It's official, Hocking and the AFL are dumb-arsed, half-baked clowns who are trying to stuff the game | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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It's official, Hocking and the AFL are dumb-arsed, half-baked clowns who are trying to stuff the game

fat-fifty-footmad

Tiger Cub
Oct 6, 2017
16
32
I'd have to take issue with this. Yes, some games were a spectacle back then. But, just as we complain about the Richmond v Sydney game this year, remember back to games where 2 lowly teams played on some quagmire at a suburban ground back then? Thing is, there were no TV cameras at those games as only a couple of games were replayed in the evening, so we can never compare - even if they were filmed, the film has been long thrown away. They might have kicked a few more goals back then but some of the games were woeful, just as they are now.

DS
Totally agree - I cant help but think there's a lot of rose tinted glasses about the old days. I've been watching football for nigh on 50 years in paddocks like victoria park, windy hill, Moorabbin and the junction oval. I watched games between a crap fitzroy and a terrible richmond. Games where the players ambled between stoppages and it was like grown-ups playing kick to kick where there was zero thinking involved. For me, that's the 'real' past people seem to want and I don't get it.
 
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aoc1974

Tiger Superstar
Mar 1, 2015
2,210
3,322
Totally agree - I cant help but think there's a lot of rose tinted glasses about the old days. I've been watching football for nigh on 50 years in paddocks like victoria park, windy hill, Moorabbin and the junction oval. I watched games between a crap fitzroy and a terrible richmond. Games where the players ambled between stoppages and it was like grown-ups playing kick to kick where there was zero thinking involved. For me, that's the 'real' past people seem to want and I don't get it.

Yep l'm with you blokes.... there always has been and always will be *smile* games of football.
I reckon the only bloke in the media I've heard consistently say that it's no longer like the good old days when you only saw 1 replay and an hour of highlights, is Jimmy Bartel.
Obviously he's not that old, but still old enough to remember not every game was a football masterclass!

These days every single bit of play has half a dozen cameras fixed on it and as is the way of the world, negativity not positivity gets more clicks!
 
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tommystigers

Don't Boo! It is hurtful to the inept and corrupt.
Oct 6, 2004
3,502
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Brodders17

Tiger Legend
Mar 21, 2008
12,187
1,632
Totally agree - I cant help but think there's a lot of rose tinted glasses about the old days. I've been watching football for nigh on 50 years in paddocks like victoria park, windy hill, Moorabbin and the junction oval. I watched games between a crap fitzroy and a terrible richmond. Games where the players ambled between stoppages and it was like grown-ups playing kick to kick where there was zero thinking involved. For me, that's the 'real' past people seem to want and I don't get it.
They are ignoring the fact that all sports have undergone massive change over the past 30 or so years as more money has moved players to professional, more money has made the stakes higher and more technology has had a huge impact on the way games are played.

30 or 40 years ago players practised kicking/marking/handballing/spoling and did fitness work. strategy involved dropping your ruck back, or someone in the hole in front of the full forward, and scragging and whacking the opposition gun rover.
no amount of rule changes, other than reducing players pay to return to part-time footballers, reducing the money on offer for winning- prize money, membership and sponsorship, and getting rid of most coaches, will return the game to what is once was, and it is foolish to try.
 
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fat-fifty-footmad

Tiger Cub
Oct 6, 2017
16
32
They are ignoring the fact that all sports have undergone massive change over the past 30 or so years as more money has moved players to professional, more money has made the stakes higher and more technology has had a huge impact on the way games are played.

30 or 40 years ago players practised kicking/marking/handballing/spoling and did fitness work. strategy involved dropping your ruck back, or someone in the hole in front of the full forward, and scragging and whacking the opposition gun rover.
no amount of rule changes, other than reducing players pay to return to part-time footballers, reducing the money on offer for winning- prize money, membership and sponsorship, and getting rid of most coaches, will return the game to what is once was, and it is foolish to try.
True - but not even sure thats enough. I've still got mates playing ammo's and they've figured out the press, defending in the front half, defending space wins games. I don't think we can unknow what we know - the game is what it will be, unless you do something like introduce hard netball style zones.
 
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Tigers of Old

Proud of our Club.
Jul 26, 2004
67,313
8,310
www.redbubble.com
I honestly believe reducing interchange rotations significantly or even playing with 21 instead of 22 will go a long way towards opening the game up.
The game became more professional at the same time we increased bench numbers in the 1990s and it altered the game significantly. Players became fitter than ever & they got more time to rest.
Common sense says that leads towards congestion.
 
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CarnTheTiges

This is a REAL tiger
Mar 8, 2004
20,034
2,851
Victoria
Watching a game from 97, and it does seem to flow a bit better. The main reason seems to be that less frees are paid across the board. In their constant tinkering with the rules to ‘fix’ perceived problems, mostly invented by a lazy knee jerk media monster, they’ve actually succeeded in ruining the game by forcing it to be over adjudicated.
 
