Talking Politics

[eZyT]

Ahh the 'ol virtue signalling trick, someone doing something nice, or virtuous, just to make the people who aren't doing it feel bad. That's the third time I've fallen for that this month.

That the 3rd time this month weve simultaneous typed the same thesis .

 

[Baloo]

The issue with this bill isn't virtue signalling, who it includes or doesn't include Trans or non-binary types (really too old to keep up to date with the different identities these days), or anything else that's considered PC.

The single biggest problem with the proposed bill is that it gives Religious belief more weight over all the other types of discrimination. Claiming religion would allow you to discriminate against whoever you want. Not only is it dangerous in it's reach, but it's giving more power to people and bodies who believe in a fictitious make believe spirits and quote from a 2000 year old piece of fiction.

 

[larabee]

The issue with this bill isn't virtue signalling, who it includes or doesn't include Trans or non-binary types (really too old to keep up to date with the different identities these days), or anything else that's considered PC.

The single biggest problem with the proposed bill is that it gives Religious belief more weight over all the other types of discrimination. Claiming religion would allow you to discriminate against whoever you want. Not only is it dangerous in it's reach, but it's giving more power to people and bodies who believe in a fictitious make believe spirits and quote from a 2000 year old piece of fiction.

i've had trouble understanding why this legislation is needed in the first place. Surely people are protected from discrimination in the current Anti-Discrimination laws. If not, that needs to be amened.
This just seems like a Pro-Discrimination for Religious Institutions law?

 

[Baloo]

i've had trouble understanding why this legislation is needed in the first place. Surely people are protected from discrimination in the current Anti-Discrimination laws. If not, that needs to be amened.
This just seems like a Pro-Discrimination for Religious Institutions law?

The argument is that Religion isn't stated in the current laws. Race, Sex, gender etc are listed. The religious groups want Religion included in that, so people can't be discriminated against because of their religion. But it's gone too far where religion belief's would have more weight than gender, race. etc

 

[Harry]

No its not.

'Virtue signalling' is a *smile* rightwing term for 'being nice'

The trans person in redfords story is a pain in the arse person,

Their gender is irrelevant.

They could be white straight Liberal CHF in the footy team, and them and their parents would be pains in the arse, sueing the school if the kid did a hammy.

Yes, modern gender is complex and discombobulating for our generation, but their generation handle it pretty effortlessly. Call it virtue signalling if you want, but they are accepting and tolerant and get on with it - virtuous.

When i was an early teenager, i accidentally peirced my right ear, with a compass. I was horrified to realise i was a '*smile* homo hahaha' on monday morning at school.

This generation nonconsensually share homemade porn on their phone, they have their own ills.

But they are waaaaaaaaay more tolerant ofdifference than their parents,

And that can only be good,

Yes, a sure signal of virtue

so you're saying regardless of what the individual student thinks or wants the school should refer to the student as a girl, or her or she? And the student should accept and tolerate and get on with it?

 

[larabee]

The argument is that Religion isn't stated in the current laws. Race, Sex, gender etc are listed. The religious groups want Religion included in that, so people can't be discriminated against because of their religion. But it's gone too far where religion belief's would have more weight than gender, race. etc

ok, thanks Baloo

 

[Brodders17]

so you're saying regardless of what the individual student thinks or wants the school should refer to the student as a girl, or her or she? And the student should accept and tolerate and get on with it?

i reckon people shouldnt get too caught up in an isolated case where they have heard 1 side (2nd hand) and dont know all the details.

 

[Redford]

i reckon people shouldnt get too caught up in an isolated case where they have heard 1 side (2nd hand) and dont know all the details.

What further details do you need to assess the situation ?

 

[Harry]

i reckon people shouldnt get too caught up in an isolated case where they have heard 1 side (2nd hand) and dont know all the details.

So what should the school do in this case as portrayed for arguments sake? Is it the trans person being the pain in the arse or the school?

 

[eZyT]

so you're saying regardless of what the individual student thinks or wants the school should refer to the student as a girl, or her or she? And the student should accept and tolerate and get on with it?

I dont understand the question.

But i may be able to answer it anyway, with a statement of belief?

I dont care what people want to be referred to as; if it makes someone feel good and accepted and happy, ill call them Hon. ZebraThem Tutu-balloon.

Provided intentions are good, and theres acceptance all ways, that sometimes its confusing and you'lle stuff it up and you might unintentionally call a masculine looking woman, he or mister,

Then i honestly dont care.

Further,

morrison wants us arguing about this crap, to give him a slight chance at retaining power and another 4 years of diddling us; he doesnt care if 20 trans kids kill themselves in the 3 month hate tsunami, as long as he holds power. Just as howard didnt give a stuff about dead refugees.

As such,

Whatevs.

