Oh the pain!!

[tha8ball]

Yesterday was my first Grand Final i have ever attended. It was by far the most exciting, exhilirating and moving atmosphere i have ever been involved in. I came away feeling priviliged to have been lucky enough to witness such a fantatsically historic occassion. In spite of this, i couldnt help but feel disheartened by the fact it wasnt my beloved RFC out there doing battle. Yes i realise it has been 24 yrs since we were out there...but when i have watched it at home, i have never really experienced the emotions of the fans on the biggest day of the footy year.

I asked myself, how far are we away from understanding once again what its like to do battle in the last saturday of September. A post on BF came out with an intersting point - Research reveals:

West Coast Eagles Age bracket of players:

15 players in the 23-28 age group
2 veterans (Chick and Banfield)
5 'kids' (Seaby (22), Selwood (22), Armstrong (20), Waters (20), Butler (20))

Sydney Swans age bracket of players:
15 players in the 23-28 age group
3 'veterans' (Hall (29), O'Loughlin (29) and Kirk (30))
5 'kids' (Dempster (22), Schneider (22), Malceksi (22) and McVeigh (21))


This realy gives a truly solid indication as to where a group needs to be to make a genuine attempt at winning a premiership. It was also noted that from those expected to be around:

In 2010:
Kids:
2009 picks (18yrs)
2008 picks (19yrs)
2007 picks (20yrs)
2006 picks (21yrs)
Hughes, Cassserly, Oakley-Nicholls and White (22)

Core:
Deledio (23)
Raines, Polo, Tambling, Meyer, Thursfield, Pattison, McGuane, Hartigan, Limbach, Jackson(24)
Foley, Schulz (25)
Krakouer (27)
Pettifer, Newman,Hyde,Coughlan (28)

Vets:
Tuck, Howat (29)
Pat Bowden (30)
Simmonds, Sugar, Joel Bowden, Nathan Brown (32)
Richo?(35)

Now of course, not all of these players will be there and through trades we will pick up other players to fit into these brackets, however it gives a great indication of what time frame we should be looking at.
In 2010 our core will be led by our 2004 draftees and our vets will be polished players in Brown, Bowden, Simmonds and Sugar. IMO Tuck, Howat, Pat Bowden, Hydey will all become depth players and im unsure whether players like McGuane, Jackson, Limbach and Hartigan will be around by then...but i still give them the benefit of the doubt. Punt Road last night had a wonderful feel to it....but nothing like it will the day we win the flag and every oposition supporter knows it!

Yesterday i hurt and longed for the day this great football club reaches those great heights it was once so accustomed to. I hope TW and the boys were there yesterday and bloody hurt as much as i did because if that cant create a passion inside these boys into wanting to become the best and put this club back were it should be, then i tell you now nothing ever will.

8ty

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

Like your sentiments 8ball.

Some other premiership team age breakdowns:

PA 2004
3  <23
12 23-28
7   29+

Br 2003
5  <23
11 23-28
6   29+

Es 2000
8  <23
10 23-28
4   29+

Ri 1967
9  <23
10 23-28
1   29+

Probably coincidence that this year's grand finalists happen to be similar according to those groupings. If you substitute Crouch for Dempster, and Nicoski for Banfield, they're not as similar. As long as a side is skilled, tough, fit, and able to play under pressure, I don't know that one age demographic is better than another (although experience would be a factor).

 

[tigerjoe]

Nice post 8ty.

I think your right about having to wait till 2010.

Both Sydney and WC both had lead up years in the finals where they didn't make the GF.
Maturing their bodies and football nouse and skills takes years, lets hope we can make the 8 next year and begin the learning/maturing curve.

And remember that there is a very big chance that there will be heartache before reaching a GF and I hope I'm wrong but we may have to lose one to win one.

 

[Mr Brightside]

Good post Black in the corner pocket,TW has been saying a similar thing for sometime, now im not saying we are the team to win a flag in the next couple of years but I believe there is a great oppurtunity for neally any club in the AFL to win a flag in the next couple of years ,my reasons been the 2 grand finalists both have glaring weaknesses in comparison to the Great Brissy teams,Eagles forward line though good has not 1 garunteed 4 goal forward even with the exceptional delivery they receive,Sydney brilliant structure an team work to make a leaky defence work well lets face it if Hall was going to play on LRT you would feel pretty confident or if you had a class third tall like Bradshaw.

Adelaide have a great bunch of old blokes(starting to get injured) an some promising young fellas but already will go into next year without 2 of there 3 best ruckman from this year as well as imo there best potential forward.

Saints what needs to be said about the rabble of the 20th century couldnt rig a one ticket raffle.

Freo could be a super team but still yet to deliver when it matters ,probally due to the fact they have more vo rogues in there team then an under 10s

Dees well they do have a young list an seem to play well for most of the year.

My point been before the Hawks have another Golden era there is a little window for a team to win a flag due to the fact there is not a team without its faults going around now

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

...
Freo could be a super team but still yet to deliver when it matters ,probally due to the fact they have more vo rogues in there team then an under 10s
...

Maybe because Chris Connolly is the Cyril Small of coaches - would be lucky to get a job elsewhere at the top level.

 

[Mr Brightside]

...
Freo could be a super team but still yet to deliver when it matters ,probally due to the fact they have more vo rogues in there team then an under 10s
...

Maybe because Chris Connolly is the Cyril Small of coaches - would be lucky to get a job elsewhere at the top level.

