Skills coach

[Rosy]

I was at the Master Builders Assoc Vic Apprentice of the Year Awards night last night and Glenn Manton was the MC. He only mentioned AFL once during the night and that was when he introduced the Honourable Jacinta Allen, Minister for Skills, and he quipped that she obviously isn't involved at Richmond. :blah

I know we bemoaned the lack of a skills coach for years but I assume we have one now. Who is our skills coach? Do people think we are any better off skill wise now we have a skills coach and have put a lot more resources into recruiters?

It's a bit of a chicken and egg story really. Do the skills deteriorate when the team is going crap, or is the team going crap because we don't have the skills?

 

[Massai]

I remember when Kane Johnson first arrived at Richmond, in his first game he kicked the ball straight into Richo's chest like a bullet. Since then his skills have waned.

Skill's Coach, I don't think we've got one, two or three of them have we. It would be nice if we could get a person like Nathan Buckley as skills coach, but then we've got Ben Cousins and his skills are pretty silky smooth, IMHO he should be coaching the midfield not bloody Campbell (who did nothing much in his AFL career when compared to Cousins).

I think you can come into a club with good skill's, but if that club is struggling with poor skills in the other players, it has to effect the way you play your game as well.

Richmond's playing skills for years and years have been nothing short of woeful right back to Northey and it certainly has'nt improved under Wallace.

Hopefully whoever the new coach is, they will have the playing list go back to the bare basics of kicking, handballing, tackling and marking drills until they get it down pat and can do it in their sleep. Only then will the team skills start to improve IMHO.

 

[IanG]

I was at the Master Builders Assoc Vic Apprentice of the Year Awards night last night and Glenn Manton was the MC. He only mentioned AFL once during the night and that was when he introduced the Honourable Jacinta Allen, Minister for Skills, and he quipped that she obviously isn't involved at Richmond. :blah

I know we bemoaned the lack of a skills coach for years but I assume we have one now. Who is our skills coach? Do people think we are any better off skill wise now we have a skills coach and have put a lot more resources into recruiters?

It's a bit of a chicken and egg story really. Do the skills deteriorate when the team is going crap, or is the team going crap because we don't have the skills?

I reckon our skills are better than they appear but that for whatever reason they decline drastically under pressure. We clearly need to train more using pressure situations and probably have some of the training Massai has been talking about to get the players used to performing under pressure.

 

[TigerFurious]

IMHO he should be coaching the midfield not bloody Campbell (who did nothing much in his AFL career when compared to Cousins).

Enough with the Campbell bashing. 4 B&F's, 2 All Australians, State representation is a fair career by anyones standards. He is highly regarded by Rodney Eade from his time at the Bulldogs, is respected by football community and unlike Mr Cousins, has never been suspended for bringing the game in to disrepute.

Back on topic. Yes skills suck but it's more to do with the type of player recruited than the skills training you do. The consensus amongst coaches is that you can only marginally improve foot skills through training once a player is at AFL level.

 

[BrisTiger24]

St Kilda's skills are looking subline at the moment too. Not too many missed targets in MOnday night footy against the Pies, even under pressure. In contrast, we struggle with fluid movement of the ball. We have blokes that stream out of defence and make good position around the midfield but they always have to wait for the ball, pick it up off the ground, chase the one that goes over their head or they fumble it themselves under pressure. This allows the opposition to zone around our forward line, clogging it up so that it becomes difficult to spot up targets inside 50.

 

[Philster]

Cant't help thinking that a lot of these ex players skulk around the Clubs seeking positions as "Skills Coaches",trying to stay in the game and the easy money these positions offer.

Whenever Im down at training at Punt Rd, most Tues/Weds, I watch guys like King,McRae and Co.

There always seems to be lots of joking and carry on between them, then Kingy will wander down to the goal square and try banana shots from the bloody boundry line, now lets think for a moment how many times in a season one would need to try this shot. For starters you'd run around and open the bloody angle up, not walk straight in unless it was after the siren.
So I assume Kingy thinks that we will get many many shots at goal, AFTER the siren,on an angle where you cant see daylight......jesus.....

