Mark Bolton v Graham Polak v Jason Cloke, worth a look

[Dean3]

No I didn't say that.  More concerned.  Our list is not up to it - that is not in dispute.  I would prefer to see a greater turnover despite what has happened in the last couple of years under TW.  I think 3 picks in the 2005 draft was not enough and 4 this year is also not enough.  Of course, it is only opinion and I will continue to follow them and back them to the hilt with all and sundry. 

Our list is not up to it, but there is heaps of improvement in it, even if it didn't change at all. That's the upside.

My belief is that we haven't seen an even greater turnover beacuse of the low base that we were coming from. We are now in the twilight zone of having a lot of unproven players with potential who aren't worth much in trade week, and over-exposed journeymen, who also don't create much excitement in trade week. That's why it is frustrating to see people decrying the fact that we haven't got a million picks in this draft. It is interesting that there is another thread(s) on this site trying to work out who the player might be that we will delist, and it ain't easy to pick one, yet we're all standing around pointing at Miller, saying why haven't we got 5 picks in the top 40 like Carlton?? Because we've been through that absolute dud phase and we're on the next stage of rebuilding: filling holes, topping up and getting set for the improvement to come from within the list.

IMO patience is the key now. Not ranting and raving and questioning every move. Not calling players duds (or comparing them to duds) before they've even pulled on the jumper.

Querying, or even disagreeing with decisions does not make one a non-supporter.

I never said that either. Though, one does wonder sometimes.... ;D

 

[Tigers of Old]

Frankly, if he does his job at least as well as Lewis Roberts-Thomson, then that will be a massive win for the club. He doesn't have to be Ross Glendinning, he just has to do his job. With his youth, limited experience, build, etc etc, he looks likely enough, and a good punt for basically pick 42.

I think that's a really valid point Dean.
Polak doesn't have to be a superstar for us, as you say he just has to do his job and fill a hole that we clearly have.

Downgrading our first selection in a strong draft is clearly not in the same ballpark as some of the more recent controversial trades such as Ottens and Hay. It's nowhere near them even should it turn out a poor decision.

No doubt there will be expectations to perform but Polak is clearly not a blue chip player and supporters expectations should not be excessive.

 

[the claw]

Re: Mark Bolton v Graham Polak, worth a look

Jury well and truly out on Polak.

That's more like it jim belushi.
It's certainly reasonable to raise questions as to his value.
No question Polak, along with Miller and Wallace are hoping he does the job for us.
They'll all be under pressure if he doesn't.

if i were to say the same thing i would be hung drawn and quartered. boy we are a sensitive lot here its not what you say but how you say it. no wonder we are a rabble.

 

[TigersEatemAlive]

Can we stop this please?? No Pretendagasta, Bolton, Cloke (Unless its Travis.... maybe...or maybe not), Slow heavy tanks don't work so well in footy any more!!!)

 

[mb64]

Re: Mark Bolton v Graham Polak, worth a look

Jury well and truly out on Polak.

That's more like it jim belushi.
It's certainly reasonable to raise questions as to his value.
No question Polak, along with Miller and Wallace are hoping he does the job for us.
They'll all be under pressure if he doesn't.

if i were to say the same thing i would be hung drawn and quartered. boy we are a sensitive lot here its not what you say but how you say it. no wonder we are a rabble.

Unfortunately Claw some posters dismiss your posts without even reading them.

 

[AngryAnt]

Re: Mark Bolton v Graham Polak, worth a look

Jury well and truly out on Polak.

That's more like it jim belushi.
It's certainly reasonable to raise questions as to his value.
No question Polak, along with Miller and Wallace are hoping he does the job for us.
They'll all be under pressure if he doesn't.

if i were to say the same thing i would be hung drawn and quartered. boy we are a sensitive lot here its not what you say but how you say it. no wonder we are a rabble.

Unfortunately Claw some posters dismiss your posts without even reading them.

I read them, then dismiss them.

