Talking Politics

[Liverpool]

Interesting reading everyones comments on the next Labour leader.
Rudd? Gillard? who cares... :...the only way the Libs could lose it would be to do something stupid,

They've done plenty of "stupid" sh!t during their 10 years and the Labor party still don't look they could possibly win the next election.

Gypsy,
Thats cause Labour are just so incompetent.
How can they be trusted to run a country, when they are running around back-stabbing each other.
Then you have someone like Latham...just imagine if he was our PM...we'd have no allies at all, with his boorish and rude behaviour.
Beazley is having his 2nd go as leader after failing miserably the first time....and can't see with the way things are going at the moment, that anything is any different to Beazley's reign compared to the last one.
Just wondering....what "stupid *smile*" have the Libs done that has made you so angry towards them?

 

[an_oxford_man]

Just wondering....what "stupid sh!t" have the Libs done that has made you so angry towards them?

I suppose the first thing that springs to mind is how Johnny has supported the U.S's invasion of Iraq despite the U.N's firm stance on the issue.

 

[jb03]

Just wondering....what "stupid sh!t" have the Libs done that has made you so angry towards them?

I suppose the first thing that springs to mind is how Johnny has supported the U.S's invasion of Iraq despite the U.N's firm stance on the issue.

Normally admire your posts gyps but hanging a point on the UN being some sort of arbiter of what is fine and dandy or morally right is silly. The UN are possibly the only body in more of a shambles than Fed ALP (or Vic state Libs)

 

[jb03]

Agree, but it won't happen. They are too intelligent.

Andy, it is this sort of 'blame the electorate' thinking that is preventing the ALP moving forward and ever winning power. The ALP are forever blaming everyone else for not being able to attract enough votes. People will vote for intelligent leaders but that alone is not enough.

 

[Ready]

I find it hilariously funny that people think Howard and Costello were responsible for the economic reforms of the 1980s. The problem is that the ALP have been unable to sell their economic credentials.

Similarly there is just as much factional infighting and backstabbing in the Liberal Party as there is in the ALP, but the Liberals are able to conceal it better. They are also better at keeping their black sheep -- the small-l liberals like Petro Georgiou -- under wraps most of the time.

I used to think Gillard would never lead the ALP because she's in the wrong faction. Now I'm not so sure. She's fast becoming the only hope. She's intelligent but she's shrewd and streetsmart as well, much more so than Carmen Lawrence or Cheryl Kernot. Rudd is a smug bastard and comes across as such. And if the conservatives run a smear campaign on her private life it'll backfire badly.

Won't happen by 2007 (unless Costello comes in and blunders badly, or the economy goes pear-shaped in a hurry -- don't believe the latter can't happen). Beazley will lead the ALP to a respectable loss. Then Gillard comes in with the newly elected member for Maribyrnong, Bill Shorten, as her deputy in a tilt for 2010.

 

[Anduril]

I find it hilariously funny that people think Howard and Costello were responsible for the economic reforms of the 1980s. The problem is that the ALP have been unable to sell their economic credentials.

Similarly there is just as much factional infighting and backstabbing in the Liberal Party as there is in the ALP, but the Liberals are able to conceal it better. They are also better at keeping their black sheep -- the small-l liberals like Petro Georgiou -- under wraps most of the time.

I used to think Gillard would never lead the ALP because she's in the wrong faction. Now I'm not so sure. She's fast becoming the only hope. She's intelligent but she's shrewd and streetsmart as well, much more so than Carmen Lawrence or Cheryl Kernot. Rudd is a smug bastard and comes across as such. And if the conservatives run a smear campaign on her private life it'll backfire badly.

Won't happen by 2007 (unless Costello comes in and blunders badly, or the economy goes pear-shaped in a hurry -- don't believe the latter can't happen). Beazley will lead the ALP to a respectable loss. Then Gillard comes in with the newly elected member for Maribyrnong, Bill Shorten, as her deputy in a tilt for 2010.

Spot on Ready!
Liverpool it's LabOr.

Agree, but it won't happen. They are too intelligent.

Andy, it is this sort of 'blame the electorate' thinking that is preventing the ALP moving forward and ever winning power. The ALP are forever blaming everyone else for not being able to attract enough votes. People will vote for intelligent leaders but that alone is not enough.

