Talking Politics

[Tiger74]

Under Rudd's 'workplace laws....all these are supposedly illegal as well.
Like I stated in an earlier post....Rudd would have had to make compromises to gain the union support during the campaign.
It will be interesting if such 'old tricks' that you name above, now that he is in power, are sacrificed from his reforms to appease the unions.
The big test, I feel for his and his credibility.

Completely agree. One thing in is favor though is the result. This was NOT a union win, Rudd did it inspite of the union millstone. He owes them much less than previous ALP Prime Ministers

 

[ssstone]

I think this says more than sorry anyway:

I think we are beginning to see how much we owe the indigenous Australians and how much we have lost by living so apart.

I said we non-indigenous Australians should try to imagine the Aboriginal view.

as ive posted before ,i saw your god in a northen community tell the elders "we will help you only if you help yourselves" and they obviously didnt.cause paul the god didnt help them

 

[Disco08]

Who's my god? And that statement can mean many different things depending on the context.

 

[Liverpool]

Livers i think you'll find that the whole 'sorry' debate came after keating's pmship. I might be wrong, but thats how i remember it. otherwise he would have done it.

So the Aborigines only felt the need for someone to say 'sorry' post-1996?
Give me a break Sixpack.

I think this says more than sorry anyway:
I think we are beginning to see how much we owe the indigenous Australians and how much we have lost by living so apart.
I said we non-indigenous Australians should try to imagine the Aboriginal view.

Disco,
Howard also did numerous speeches where he spoke about Aborigines, reconciliation, and deep regret for what has happened int he past....however, this didn't seem good enough....they HAD to hear the word 'sorry'.

It will be interesting to see if Rudd says it, as I have read/heard conflicting reports about whether he will or not.
The last time I heard anything was last Friday night on Channel-9 where he said he WOULD say sorry.
We'll see...
The lawyers would be drooling at the mouth as I speak... :hihi

 

[AngryAnt]

And as for 'international relations'...mouthing off at the Malaysian PM by calling him "a recalcitrant" and getting called the 'Lizard of Oz' for manhandling the Queen on her visit...some of his more finer moments.

You are all style and no substance on this Liverpool. A comment about Mahathir who was a genuine nut and said much worse things about us and the West (but points to you for siding with Muslim leader though) and touching the Queen gently on the back - I respect the old dear but seriously, I don't want to have her, or even Charles/Camilla as our heads of state. If that's all you have against Keating's foreign affairs then you have to try harder.

Look at what was achieved under Keating - the establishment of APEC as a powerful economic forum with potential to rival the EC and a massive strengthening of political, diplomatic and economic ties to Asia. I know you don't particularly like it Poolman but our economic future is tied absolutely to Asia - looking back to Europe or admiringly across at the US doesn't help us.

Contrast this to Howard's posturing - the deputy policeman of the region, fawning to George Bush and committing us to a dirty war in the Middle East.

 

[ssstone]

ahh aint it great having labor back in power????? im waiting for some sandstone to clear the docks so we can get working and guess who went on strike today?now that helps me meet my schedule and pay my labourer .just a taste of things to come i fear .

 

[Disco08]

Did the wharfies go on strike today? That's hilarious. (sorry I know it sucks for you and alot of others but two days into Labor's term is amusing).

 

[ssstone]

Did the wharfies go on strike today? That's hilarious. (sorry I know it sucks for you and alot of others but two days into Labor's term is amusing).

sure did auspicious start aint it

 

[Disco08]

If this is a sign of things to come....... :-X

 

[ssstone]

If this is a sign of things to come....... :-X

yeh with his flip flop on the sorry word after listening him dodge and speak around the issue last thurs on 3 aw i wonder the pup we've been sold?

 

[Six Pack]

would you have rathered that keating kissed her majesty's arse, Livers?

 

[mb64]

If this is a sign of things to come....... :-X

Unfortunately it will be.Rudd needs to make a stance very quickly.

 

[Liverpool]

The Chinese Govt is actually trying to discourage "low-rent"industries like toy manufacture and clothing, and encourage growth in electronics and digital technology. While your plasma is likely to be a Samsung or LG screen (regardless of name), the odds of your LCD being Chinese are rising each year, with more and more LCD factories opening up in China (which is why the things are so cheap now compared to previous years).
The cheaper production is moving to Vietnam, India and so on, as Chinese wages are also on the rise. This is not an overnight issue, but one which is already influencing the decisions on new factories.
As for Australia, the move is more to the services area, with this now making up a massive part of the economy (sorry - cannot remember %age). Even in manufacturing, this leads to situations where an Australian company designs the product, markets the product, distributes the product, but its made in China.
It should be noted, this is where the $$$ are made. The Chinese make SFA manufacturing, and only make $$$ with massive volumes that deliver economies of scale benefits (which is also a pusher for smaller orders to more flexible manufacturers in India for instance).