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aoc1974

Tiger Superstar
Mar 1, 2015
2,210
3,322
I'd like to flick-pass Sheedy back to the grave where he came from
Interesting that Sheedy was wearing some sort of promotional top, so whatever he was being interviewed for no doubt there was an earn in it ... occupies all 3 steps on the podium in the self promotion stakes imo.
 
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The Big Richo

Moderator
Aug 19, 2010
3,982
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The home of Dusty
I'd have to take issue with this. Yes, some games were a spectacle back then. But, just as we complain about the Richmond v Sydney game this year, remember back to games where 2 lowly teams played on some quagmire at a suburban ground back then? Thing is, there were no TV cameras at those games as only a couple of games were replayed in the evening, so we can never compare - even if they were filmed, the film has been long thrown away. They might have kicked a few more goals back then but some of the games were woeful, just as they are now.

DS

It's a good point you make David.

Fox Footy just replayed the 1986 Vic v WA state of Origin game where it was 140 odd each and three points the difference.

A cracking game of footy and lots of individual brilliance on display, but as a game I'm not sure it was better than what we see today, in terms of skills and the way the game was played.
 
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DavidSSS

Tiger Champion
Dec 11, 2017
4,226
4,798
Melbourne
Just to be clear DS - in my earlier post I was comparing the “close congested defensive and low scoring style of footy” of today’s game to the style of early eras. I was making a general point about the spectacle of the general style of play - not that individual games at any time may or may not have been spectacular/woeful to watch.

FWIW I prefer a more open free flowing style over that with 30+ players and the ball confined to one small section of the ground - but each to their own.
My main preference though is more flags.

Yeah I agree with a lot of what you say, I suppose I just react to the rose coloured glasses we get in the media about how good footy was back in the day.

When I was a kid school yard footy was everyone on the ball - looks a bit like that at AFL level now.

I don't think you can put the fitness genie back in the bottle. They can now run all day and that is a permanent change with professional footballers.

The idea of zones really pisses me off as it is a very basic feature of Australian Rules that players don't have to play in positions. The centre diamond was only introduced in the early 70s, before that there were no restrictions. Australian Rules is uniquely exciting in part because of the freedom to roam on a very large playing area.

There must be strategies which can open the game up a bit more. Certainly the way the game is adjudicated is making this worse, the amount of time they stuff around for a ball up is patently absurd and counter-productive. As is the way they let packs form to see if the ball might somehow get extracted.

One of the problems I see is that coaches will play it safe while trying to sort out the impact of constant rule changes. There is less room to experiment when the ground is shifting under you.

Funnily enough more Richmond flags is my preference too!

DS
 
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DavidSSS

Tiger Champion
Dec 11, 2017
4,226
4,798
Melbourne
It's a good point you make David.

Fox Footy just replayed the 1986 Vic v WA state of Origin game where it was 140 odd each and three points the difference.

A cracking game of footy and lots of individual brilliance on display, but as a game I'm not sure it was better than what we see today, in terms of skills and the way the game was played.

Is that the one at Subi where Mark Mitchell played so well? I watched a couple of these a few months ago and there was one game where he was amazing.

Skills are far better today,

I think Brodders is right to point out that all games have changed with increased professionalism, increased coverage and, no doubt going with the increased coverage, increased ability for coaches to analyse footage of games to sort out strategies. The analysis possible now with so many cameras is light years away from what they had until maybe 25 years ago.

DS
 
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nqtiger

In the jungle
Mar 7, 2004
1,613
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Back From The jungle
Wow, the kick outs, there will be so much space but no marking options as they need to be inside the forward fifty.
Wonder how this is going to look. Its going to stop teams locking the ball in there forward half.
Surprise surprise.......favours the scats, nobbles the tigers surprise surprise
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
29,533
7,405
Melbourne
For me, that's the 'real' past people seem to want and I don't get it.
Lack of sophistication led to more contests and more risks taken. And that's where the game was better in the past, regardless of skills.

The modern game is about the coaches controlling as much as they possibly can. Less a case of individuals playing on the edge than the group ensuring the game follows a pre-determined script.

The game is a victim of its own (initial) simplicity.
 

warren1328

Tiger Cub
Mar 18, 2014
3
11
I'm just wondering if all these people complaining about the state of the game ever watch Richmond games?
Geez, even in the games that we lose, you see those periods where the Tigers ball movement is just a thing of abject beauty.
Been watching some of the "classic" games on Foxtel recently, and even the showcase State of Origin games.......kinda crap.
Those "great" sides would have their arses handed to them by the 2017-20 Tigers.
If people don't want to watch *smile* truck teams like Ess and Nth Melb play rubbish football, I don't think they should be forced to.....
 
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