Am not "blaming the electorate". And I doubt the ALP are as well, they are too busy trying to keep their heads above water right now. Read John Harms' article in Saturday's Age re intelligence and leaders.
Read opinion pieces constantly castigating "chardonnay sipping latte drinking elitists". Listen to Nelson's attacks on the Education sector (still). The Liberal Party know to portray themselves as the common man, especially Howard. Keeps the electorate happy and feeling safe.

Both parties lack vision or the will to inspire.

 

[eight ace]

Ironic, Liverpool, that you would criticise Beasley for the fact that he is a recycled leader. Your much admired leader of the parliamentary Liberal Party and esteemed head of government has been through a very similar process himself. Do you really think Howard's government is wholly, or even largely responsible for our economic position at present? Have there been any significant structural reforms under his reign - not counting the GST which was hardly his idea - and Workchoices, the benefits of which we are yet to see?

 

[tigersnake]

Yep, the Fed Labor party seem a talentless rabble at the moment.  But so did the Fed Coalition from 1983-1995.  I think the Liberals will lose government on the gutting of worker's rights under the workplace changes.  Its just a question of how long they take to affect a critical mass of people.  It might be the next election, if not, the one after that.

 

[Liverpool]

Anduril,
I've always spelt Labour with a "U" in it...must be the school I went to ....either way, they are "laborious" (after watching Beazley talk over O'Brien time and time again, and not directly answer a single question) to watch.
And you can spell that any way you like! ;D

Eight-Ace,
Thats true, Howard is recycled like you say...but I think the decisions that Johnny/Libs have made regarding Iraq, illegal-immigrants, republic/flag debate, not saying 'sorry' to the Aboriginals, and economic deals have been sound, and good for the country.
Of course, I don't expect much support from the ALP-voters on this thread, and thats understandable.
Its easy to bag the workplace-reforms, but we don't know yet how it actually will affect everyone, and we still haven't heard (Beazley was asked again tonight, and dodged the question quicker than a Lids sidestep! :hihi) whether the ALP will change it if they get into power anyways....so I wouldn't be too quick you ALPers to condemn the Workplace reforms just yet, as there is certainly no guarantee that the ALP will change it if they get into power, just like I doubt they would get rid of the GST if they made it into power tomorrow either.

 

[Rosy]

the GST

 

[nitrotiger]

Bit of a tough caper to make heads or tails outta politics nowadays.....Im not to the left or to the right....In the immortal words of that wonderful Singer?songwriter Mike McClelland...
"im not into Jazz dont know where its at.....Im just somewhere in between"

HAVING COME FROM qld....i RECKON THE LABOUR GOVT IS DOIN ok....BUT THATS BECAUSE THE OPPOSITION IS SO inept,stupid and mundane,Ya wouldnt give em the light of day so they could reads instructions on how to SURVIVE!
DOWN HERE...(In Vic)It seems to me that Bracksy and his mob are very elitist,arrogant when it comes to infrastructure,tollways,public transport and bein accountable......But    Like QLD....The opposition seem inept,
incompetent.......
Now Nationaly.......anyone who has a sense of history of Australia KNOW that in times of international strife,bubble ,trouble and turmoil,the population always err towards a CONSERVATIVE GOVERNMENT.WHY?
CAUSE THEY HAVE A history OF BEING DSISIVE AND PRO-ACTIVE...nOW BEFORE ANY SO-CALLED 2 BOB ACADEMICS START ON ME....Sorry.....game....set and match....look at history for what it is......
What Labur have got to do is collectively THROW AWAY their degrees,doctorates,diplomasand ALL THAT *smile*....and do some study in how the REAL WORLD WORKS....and make an effort to REPRESENT THE MAINSTREAM AUSSIE instead of drooling over their fringe benefits,their overweight superannuation entitlements and GET THEIR EDUCATION IN THE REAL WORLD.....
There are so many so-called educated types who HAVE NO IDEA WHATSOEVER....
probably wouldnt know what its like to enjoy the satisfaction of HARD WORK WELL DONE.....
JUST LIKE THOSE collins street farmers drivin toorak tractors.......
Then.....(sigh)...

The labour govrnement might have an outside chance of being in power......

And another thing that would help(exuse me mod-squad)

*smile* OFF Local and state government tiers...that,ll save the country squillions I reckon......

