Talking Politics

[Ian4]

this bill is nothing short of appalling. We should be protected from religious people, not the other way around (especially children). I wouldn’t be surprised if federal Labor voted it in. They are a centre right party at the end of the day. But Andrews has already said he will challenge it in court if it passes.

I reckon they have now lost this argument in the eyes of the public. Doesn’t bode well for the election.

why? because they may have handdled one bill wrongly?

 

[eZyT]

This RDB is morrisons Tampa.

Just as Turnbull used gay marriage to not face climate
Change and NBN,

Morrison is using RDB to not talk about what a corrupt incompetant horrible psycho he is.

But Labor are all over it. They completely grasp the lengths LNP will go to for power.

Not only have Labor 1. Not fallen for the wedge, they have

2. Shoved morrisons wedge deep up his arse by having 5 cross the floor.

Very impressive pragmatism and strategy by Labor.

I think Albo is has the makings of a good PM

* note i need some intellectual help - last night on 730 i found myself agreeing with a point simon birmingham made about the RDB - what am i missing?

The point was - if a student at a girls school transitions to a boy, they should go to a boys school shouldnt they? I completely understand this this is a straw person, but that aside, its an intellectually and maybe morally sound point isnt it?

And this is why Morrison is making it the hill he will appear to die on; it is riddled with every kind of landmine.

If i am being perfectly honest, in the scheme of issues we face, i couldnt give a *smile* about a trans kid getting expelled from St.Joeys, just as i couldnt give a *smile* about Barry and Bruce walking down the aisle at their dream wedding.

Im all for equality and tolerance,

But theres bigger fish to fry

And im pretty sure albo agrees

 

[eZyT]

Grace Tame is a total badass.

She really is,

But i got the sense shes been reading too much of her own press, saying as such.

I thought her press club performance yesterday was a touch hammy. A bit OTT?

at least name the threatening department?

A completely anonymous, insinuated LNP threat, in the current climate,

Comes across as a bit of a lame pile-on,

And cheapens the proper stuff,

IMO.

Further, i know shes only 26, but winking at Albonese during her performance is pretty brash and dumb.

* harsh criticism, i know. I love what she brings and seems a very cool and good person who punches way above her weight.

 

[DavidSSS]

Its dumb tactics from Labor - if they didn’t like the bill they should have just voted against it - surely it’s a principle thing. Even PrettyCoat said the bill wasn’t needed.

I reckon they have now lost this argument in the eyes of the public. Doesn’t bode well for the election.

We shall see, but the other thing to remember is that the vast majority of the electorate will not change their vote on this issue, but those who are heavily invested in their religion might. So Labor are trying to placate those who may change their vote and not upset those less likely to and also avoiding being wedged by the LNP. Remember too that if the LNP wedge Labor on this they will have active support from a lot of the media.

DS

 

[Ridley]

She really is,

But i got the sense shes been reading too much of her own press, saying as such.

I thought her press club performance yesterday was a touch hammy. A bit OTT?

at least name the threatening department?

A completely anonymous, insinuated LNP threat, in the current climate,

Comes across as a bit of a lame pile-on,

And cheapens the proper stuff,

IMO.

Further, i know shes only 26, but winking at Albonese during her performance is pretty brash and dumb.

* harsh criticism, i know. I love what she brings and seems a very cool and good person who punches way above her weight.

I think that is fair criticism ezy. She seems a very impressive person. She has developed a fearless warrior persona who speaks her mind without fear or favour. After what she has been through as a child that takes some serious character and fortitude.

But I must say I wasn't that impressed by her speech yesterday. Particularly her reticence to name the organisation and person who called her. She has never shied away from that in the past; why did she do decide to do it in this speech. To me it lessened the effect; just seemed she wanted to throw another jab at Dudmo. If she was going to mention the incident she should have gone all in.

