Further proof of AFL stats being overrated! | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Further proof of AFL stats being overrated!

What's folly is the AFL's refusal to let the public see all the stats Champion Data are collecting for free. There's not a sporting organisation on earth that does this. Don't they understand that alot of people enjoy stats and that releasing the more detailed and informative ones will raise awareness and interest in the game?
 
Disco08 said:
What's folly is the AFL's refusal to let the public see all the stats Champion Data are collecting for free. There's not a sporting organisation on earth that does this. Don't they understand that alot of people enjoy stats and that releasing the more detailed and informative ones will raise awareness and interest in the game?

I approached Cameron Sinclair (AFL statistician) last year about obtaining some historical data on the "peoples' game" for a non-commercial project, i.e. personal interest. First he played dumb and when that didn't work, he played dead until I went away. :-X
 
This may blow some people away, but here goes with what we know.

LeeToRainesToRoach said:
Tend to agree. A problem with stats is that they result in a loss of information. If you know only that a player has had 20 kicks, you might be tempted to think he's had a good game. But the '20' doesn't tell you whether they
- were left or right foot - Nope
- were gained under pressure or in space Yep
- were short or long Yep
- went forwards or sideways or backwards Yep
- hit a target or went to a contest or went to the opposition Yep
- were made at the end of a 50m dash or from a standing start Yep
- created attack or held up play Yep
- were snaps or kicks off the ground Yep
and a hundred other things you could gather from watching the game. Coaches would almost certainly rely on their own observations first and foremost.

The most relevant stat of all is shown on the scoreboard, i.e. points for/points against.

Maybe not, as fudge says most clubs are using his data. Sounds as though Sydney isn't one of them. You don't know, so you cannot assume anything

As for the most relevent stat, the scoreboard... I wholeheartedly agree!!!
 
Tiger Attack said:
Disco08 said:
Don't they understand that alot of people enjoy stats

What?

Name names!

Forget names. Here's a picture of one of them.

images
 
LeeToRainesToRoach said:
Disco08 said:
What's folly is the AFL's refusal to let the public see all the stats Champion Data are collecting for free. There's not a sporting organisation on earth that does this. Don't they understand that alot of people enjoy stats and that releasing the more detailed and informative ones will raise awareness and interest in the game?

I approached Cameron Sinclair (AFL statistician) last year about obtaining some historical data on the "peoples' game" for a non-commercial project, i.e. personal interest. First he played dumb and when that didn't work, he played dead until I went away. :-X

I rang the AFL just about two years ago looking for some stats to form the basis of a trivia night. Col Hutchison rang me back and we had a lovely short chat and he faxed me everything I asked for. However, I didn't ask for any current stats from that particular year except jumper numbers but from the years prior got everything I asked for.
 
jb03 said:
I rang the AFL just about two years ago looking for some stats to form the basis of a trivia night. Col Hutchison rang me back and we had a lovely short chat and he faxed me everything I asked for. However, I didn't ask for any current stats from that particular year except jumper numbers but from the years prior got everything I asked for.

Interesting. Guernsey numbers for each club and year are actually available on the AFL website, although I think this only happened about one year ago.

I was after the team lists & guernsey numbers for every VFL game; Cameron said it was too much information to transfer; I replied that I worked in I.T. and knew the quantity of data involved, and would he be kind enough to pop the information onto a DVD for me as I was willing to pay for the trouble? Stony silence followed, but perhaps I do Cameron a disservice and he didn't receive my further communications.
 
LeeToRainesToRoach said:
I approached Cameron Sinclair (AFL statistician) last year about obtaining some historical data on the "peoples' game" for a non-commercial project, i.e. personal interest. First he played dumb and when that didn't work, he played dead until I went away. :-X

jb03 said:
I rang the AFL just about two years ago looking for some stats to form the basis of a trivia night. Col Hutchison rang me back and we had a lovely short chat and he faxed me everything I asked for. However, I didn't ask for any current stats from that particular year except jumper numbers but from the years prior got everything I asked for.

I'll tell you something for free- The AFL had a 50% clanger rate- but crucially Cameron had a 100% clanger rate and Hutchison was infallible.

Conclusion: Give Cameron the arse.
 
I think its been overlooked that alot of statistics of certain players actual depends on how their team play the game.

For example, A team like Hawthorn who try to find free men and refuse to kick to a contest are going to have high kicking efficeny ratios. However lets say Brent Guerra has a high efficeny ratio yet all his kicks are 25-30 meters sideways. Well big deal.

The real measure of kicking effectivness is the delivery to the forwards. Players who get the ball deep inside 50 to the forwards advantage. The perfect example of this is none other then the best player in the comp. Judd's kicking to the forwards is absolutely precise. They never break stride.

Not to pick on any one player but for example Joel Bowden is rock solid acorss half back and htis the target, but in terms of overall effectivness would you prefer someone who finds players at half back, or someone who kicks inside 50 with laser like precision?

To me a player quality of possesions is more important for running players. For rovers well they will always get 25-26 but alot of them under pressure and trying to free up other players, they are still an important part of a team. Nathan Foley's 25-30 possesions are important but you need finishers who deliver the ball.
 
Excellent post, tf06.

I liked this point most-

tigersforever06 said:
The real measure of kicking effectivness is the delivery to the forwards.

Sending it in. We don't have enough who do this well. Although I should acknowledge that we've improved in this area.