Im goin now Ive gone and made meself CROSS again.......

 

[Rosy]

Im goin now Ive gone and made meself CROSS again.......

Poor nitrous.....it's only politics. They're as bad as one another. Not worth getting cross over. :grouphug

Did I ever tell anyone I hate GST and doing the BAS. Now I'm cross. ;D

 

[nitrotiger]

Itrs awlright...Im better now rosy...coutesy of a cougar on ice........Just cant wait for footy season to start....geez those pussycatkitties *smile* me off bigtime......

 

[Liverpool]

nitrotiger,
While I agree with some of your post :clap:

"In Vic)It seems to me that Bracksy and his mob are very elitist,arrogant when it comes to infrastructure,tollways,public transport and bein accountable......But Like QLD....The opposition seem inept,
incompetent.......
Now Nationaly.......anyone who has a sense of history of Australia KNOW that in times of international strife,bubble ,trouble and turmoil,the population always err towards a CONSERVATIVE GOVERNMENT.WHY?
CAUSE THEY HAVE A history OF BEING DSISIVE AND PRO-ACTIVE"

However, I don't agree with you continually having a crack at people who have uni-degrees and the like
Not all people with diplomas and degrees are Labour voters, or of the 'left' persuasion....and not all people with a 'good education' go round protesting against the war in Iraq by painting national icons, or throwing eggs at the PM's car, etc.

You said:
"There are so many so-called educated types who HAVE NO IDEA WHATSOEVER"

I'd like to think some of us "educated types" do have an idea!

 

[nitrotiger]

Point taken liverpool...once again i get me blinkers on when I get a little cross....Just from personal experience,thats all.........so if any offence taken...Im sorry.......You sound like to me to have a really good BALANCE of what goes on....have enjoyed reading quite a few of youre posts.....
I wish I had the opportunity to go to uni or overseas to study.........I believe in the saying that you never stop learning.......
where I get defensive is when you get minorities pushing their own agendas onto the mainstream.......and when you DRE to disagree....youre narrow...minded and stuff.....Ive had Heaps of ththose sort of people lay that on me....
all because Im aussie and believe in live and let live but......if you wanna live in our country....ya live by OUR LAWS.....as would be expected of me if I chose to live in the states,the U.K.Timbuctoo....or Hong Kong for that matter.......anyway thats my 2 bobs worth........Ill stick to bein Nitro i think!Cheers! ;D

 

[an_oxford_man]

Thats true, Howard is recycled like you say...but I think the decisions that Johnny/Libs have made regarding Iraq, illegal-immigrants, republic/flag debate, not saying 'sorry' to the Aboriginals, and economic deals have been sound, and good for the country.

I didn't agree with your post, Liverpool. I was particulary disturbed by the highlighted point.

How has that been good for the country?

 

[tigersnake]

Can't beleive people swallow that guff (Gypsy's Liverpool quote that is). It seems that the Howard government can engage in any number of morally and economically questionable deals, but so long as the economy is OK, they'll vote for him. But here is the clincher, they have actually had very little to do with the economic boom times of the last 12 years or so. Its not just us pinkos saying this, such Leninist rags as the Financial Review and the Australian have said the same thing often.

I found it amazing that in the last election campaign people actually swallowed the line that Howard could keep interest rates low, like he has some control over global economic markets.

 

[TigerForce]

Thats true, Howard is recycled like you say...but I think the decisions that Johnny/Libs have made regarding Iraq, illegal-immigrants, republic/flag debate, not saying 'sorry' to the Aboriginals, and economic deals have been sound, and good for the country.

I didn't agree with your post, Liverpool. I was particulary disturbed by the highlighted point.

How has that been good for the country?   

If Johnny Coward is up himself with his famous 'walks' , let's see him do a real walkabout in the never never.

 

[pahoffm]

Talking politics,

Simon Crean turned up to my son's cricket final on Saturday.
He came to see how the local teams were going.

Very nice of him.

I took a photo of him between the 2 club presidents.

 

[mb64]

Talking polotics,

Simon Crean turned up to my son's cricket final on Saturday.
He came to see how the local teams were going.

Very nice of him.

Looked to be in pre-selection trouble but got through okay.Pressure on Beazley.