 

[Brodders17]

I reckon they have now lost this argument in the eyes of the public.

how so? ignoring the ins and outs of the actual legislation, like most will do, 5 government members voted with Labor, against Morrison, Joyce and the Lib/Nats. how can anyone see that as a "loss".

politically i can understand why Labor want it settled. The Libs/Nats with the help of the major MSM in this country, will be pushing that Labor are trying to pass laws to force all kids to become trans, and to force religious schools to encourage it, or other nonsense. and many will read the headlines and believe it.

the libs cant win on leadership, the cant win on personalities, they cant win on climate, they cant win on covid, the shouldnt win on the economy, they cant win on aged care, on the NDIS, on health, on support for those who need it, they cant win on education.

they need an issue to give them hope, because they are f'n hopeless.

 

[eZyT]

I think that is fair criticism ezy. She seems a very impressive person. She has developed a fearless warrior persona who speaks her mind without fear or favour. After what she has been through as a child that takes some serious character and fortitude.

But I must say I wasn't that impressed by her speech yesterday. Particularly her reticence to name the organisation and person who called her. She has never shied away from that in the past; why did she do decide to do it in this speech. To me it lessened the effect; just seemed she wanted to throw another jab at Dudmo. If she was going to mention the incident she should have gone all in.

Yeah.

Maybe her lawyers called it,

But dont build it up like your gonna drop a nuke,

And pull out a waterpistol.

But shes 26 and cool

 

[Redford]

The whole gender thing is just getting so complex and difficult.

I’ve got a friend who is a 20+ year teacher at a prestigious Melbourne girls school. He teaches teenagers.

A couple of years ago he was telling me about a student who does not recognise themselves as being female. The student, along with the parents who support the student, refuse to be referenced in any form whatsoever as being female. This extends to the student not being called by their Christian name which…say for the sake of the story…is “Jane.” The student can only be referenced via their surname or “it” or “they”.

But it gets more difficult. In any group setting that the child is in, the teachers and staff can not refer to the group as a collective female group e.g. “Ok girls pack up your thing we are getting on the bus now…”. The student and parents have complained about being discriminated against by teachers and staff when any collective female reference is made. They have also made complaints about other students who have not only made innocuous reference (they are kids after all) to the student in a female context, but also anything about being female as a collective group as well.

The parents and the student are constantly complaining to the school that they don’t cater to the student’s cross gender identity. They complain that the school’s activities, programs etc don’t cater to their child.

The school has had to modify all its comms etc to be gender neutral which is very difficult to manage in a single sex school. The school, teachers, staff and students are constantly on edge and the school is constantly having to refer to various bodies and controls for advice.

But of course the parents don’t want to send the child to a male or even mixed school. They want her current school and 99.999% of the other students and staff to turn themselves upside down to cater for the child.

It’s insane what he described. Actually I think the child may have graduated/left by now which my friend was saying the school couldn’t wait to happen quick enough.

Gender reference, discrimination etc....its all getting very complex and hard to manage in a lot of situations.

 

[Baloo]

She really is,

But i got the sense shes been reading too much of her own press, saying as such.

I thought her press club performance yesterday was a touch hammy. A bit OTT?

at least name the threatening department?

A completely anonymous, insinuated LNP threat, in the current climate,

Comes across as a bit of a lame pile-on,

And cheapens the proper stuff,

IMO.

Further, i know shes only 26, but winking at Albonese during her performance is pretty brash and dumb.

* harsh criticism, i know. I love what she brings and seems a very cool and good person who punches way above her weight.

You realise Tame is on the autism spectrum right? Odd quirks in social settings is quite common for people on the spectrum.

 

[Baloo]

Its dumb tactics from Labor - if they didn’t like the bill they should have just voted against it - surely it’s a principle thing. Even PrettyCoat said the bill wasn’t needed.

I reckon they have now lost this argument in the eyes of the public. Doesn’t bode well for the election.

Dunno, it's looking like it's falling into place and the loudest supporters of the Bill want ScoMo to withdraw it.

The Christian lobby is now saying the government should withdraw its religious discrimination bill as it has been “completely undermined” by the simultaneous changes to the Sex Discrimination Act.

