New York police officer killings

[KnightersRevenge]

http://www.creativespirits.info/aboriginalculture/law/aboriginal-prison-rates

This answered some of my questions.

Thanks, much there that seems to me to confirm what I am saying. (Could be confirmation bias?)

 

[Rfc4Ever]

I can only go by anecdote and statistics. If black people are reporting harsh treatment, and the statistics suggest they are much more likely to be arrested for the exact same offence, I don't see where your argument is? Can you explain the higher incarceration rates for African Americans and Indigenous Australians if interactions with law enforcement are not different? Here are a couple of graphs from the Washington Post:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/06/04/the-blackwhite-marijuana-arrest-gap-in-nine-charts/

Usage total:

Arrests for possession:

According to the Australian Institute of Criminology (AIC) "Indigenous persons make up 26 per cent of the prisoner population yet only constitute 2.5 per cent of the Australian population." You can't see a massive disparity here? In order to get to jail they have to be arrested, to be so over represented they must either be congenitally evil or law enforcement is prosecuting at 10 times the rate for the same offences. Which do you think is more likely?

I wouldn't be taking survey results as gospel, especially when they are being compared to arrest rates.

 

[KnightersRevenge]

I wouldn't be taking survey results as gospel, especially when they are being compared to arrest rates.

Okay, why do you think the arrest rate is so skewed towards African Americans, and Indigenous?

 

[Peaka]

Knighter I suggest that a lot has to do with socio-economic disadvantage (which is a separate issue). I would be interested in the stats comparing arrest rates for whites and African Americans in the same socio-economic groups. I don't have this data but am willing to bet that the arrest rates would be pretty similar.

In relation to aboriginal Australians (I don't like the term indigenous as I think its misleading) I think the difference in arrest rates comes down to a cultural differences in views on property ownership. I am not sure how to overcome this other than by complete segragation of the different cultures which i don't agree with.

Peaka

 

[Peaka]

I am also not sure how a comparison of reported Marijuana usage and Marijuana arrest rates is relevant in any meaningful sense.

As first point the first statistic is based on survey results which are always problematic (try finding anyone who admits voting for a poor government for example). In addition arrests are almost invariably related to the amount of drug that is posessed.

An equally valid conclusion from the data that you presented is that whilst non african americans may use marijuana more than african americans it is the latter group that is more likely to possess large quantities (and therefore probably be traffikers of the drug). I am not saying that this is my conclusion from the data just that it is equally as valid as the conclusion you drew. Once gain combining the data in the way that you did is quite frankly naive at best, misleading at worst. The two sets of data are independent of each other and I suspect that you in fact know this.

Of course a third factor is that in many instances people arrested for marijuana possession are in fact stopped for another offence and then when their vehicle or house is searched the marijuana is found leading to the arrest for drug possession. This is a further confounding factor in determining what these statistics mean.

 

[Rfc4Ever]

Okay, why do you think the arrest rate is so skewed towards African Americans, and Indigenous?

I was referring primarily to the survey results.

They were household surveys after all that don't mean much in my book. Asking people in the form of a home survey to admit their drug use? Cannot be relied upon at all.

As for the arrest rates, Indigenous persons being more likely to be committing offences per person than other racial backgrounds is one simple reason they have higher arrest/incarceration rates.

There are many other reasons as to high levels of arrest rates of Indigenous persons, and yes, racism is one, but only a very minor one IMO.

What I'm getting at is that it's not automatic that racism is the primary factor due to higher arrest/incarceration rates, need to think of the bigger picture.

 

[KnightersRevenge]

I was referring primarily to the survey results.

They were household surveys after all that don't mean much in my book. Asking people in the form of a home survey to admit their drug use? Cannot be relied upon at all.

As for the arrest rates, Indigenous persons being more likely to be committing offences per person than other racial backgrounds is one simple reason they have higher arrest/incarceration rates.

There are many other reasons as to high levels of arrest rates of Indigenous persons, and yes, racism is one, but only a very minor one IMO.

What I'm getting at is that it's not automatic that racism is the primary factor due to higher arrest/incarceration rates, need to think of the bigger picture.

We don't know the nature of the survey nor how the results were tabulated so it isn't IMO fair to dismiss the results out of hand. The factor we do know is that the colour of a person's skin tells you their likelihood of being arrested. We can speculate about a multitude of factors but I think this is playing around the margins. Law enforcement is dealing unfairly with people and while it may be guessed at that it is institutionalised racism rather than overt personal racism the result is the same.