:rotfl Classic, Had my first $100 bet I think when the great C Small steared the champ home in the Aussie cup in 90 I think at 9s

 

[Tigers of Old]

Great post 8ty. Good GF to go to for your first. :fing32

You make an excellent point about the dearth of players currently in the 23-28 age bracket.
Wallace himself has said as much previously. It's a genuine problem with our list management.
When you look at the examples you've provided as an indicator, it's going to take time.
The stuff ups in our recruiting over the past ten years are there for all to see(or not).
Thank goodness we're starting to rectify that(?).



On a side note, seeing those two skillful teams running themselves into the ground at full pace for the entire game, indicated to me just how far away we are from the success the Weagles tasted on Saturday.

Seeing several Swans in tears despite winning just last season, showed just how badly both those teams wanted the Premiership Cup. Striving for excellence is not something to be critical of.
Failure should hurt.
Both teams busted their balls to get across the line first on Saturday and ran when they couldn't run anymore.
That's courage in my book. :clap

The efforts from both GF sides should be a lesson for many RFC players that they need a burning desire to succeed in order to taste that ultimate success. Some of our youngsters might think they have time on their side such is the folly of youth but their careers will be over in no time.

Sugar, who's been part of a premiership side, was on the money with his speech at the B&F..

"We are here to play finals football, not for there here and now.
One day we will be old and frail.
None of us want to look back on this unique moment in our lives and think what might have been.

On Saturday every player from the Swans and the Weagles put those words into action.

 

[nitrotiger]

puttin yas on notice.....a tiger flag is nearer than you think.....

 

[Rosy]

a tiger flag is nearer than you think.....

I've been saying that for 20 years. Oh well, there's always next year. ;D

 

[pahoffm]

Much will depend on who we recruit in the next few years.

 

[Tango]

we wont win a flag whilst richo & gas are our bookends and cogs, tuck & johnno are our mids

 

[Turbo Tiger]

we wont win a flag whilst richo & gas are our bookends and cogs, tuck & johnno are our mids 

Tuck & Johnno aren't the problem. My concern is that we haven't got a single CHF prospect on our list after all this time!

 

[johnson2richo2003]

Tuck & Johnno aren't the problem. My concern is that we haven't got a single CHF prospect on our list after all this time!

CHF?
Who,s the Swans CHF?
Is Hansen in the Carey class?
In fact there is only one CHF who comes close to Carey currently playing.One Jonathon Brown.
CHF is the least of our problems

 

[Mr Brightside]

we wont win a flag whilst richo & gas are our bookends and cogs, tuck & johnno are our mids  

Tuck & Johnno aren't the problem. My concern is that we haven't got a single CHF prospect on our list after all this time!

I beg to differ a tad TT,not saying we have a super star in the making but with the talent that Hughes has there is no reason he couldnt play just as well as Hansen do's for the Eagles as a leading up CHF.Sarge may also play the CHF role in a different way as would Pato an Mcguane now before I get shot down there is no garuntee they could all be good CHFs but they have all shown signs of been able to do a job in that position.

Now I know ive got my rose colored glasses on but I dont have a problem with Cogs,Tuck,Axe an Sugar as our hard at it on ballers the problem is they need a little more help an some class outsiders to do the finshing work.

Now its been said at nauseum that we need a classy tough onballer NO *smile* yeah they grow on trees,an thats why we have out an out champions in the game that do both its rare you find somebody who is ultra tough,quick an classy.
I will have a crack at a few

Adealide: Goodwin,Edwards,Roo but I wouldnt say any are ultra quick plus there all getting on a touch
Brissy:Black,Voss once again not quick
Carlton:come on CC :rotfl
Pies:Bucks,but im sure someone will argue his tough"hey Lamby "
Essendon:I suppose we have to put Hird in here though he dont really play on ball that much now
Freo:Carr is tough with fair skills but not quick Hazelby?
Geelong: :donut3
Hawks:Mitchell,Hodge both tough both skilled both not quick leg speed but quick up top
Roos:Simpson,Harvey,Grant all would probally have 2 of the 3 categories covered but lack in the other
Dees:Mclean he is a beauty IMO
Port Shaun Burgoyne not scared but dosent sacre >but brilliant in other categories
Saints:Hayes,Harvey,Dal santo Hayes though not quick is probally more the type we are after
Sydney:Bolton,Kirk as tough as they come ,Kirks kicking is ordinary but he does his job,Boltons a beauty bu not quick again
West Coast:well here we are the type that we just have to pick up inthis draft ;DJudd,Kerr an Cousins fair too
Doggies:West,Cross do the hard stuff an then they have a bunch of highly skilled quick types to finish the work.

Doggies are a great example of why I dont have a problem so much with our in an under guys its just we need the outside guys to complement them but of course I dont rate our guys with westy but as a team they do Ok an Axe will only get better,easily the best clearance player per game time going around

 

[Turbo Tiger]

Tuck & Johnno aren't the problem.  My concern is that we haven't got a single CHF prospect on our list after all this time!

CHF?
Who,s the Swans CHF?
Is Hansen in the Carey class?
In fact there is only one CHF who comes close to Carey currently playing.One Jonathon Brown.
CHF is the least of our problems

What do you mean Mad Cow? Hansen and Lynch, as powerful forwards, were OK because of a great midfield. Sydney has hall, O'Loughlin and Goodes. Port had Tredrea, and Brisbane had Brown and Lynch.

We have no power forwards, once Richo goes, and that is the hardest position to fill! Nobody trades these types, they are impossible to get!

Patto is slow and imobile, and Hughes is yet to prove anything, or convince me he has anything. We aren't going to win a flag with midgets in the key forward posts!

 

[Tango]

wont matter who is in the fwd line if the ball is down the other end all day
cant kick goals from the backline