In a statement, the Australian Christian Lobby’s Wendy Francis said the bill was intended to help faith-based schools, “but [changes to the act] now do more harm than good”:

The Australian Christian Lobby withdraws its support for the Religious Discrimination Bill package and calls on the Morrison Government to now withdraw the Bills from the Senate.
Taking away protections for Christian schools is a price too high to pay for the passage of the Religious Discrimination Bill. The amendments voted on by Labor, independents and these Liberal MPs unnecessarily interfere with the operation of faith-based schools.
With the amendments so damaging to religious freedom, the Government should immediately withdraw the bills.

Given the earlier remarks from senator Amanda Stoker, it would appear that this is a live option.

 

[eZyT]

You realise Tame is on the autism spectrum right? Odd quirks in social settings is quite common for people on the spectrum.

Didnt realise, but thought she was a bit Greta Thunberg- like so makes sense.

Thanks for pointing out

 

[eZyT]

Not harsh at all Ezy, absolutely insightful.

Unfortunately for a large part of yesterday she came across as a smug smart arse without much intellectual gravitas. The speech was mostly ok but the hypocrisy of wanting to drag abuse and abusers into the light and then not naming the person who allegedly pressured her was staggering.

The Q and A session was where it got really bad though. Barely answered a question seriously and was outright disrespectful on a number of occasions. I understand she has issues with mainstream media but a couple of times her sarcasm and expressions towards women asking her questions were demeaning and belittling.

Brittney Higgins was a real contrast yesterday, absolutely stood out as a considered, intelligent, respectful person, with great insight and plenty to offer public life.

I broadly agree,

But someones gotta play badcop (the right has a whole battalion, the left has few)

If everyone plays the good cop (higgins)

The right just take advantage and drag the centre across.

Its a very thankless and demanding task, especially for a woman.

grace is taking one for the team, and extraordinary at 26.

I have very high expectations, and was articulating them,

Maybe out of place

 

[tigersnake]

Not harsh at all Ezy, absolutely insightful.

Unfortunately for a large part of yesterday she came across as a smug smart arse without much intellectual gravitas. The speech was mostly ok but the hypocrisy of wanting to drag abuse and abusers into the light and then not naming the person who allegedly pressured her was staggering.

The Q and A session was where it got really bad though. Barely answered a question seriously and was outright disrespectful on a number of occasions. I understand she has issues with mainstream media but a couple of times her sarcasm and expressions towards women asking her questions were demeaning and belittling.

Brittney Higgins was a real contrast yesterday, absolutely stood out as a considered, intelligent, respectful person, with great insight and plenty to offer public life.

Hypocrisy? Staggering? seriously? A woman in her 20s has stood up to extrememly powerful political forces and you begruge her baulking at times. (edit actually its more than begruging, you have come down hard). It is not hypocrisy, do you know the meaning of the word? Saying that she was all good with the PM, taking a job as script consultant with Touchstone Pictures, THAT would be hypocrisy, and it is not staggering at all, not even a little bit.

Those Murdoch hacks should be belittled. If they were belittled more often, routinely even, and exposed and fingered for the frauds they are, the world would be a better place.

 

[year of the tiger]

We shall see, but the other thing to remember is that the vast majority of the electorate will not change their vote on this issue, but those who are heavily invested in their religion might. So Labor are trying to placate those who may change their vote and not upset those less likely to and also avoiding being wedged by the LNP. Remember too that if the LNP wedge Labor on this they will have active support from a lot of the media.

DS

I don’t disagree but I think people are sick of political solutions - more people I talk to just want their party to stick fat with what they believe in, if they don’t agree, then don’t support it. It’s old fashioned leadership in away.

 

[Harry]

The whole gender thing is just getting so complex and difficult.

I’ve got a friend who is a 20+ year teacher at a prestigious Melbourne girls school. He teaches teenagers.

A couple of years ago he was telling me about a student who does not recognise themselves as being female. The student, along with the parents who support the student, refuse to be referenced in any form whatsoever as being female. This extends to the student not being called by their Christian name which…say for the sake of the story…is “Jane.” The student can only be referenced via their surname or “it” or “they”.

