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PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
we have a thread called rich v haw i think it redundant clearly the hawks have left us in their wake.
i think the team we should now be compared with is carlton so im starting up this thread.
why should we be compared with them? well thats obvious. both teams have had a terrible 6 yrs since we both last made finals in 2001.
our finishes have been 14. 13. 16. 12. 9. 16. carltons have been 16. 15. 11. 16. 16. 15. carlton is the only team in the comp with a worse record than us in this time.
with so many picks at around the same mark as us, carlton is the obvious team to compare to. that and the recent judd fiasco and them getting pick one the yr we got the spoon.
also another reason is that so many tiger supporters dont rate carltons list at all. yet rate ours far better even though carlton did finish above us this yr even though they were quite clearly tanking games.and even though we have had similar finishes for the last 6 yrs.
its this more than anything that has me intrigued. why dont we rate carltons kids and why do we rate ours. why do we think we will finish above them this yr when they have more experience better structure just as many promising kids coming thru if not more.
one thing we have to take into consideration is carlton were heavily penalised draft picks in 02 03 for salary cap breaches this must have an effect on their ability to draft the best kids those yrs. on the other side those yrs we were merrily trading away our early picks on recycled players.
okay players left on both teams lists from the 02 03 drafts are richmond - schulz. johnson.brown. jackson. tuck. and raines. carlton - simpson. fisher. thornton. scotland. walker. and bannister?
with wallace now at the club at the end of 04 we realise we have to go full on youth. carlton with the end of restrictions also adopt this approach.
so both clubs coming from a similar low base enter proper full on rebuild mode.
its the 04 05 06 and 07 trades/drafts that need to be compared.we probably dont have to compare the 04 lists we already know both sides are coming from a low base and are much a much.
both clubs have utilised a similar amount of 1st 2nd and 3rd round picks carlton 15 richmond 14. we have utilised 19 nd picks overall carlton have utilised 18. again almost exactly the same. so whats left? trades, rookies elevated, and psd selections. which i will go into later but will say at a glance both clubs have done okay out of those trades/drafts. with judd and stevens in carltons mix i would say they have done a bit better than us.
what it now really comes down to is how much you rate each clubs kids their player types depth and structure. both clubs have promising kids but i think carlton have it over us when it comes to depth structure and player types. imo carlton are a tad heavy in talls we are a tad heavy in outside running types. i think they can cover kps better than us atm though like us a lot are very inexperienced i think both clubs have some promising talls.
our trouble is we are relying on every single one of them to make the grade where as carlton due to greater numbers dont have this problem..
they have a very good mid onball brigade. and they have two outstanding ruck prospects though both are very inexperienced.apart from simmo .
we are relying on our younger types in these areas.
anyway no time left it would be good to hear why we rate ourselves better than carlton without letting our loathing for them interfere.
i think the team we should now be compared with is carlton so im starting up this thread.
why should we be compared with them? well thats obvious. both teams have had a terrible 6 yrs since we both last made finals in 2001.
our finishes have been 14. 13. 16. 12. 9. 16. carltons have been 16. 15. 11. 16. 16. 15. carlton is the only team in the comp with a worse record than us in this time.
with so many picks at around the same mark as us, carlton is the obvious team to compare to. that and the recent judd fiasco and them getting pick one the yr we got the spoon.
also another reason is that so many tiger supporters dont rate carltons list at all. yet rate ours far better even though carlton did finish above us this yr even though they were quite clearly tanking games.and even though we have had similar finishes for the last 6 yrs.
its this more than anything that has me intrigued. why dont we rate carltons kids and why do we rate ours. why do we think we will finish above them this yr when they have more experience better structure just as many promising kids coming thru if not more.
one thing we have to take into consideration is carlton were heavily penalised draft picks in 02 03 for salary cap breaches this must have an effect on their ability to draft the best kids those yrs. on the other side those yrs we were merrily trading away our early picks on recycled players.
okay players left on both teams lists from the 02 03 drafts are richmond - schulz. johnson.brown. jackson. tuck. and raines. carlton - simpson. fisher. thornton. scotland. walker. and bannister?
with wallace now at the club at the end of 04 we realise we have to go full on youth. carlton with the end of restrictions also adopt this approach.
so both clubs coming from a similar low base enter proper full on rebuild mode.
its the 04 05 06 and 07 trades/drafts that need to be compared.we probably dont have to compare the 04 lists we already know both sides are coming from a low base and are much a much.
both clubs have utilised a similar amount of 1st 2nd and 3rd round picks carlton 15 richmond 14. we have utilised 19 nd picks overall carlton have utilised 18. again almost exactly the same. so whats left? trades, rookies elevated, and psd selections. which i will go into later but will say at a glance both clubs have done okay out of those trades/drafts. with judd and stevens in carltons mix i would say they have done a bit better than us.
what it now really comes down to is how much you rate each clubs kids their player types depth and structure. both clubs have promising kids but i think carlton have it over us when it comes to depth structure and player types. imo carlton are a tad heavy in talls we are a tad heavy in outside running types. i think they can cover kps better than us atm though like us a lot are very inexperienced i think both clubs have some promising talls.
our trouble is we are relying on every single one of them to make the grade where as carlton due to greater numbers dont have this problem..
they have a very good mid onball brigade. and they have two outstanding ruck prospects though both are very inexperienced.apart from simmo .
we are relying on our younger types in these areas.
anyway no time left it would be good to hear why we rate ourselves better than carlton without letting our loathing for them interfere.