Why not have a bin full of balls 40 meters out, and not let players leave the ground until each one has kicked 5 in a row!!
Im in the golf game, I understand pre shot routine and how important it is to execution, Gary Player a famous player in world golf many years ago said in one of his many books,

" Once I have completed my practice and drills on my full swing, I generally proceed to the bunker where I will STAY until I have holed 10 shots.......10 bunker shots in the hole"

This is what I mean......many of these so called asisstants are ex players with no real training in other coaching area's.....they have mates in Clubs who say, "yeah sure come down and meet the boys and we'll work something out"

RFC need to get better than that......How many assistants did Tommy have?

 

[Massai]

Back on topic. Yes skills suck but it's more to do with the type of player recruited than the skills training you do. The consensus amongst coaches is that you can only marginally improve foot skills through training once a player is at AFL level.
[/quote]

Well if the consensus amongst the coaches is that you can only marginally improve foot skills through training once a player is at AFL level, then perhaps the said player should not be at AFL level then. That won't leave many prospective draftee's at the National Draft.

That means the draft is a complete and utter waste of time, unless you happen to pick up a Cotchin, Judd, Cousin's etc who have all the necessary skills and talent in place.

I find it incrediable that a player could not improve on their foot skills at AFL level. If professional sportsmen and women from other sports can improve their skills, AFL players should be able to do likewise.

If a golfer who turns professional and starts ranked at 1000 in the world, then works really hard on their game and golf swing, suddenly by sheer hard practice wins a few events and a major, of course their ranking goes up and they've improved their game considerably to do it. No difference tennis players hitting the bloody ball, or cricketers, hockey players, soccer players etc.

After all, the player simply has to drop the ball on to his foot and get his distance right to another player, practice, practice, practice that has to be the key to improvement. Anything else sounds like a bloody big cop out to me.

 

[Massai]

Cant't help thinking that a lot of these ex players skulk around the Clubs seeking positions as "Skills Coaches",trying to stay in the game and the easy money these positions offer.

Whenever Im down at training at Punt Rd, most Tues/Weds, I watch guys like King,McRae and Co.

There always seems to be lots of joking and carry on between them, then Kingy will wander down to the goal square and try banana shots from the bloody boundry line, now lets think for a moment how many times in a season one would need to try this shot. For starters you'd run around and open the bloody angle up, not walk straight in unless it was after the siren.
So I assume Kingy thinks that we will get many many shots at goal, AFTER the siren,on an angle where you cant see daylight......jesus.....

Why not have a bin full of balls 40 meters out, and not let players leave the ground until each one has kicked 5 in a row!!
Im in the golf game, I understand pre shot routine and how important it is to execution, Gary Player a famous player in world golf many years ago said in one of his many books,

" Once I have completed my practice and drills on my full swing, I generally proceed to the bunker where I will STAY until I have holed 10 shots.......10 bunker shots in the hole"

This is what I mean......many of these so called asisstants are ex players with no real training in other coaching area's.....they have mates in Clubs who say, "yeah sure come down and meet the boys and we'll work something out"

RFC need to get better than that......How many assistants did Tommy have?

Being a golfer myself I have my routine's and practice, I'll practice for an hour, play 18 holes then back on the practice for another couple of hours, working on things I think I need to tune up on, be it driving, chipping, putting, sand shot, out of the rough, whatever needs to be done.

I agree, the players should have a bundle of balls, then they have to kick the ball at the goals from different angles and distances, they each have to kick 5 goals, no one showers until they've done it all.

Tommy is totally different to TW. Tommy had a simple game plan, play the game hard, drill his players hard and kept things as simple as possible - it worked too.

 

[geoffryprettyboy]

Last time I checked I thought Wallace, Royal, King, Campbell & Rawlings looked after honing skills at the club. When you look at what they are being paid annually and you add their experience there is no need for a 'Skills Coach'.

Close to $2M spent annually on these blokes, these blokes haven't added any value to our skills.

 

[mb64]

Last time I checked I thought Wallace, Royal, King, Campbell & Rawlings looked after honing skills at the club. When you look at what they are being paid annually and you add their experience there is no need for a 'Skills Coach'.