But it gets more difficult. In any group setting that the child is in, the teachers and staff can not refer to the group as a collective female group e.g. “Ok girls pack up your thing we are getting on the bus now…”. The student and parents have complained about being discriminated against by teachers and staff when any collective female reference is made. They have also made complaints about other students who have not only made innocuous reference (they are kids after all) to the student in a female context, but also anything about being female as a collective group as well.

The parents and the student are constantly complaining to the school that they don’t cater to the student’s cross gender identity. They complain that the school’s activities, programs etc don’t cater to their child.

The school has had to modify all its comms etc to be gender neutral which is very difficult to manage in a single sex school. The school, teachers, staff and students are constantly on edge and the school is constantly having to refer to various bodies and controls for advice.

But of course the parents don’t want to send the child to a male or even mixed school. They want her current school and 99.999% of the other students and staff to turn themselves upside down to cater for the child.

It’s insane what he described. Actually I think the child may have graduated/left by now which my friend was saying the school couldn’t wait to happen quick enough.

Gender reference, discrimination etc....its all getting very complex and hard to manage in a lot of situations.

Insanity.

But that's what happens when you pander to virtue signaling.

 

[IanG]

Its dumb tactics from Labor - if they didn’t like the bill they should have just voted against it - surely it’s a principle thing. Even PrettyCoat said the bill wasn’t needed.

I reckon they have now lost this argument in the eyes of the public. Doesn’t bode well for the election.

You're missing the point explained in the twitter thread above.

 

[year of the tiger]

Not harsh at all Ezy, absolutely insightful.

Unfortunately for a large part of yesterday she came across as a smug smart arse without much intellectual gravitas. The speech was mostly ok but the hypocrisy of wanting to drag abuse and abusers into the light and then not naming the person who allegedly pressured her was staggering.

The Q and A session was where it got really bad though. Barely answered a question seriously and was outright disrespectful on a number of occasions. I understand she has issues with mainstream media but a couple of times her sarcasm and expressions towards women asking her questions were demeaning and belittling.

Brittney Higgins was a real contrast yesterday, absolutely stood out as a considered, intelligent, respectful person, with great insight and plenty to offer public life.

I have a different view Big Richo.

Given what she has gone through, then even after the bloke was convicted the law wouldn’t let her speak publicly whilst he could and did and then the crap she put up with this year putting up with all the spin that came out of Canberra - I am amazed at what she has done, and that she can relive her story and stand up to the ’club’. Just being in that room is enormous - civility in this case nah.

She has to knock the door down, it hurts her to do it, but she won’t give up - why respect them (politics and media) when they haven’t respected her or her cause.

She worked well with Higgins - both styles are necessary to impact change.

 

[tigersnake]

Insanity.

But that's what happens when you pander to virtue signaling.

Ahh the 'ol virtue signalling trick, someone doing something nice, or virtuous, just to make the people who aren't doing it feel bad. That's the third time I've fallen for that this month.

 

[IanG]

Unfortunately for a large part of yesterday she came across as a smug smart arse without much intellectual gravitas. The speech was mostly ok but the hypocrisy of wanting to drag abuse and abusers into the light and then not naming the person who allegedly pressured her was staggering.

Not staggering at all, there would undoubtedly be legal action coming her way if she did. As for her demeanor if she is on the autism spectrum then its understandable.

 

[eZyT]

Insanity.

But that's what happens when you pander to virtue signaling.

No its not.

'Virtue signalling' is a *smile* rightwing term for 'being nice'

The trans person in redfords story is a pain in the arse person,

Their gender is irrelevant.

They could be white straight Liberal CHF in the footy team, and them and their parents would be pains in the arse, sueing the school if the kid did a hammy.

Yes, modern gender is complex and discombobulating for our generation, but their generation handle it pretty effortlessly. Call it virtue signalling if you want, but they are accepting and tolerant and get on with it - virtuous.

When i was an early teenager, i accidentally peirced my right ear, with a compass. I was horrified to realise i was a '*smile* homo hahaha' on monday morning at school.

This generation nonconsensually share homemade porn on their phone, they have their own ills.

But they are waaaaaaaaay more tolerant ofdifference than their parents,

And that can only be good,

Yes, a sure signal of virtue