Tiger74,
That's right mate....like I said on a previous post...the Chinese are starting to catch us in the areas that Antman believes we need to concentrate on to be 'comparitive' to the Chinese.
It is easier said than done though even though I believe we are still ahead of China on most fronts apart from labour costs.
The Chinese are also working hard in this area.
And like you noted...other areas of Asia are becoming more developed similar to what China was 10-20 years ago by churning out product, cheaply, mainly due to their low overheads (especially labour).
It is the price we pay for having a better lifestyle than they do however.

 

[AngryAnt]

Tiger74,
That's right mate....like I said on a previous post...the Chinese are starting to catch us in the areas that Antman believes we need to concentrate on to be 'comparitive' to the Chinese.
It is easier said than done though even though I believe we are still ahead of China on most fronts apart from labour costs.
The Chinese are also working hard in this area.
And like you noted...other areas of Asia are becoming more developed similar to what China was 10-20 years ago by churning out product, cheaply, mainly due to their low overheads (especially labour).
It is the price we pay for having a better lifestyle than they do however.

Arrrggghh I'm getting the flogging the dead horse thing again. What T74 describes is exactly the point of competitive and comparative advantage theory. Didn't I mention knowledge and service based industries?

I could swear I did.

But that's OK - I am used to having concepts I introduce to the discussion suddenly appropriated and claimed by you to be yours all along.

 

[Liverpool]

Unfortunately it will be.Rudd needs to make a stance very quickly.

I agree.
He has to show his mettle from the off.....and i think that is what he is trying to do: prove to the Australian people that we ARE getting what some of us voted for (signing Kyoto, saying 'sorry', etc)....but to me, it has always been how he will handle the unions and what compromises he made to the unions behind closed doors to gain their support during the election campaign.
That will show is worth to us......or not.

But that's OK - I am used to having concepts I introduce to the discussion suddenly appropriated and claimed by you to be yours all along.

What concepts did I say were my own, Antman? ???
You accused me of this on another post also.

Knowledge and service based industries are all well and good mate...but you also need to have a handle on the manufacturing side of things.
We don't want to become a nation relying on imports from China and the entire workforce here works in large warehouses where the junk is stored.
It has gone down that way a lot over the years....the last job I was at, that is exactly what happened...they drifted away from manufacturing themselves and more or less, became an importer.

 

[ssstone]

knowledge and service has worked well in moe thus far hasnt it? i know paul,joan and mr garrison cant understand it,but some australians were born to use their hands.to think and introduce/ignore policy otherwise is just plain snobbery.but that is the way of the leftist elite.

 

[Six Pack]

i live down Geelong way, SS and a lot of the the leftwing vote comes from ford workers. Are they part of yr 'elite.'

(sorry my original post got filtered for some reason)

 

[ssstone]

i live down Geelong way, SS and a lot of the 'levote comes from the tradies and the guys and gals working at Ford. is that part of yr 'elite?'

comprehension>?

 

[AngryAnt]

What concepts did I say were my own, Antman? ???
You accused me of this on another post also.

The sad thing is you don't even seem to be aware you are doing it.

You - we need to reduce labour costs to compete with China.
Me - we will never be able compete with China on labour costs - we have to compete in other ways.
You - China has lower production costs due largely to cheaper labour costs.
Me - I already said that.
You - Therefore, we need to reduce our labour costs.

Good one.

Knowledge and service... manufacturing..

We need to promote smart manufacturing in areas we have a comparative (note the spelling) advantage in, yes. Manufacturing industries where we don't, no.
You still don't understand the concept, do you? The situation T74 described is a good example - components manufactured in China, but designed, assembled, marketed in Australia. Also known as value-adding. T74 also correctly points out that China (as happened in Japan and Korea previously) is already shifting manufacturing offshore to countries with cheaper labour and production costs still.

We don't want to become a nation relying on imports from China and the entire workforce here works in large warehouses where the junk is stored.

Well, great. When you have a strategy to grow manufacturing in Australia other than by reducing labour costs, I'd love to hear it because I haven't heard a single positive strategy out of you yet.

It has gone down that way a lot over the years....the last job I was at, that is exactly what happened...they drifted away from manufacturing themselves and more or less, became an importer.

Yeah, because they couldn't compete at manufacturing whatever it was - they had a choice. Start manufacturing something we have a comparative advantage in (hard) or import and sell (easier). Or value-adding as described by T74.

 

[AngryAnt]

knowledge and service has worked well in moe thus far hasnt it? i know paul,joan and mr garrison cant understand it,but some australians were born to use their hands.to think and introduce/ignore policy otherwise is just plain snobbery.but that is the way of the leftist elite.

That may be true of the leftist elite but I actually I doubt it. Certainly not true of me.

Plenty of occupations, industries, services where people can use their hands and this will always be true. For example there is a total dearth of tradies of all sorts - construction is another boom area, agriculture etc. Don't have a problem with that.

I do have a problem with the country desperately propping up industries that are well past their use by date resulting in consumers paying much much more for goods that should be a lot cheaper.