Close to $2M spent annually on these blokes, these blokes haven't added any value to our skills.

I'm sure there will be new skills coaches at the club next year with the new coach.Not sure who will be retained from the current lot.

 

[The_General]

I posted this elsewhere on the boards, but basically I've been lead to believe that we practice our skills (particularly kicking) a lot.

The problem is we don't practice them under simulated match day conditions. Eg No pressure when someone is practicing kicking at training, as they don't want players to get hurt.

I used to get told something by my junior coaches, and it wasn't anything new or revolutionary.

"Practice makes perfect is *smile*. Perfect practice makes perfect. Train like you're going to play, or don't bother training at all".

 

[Dyer Disciple]

I posted this elsewhere on the boards, but basically I've been lead to believe that we practice our skills (particularly kicking) a lot.

The problem is we don't practice them under simulated match day conditions. Eg No pressure when someone is practicing kicking at training, as they don't want players to get hurt.

I used to get told something by my junior coaches, and it wasn't anything new or revolutionary.

"Practice makes perfect is *smile*. Perfect practice makes perfect. Train like you're going to play, or don't bother training at all".

Totally agree General, I was staggered when you told me this. Explains a lot though.

 

[geoffryprettyboy]

Train like you're going to play, or don't bother training at all".

Maybe they should replace the HURT sign with the one above.

 

[tommystigers]

I remember reading something a generation ago about Gary Dempsey IIRC. He would practice goal-kicking with a rubbish bin placed behind the goal and aim at getting the ball in the bin. Johnny Wilkinson English Rugby Union goal kicker would be practising long after everyone else had finished training and on days off. The guy is a goal kicking freak. His accuracy is a reflection of how he trains.
I don't know about our players, very few of them would be rated as good finishers when it comes to kicking goals. It probably reflects the way they train.

 

[sportshow]

I reckon our skills are better than they appear but that for whatever reason they decline drastically under pressure.

its because we have either no or poor game plan, our skills aren't that bad i don't believe, but made to look worse because there is zero structure in front of the players, if you handle the ball more than the opposition (for less result) of course you are going to turn the ball over.

i think this is the root of all our problems and why TW and those responsible for the game plan flaw must go.

i am tipping the turnaround in on field performance would be dramatic if players knew, and believed in, a quality plan of attack.

we don't have 40 players on the list that could never kick, and as has been said the skills are being focussed on, but that is no use if they aren't being able to be implemented through a properly structured game plan ........... having someone in the forward half when players are coming off the HBF would be a good place to start! :duh

 

[IanG]

I posted this elsewhere on the boards, but basically I've been lead to believe that we practice our skills (particularly kicking) a lot.

The problem is we don't practice them under simulated match day conditions. Eg No pressure when someone is practicing kicking at training, as they don't want players to get hurt.

Yeah in 2007 we got a lot of injuries in the pre-season from hard training, in 2008 and 2009 also one presumes they decided to cut back on simulated match training to lessen the injuries. The slow start to 2008 should have been a warning that it shouldn't be done.

 

[CarnTheTiges]

The word skills when mentioned in relation to the RFC is an oxymoron.

 

[TigerMasochist]

It's been mentioned in other threads and reported in the media that all footy clubs do very little in the way of goal kicking skill work.
Clubs do plenty of fitness, rehab, general move the ball round and round or up and down the ground playing drills and plenty of team meetings / tactics stuff.
You would think that with the value of a goal being six times the value of " oops nearly" that all clubs would put a priority on finishing the job once the ball was inside the forward line.
Same thing with general skills, recruit players with better skills. Less athleticism is required if you hit your teammate correctly with a disposal rather than chasing his direct opponent back the other way up the ground because you missed.
Train the players skills with plenty of pressure applied on the ball possessor to ensure his skills are solid.
Commit players who constantly turn the ball over under match pressure to specific remedial training drills to try and improve their standard.

One thing that remains a bugbear is the lack of proper skills coaching for junior footballers, far to many coaches and clubs are concerned with nothing more than trying to win the next game instead of properly developing young talents along a career pathway. Many of the skill faults young players have are ingrained by the time they reach the elite under age levels and even then don't recieve enough work to rectify.