 

[tigersnake]

interesting stats jb

 

[jb03]

This thread is not an attack on Polak. I am only trying to justify the hype around him as distinct from other players that have barely half the reputation Polak does - yet the stats are quite similar. If we are not to base the comparison on stats, then on which basis do we compare and categorically declare that Polak is a far superior player to either Bolton or Cloke?

 

[Dean3]

This thread is not an attack on Polak.  I am only trying to justify the hype around him as distinct from other players that have barely half the reputation Polak does -  yet the stats are quite similar.  If we are not to base the comparison on stats, then on which basis do we compare and categorically declare that Polak is a far superior player to either Bolton or Cloke?

On his performance in the yellow and black.

 

[jb03]

This thread is not an attack on Polak.  I am only trying to justify the hype around him as distinct from other players that have barely half the reputation Polak does -  yet the stats are quite similar.  If we are not to base the comparison on stats, then on which basis do we compare and categorically declare that Polak is a far superior player to either Bolton or Cloke?

On his performance in the yellow and black.

If that is the sole criteria then we can draft anyone and not judge them until they've played.

 

[Dean3]

This thread is not an attack on Polak.  I am only trying to justify the hype around him as distinct from other players that have barely half the reputation Polak does -  yet the stats are quite similar.  If we are not to base the comparison on stats, then on which basis do we compare and categorically declare that Polak is a far superior player to either Bolton or Cloke?

On his performance in the yellow and black.

If that is the sole criteria then we can draft anyone and not judge them until they've played.

Just saying that I'm happy to wait until he plays for us for a year or two before I judge him. I'm certainly not going to pre-judge him, or the trade, based on a stat comparison with Bolton or Cloke. If you wish to, that's fine, that's entirely your prerogative.

 

[jb03]

This thread is not an attack on Polak.  I am only trying to justify the hype around him as distinct from other players that have barely half the reputation Polak does -  yet the stats are quite similar.  If we are not to base the comparison on stats, then on which basis do we compare and categorically declare that Polak is a far superior player to either Bolton or Cloke?

On his performance in the yellow and black.

If that is the sole criteria then we can draft anyone and not judge them until they've played.

Just saying that I'm happy to wait until he plays for us for a year or two before I judge him. I'm certainly not going to pre-judge him, or the trade, based on a stat comparison with Bolton or Cloke. If you wish to, that's fine, that's entirely your prerogative.

I'm just trying to establish the criteria by which Polak is judged to be a superior player to Bolton and Cloke (as examples). If we had picked up Bolton or Cloke do you think the majority would have been as supportive as they are of the decision to select Polak?

 

[Dean3]

Perhaps I can answer your question with a question.

Why did you choose Bolton and Cloke?

 

[jb03]

Because I thought Bolton would get delisted and Redford suggested we throw up Clokes stats - similar age and type of player I guess.

 

[mb64]

This thread is not an attack on Polak.  I am only trying to justify the hype around him as distinct from other players that have barely half the reputation Polak does -  yet the stats are quite similar.  If we are not to base the comparison on stats, then on which basis do we compare and categorically declare that Polak is a far superior player to either Bolton or Cloke?

On his performance in the yellow and black.

If that is the sole criteria then we can draft anyone and not judge them until they've played.

Just saying that I'm happy to wait until he plays for us for a year or two before I judge him. I'm certainly not going to pre-judge him, or the trade, based on a stat comparison with Bolton or Cloke. If you wish to, that's fine, that's entirely your prerogative.

I'm just trying to establish the criteria by which Polak is judged to be a superior player to Bolton and Cloke (as examples).  If we had picked up Bolton or Cloke do you think the majority would have been as supportive as they are of the decision to select Polak?

Wouldn't matter who we'd pick up.When anyone comes to Richmond its a great deal & we've traded well.

 

[TigerMasochist]

The only possible advantage I can see over the others is that Bolton and Cloke were in sides coached by supposedly some of the best in the biz and Polack played in a side of underperforming fruitloops.
At 22 I hope he has a fair bit of upside and that we can find it.
The reason we would have gone ballistic over Cloke and Bolton is that we see and hear about them regularly, with interstate players it's a bit of the old see no hear no syndrome.