An advantage like that can turn an average side into a good one, a good team into a contender. It's no accident that the teams with these home ground advantages have dominated the finals in recent years and that the only serious 'Melbourne' contender has been St. Kilda, a team which went for draft picks and 'bottomed out'. For these reasons I think the Tigers should be looking more at the St Kilda model than the Geelong one.

 

[craig]

Welcome aboard Tygrys anyways and good work

 

[Tigermad2005]

No we did not 10 wins is 10 wins better to win than loss.

 

[GR]

Not high enough!

Would have liked to have seen some finals football

 

[Tygrys]

Welcome aboard Tygrys anyways and good work

Thank you, I appreciate it...

 

[Tigermad2005]

Would have still picked the wrong player anyway.

 

[bullus_hit]

We won the close ones last year which probably exagerrated our improvement, this isn't necessarily a bad thing because creates a winning culture, as far as all the talk about draft picks is concerned , well history has shown that you don't necessarily need high picks to emerge from the bottom eight. Granted, it helps immensely when players of the calibre of Cooney, Riewoldt and Deledio join the ranks but this is certainly no guarantee for success. St Kilda are where they are not because of Nick or even Kosi for that matter, they are there because they cut loose some established names and built a new side right across the board. I believe that the likes of Hamill and Gehrig have over a greater time period, been more important that Kosi and Nick, Hamill for his strongman presence and leadership and Gehrig for his goal kicking prowess. Likewise, Dal santo and Hayes have been of greater value than Luke Ball - that's not to say that Ball won't be an elite player but is merely an observation up till now.

The continued talk of high draft picks being something of a magic bullet has been grossly overstated ever since the inception of the draft. History shows that teams have an equivalent success rate with picks 10-20 as they do with 1-10. Number 1 draft picks often disappoint, sometimes due to the pressure of the spotlight and sometimes because they have developed earlier than their peers. Essendon has recruited superbly for twenty years yet rarely join the ranks of the down and out, whilst Fremantle have turned the recruitment game into a Greek tragedy. Somewhere along the line the club must take responsilbity for bringing the best out in players and this is where I have enormous respect for Sheedy, Matthews and Pagan. Wallace seems to have similar qualities and that is why I eagerly await the development of players such as Deledio, Tambling and Raines. Judging from last year one cannot help but be heartened by the improvement second tier players such as Pettifer, Hall and Tuck, hopefully this will translate into turning the truly gifted players into proven matchwinners.