Bigger fish to fry, until june

 

[Harry]

I dont understand the question.

But i may be able to answer it anyway, with a statement of belief?

I dont care what people want to be referred to as; if it makes someone feel good and accepted and happy, ill call them Hon. ZebraThem Tutu-balloon.

Provided intentions are good, and theres acceptance all ways, that sometimes its confusing and you'lle stuff it up and you might unintentionally call a masculine looking woman, he or mister,

Then i honestly dont care.

Further,

morrison wants us arguing about this crap, to give him a slight chance at retaining power and another 4 years of diddling us; he doesnt care if 20 trans kids kill themselves in the 3 month hate tsunami, as long as he holds power. Just as howard didnt give a stuff about dead refugees.

As such,

Whatevs.

Bigger fish to fry, until june

So is it the school that's the pain in the arse (for not referring to the student in the manner the student wants) or is it the trans student as you indicated?

 

[eZyT]

So is it the school that's the pain in the arse (for not referring to the student in the manner the student wants) or is it the trans student as you indicated?

given its a 3rd hand anecdotal account, propagated on a footy forum on the internet,

isolating the pain in the arse is extremely difficult in this instance.

could realistically be anywhere along the chain

 

[Brodders17]

What further details do you need to assess the situation ?

no of us need to assess the situation, but I would say there would be a lot more to the story. if i had to assess, I would like to see all the correspondence on the issue, the chance to talk to all parties involved, and the chance to talk to others affected. but im not.

as Ezy said these conversations are just a distraction.

 

[eZyT]

no of us need to assess the situation, but I would say there would be a lot more to the story. if i had to assess, I would like to see all the correspondence on the issue, the chance to talk to all parties involved, and the chance to talk to others affected. but im not.

as Ezy said these conversations are just a distraction.

yes.

lets stick to core business;

Morrison and his LNP govt. is unequivocally the worst in our Nations history,

by every possible measure.

A corrupt, inept, cynical, lying, mysogynist, cheating, thieving, slimey, crooked, narcissistic, divisive, hateful, regressive, destructive

collection of people, to a man (+ a michaelia cash and Karen Andrews)

They must be comprehensively voted out of our parliament ASAP

If they aren't, the cultural, social, environmental, economic, systemic damage will take generations to repair,

if ever

 

[Redford]

no of us need to assess the situation, but I would say there would be a lot more to the story. if i had to assess, I would like to see all the correspondence on the issue, the chance to talk to all parties involved, and the chance to talk to others affected. but im not.

as Ezy said these conversations are just a distraction.

The post was only in reference to how difficult it is to manage and deal with real life situations beyond any actual laws that may be in place or being considered - in this case one particular school's difficulties. Its probably difficult for the family too, but I wasn't referencing them. Just the school.

And its not hard to understand for the school why that's the case. You don't need further detail - correspondence, talking to other parties etc. Its patently obvious why.

Politics and and legislation - they affect the end user.

 

[eZyT]

The post was only in reference to how difficult it is to manage and deal with real life situations beyond any actual laws that may be in place or being considered - in this case one particular school's difficulties. Its probably difficult for the family too, but I wasn't referencing them. Just the school.

And its not hard to understand for the school why that's the case. You don't need further detail - correspondence, talking to other parties etc. Its patently obvious why.

I used to be a teacher, and on face value, I hear your mate.

teaching is astonishingly difficult

Ive never been transgender, so its difficult for me to hear them, but I try hard.

and modern gender politics is really bamboozling for baby boomers and gen X.

which is why Morrison tried the wedge, and got it swiftly jammed up his arse.

But again, in my experience, Millenials take it in their stride.

what I try do, FWIW

is stick to celebrating my own comfort, with my own genitals and where I enjoy putting them,

and dont worry about anyone else.

 

[Redford]

I used to be a teacher, and on face value, I hear your mate.

teaching is astonishingly difficult

Ive never been transgender, so its difficult for me to hear them, but I try hard.

and modern gender politics is really bamboozling for baby boomers and gen X.

which is why Morrison tried the wedge, and got it swiftly jammed up his arse.

But again, in my experience, Millenials take it in their stride.

what I try do, FWIW

is stick to celebrating my own comfort, with my own genitals and where I enjoy putting them,

and dont worry about anyone else.

Yeah exactly.

My point is, we can debate politics and legislation etc but we often forget about the actual real life experience of being able to deal with those changes. My point is that whilst there might be either bad or meritorious change or whatever, it isn't always easy to manage at the user end i.e. us, the constituents.

And if you already have a difficult job or life that's impacted by these changes - like a school teacher to your point - well, that makes it even tougher.

 

[spook]

The issue with this bill isn't virtue signalling, who it includes or doesn't include Trans or non-binary types (really too old to keep up to date with the different identities these days), or anything else that's considered PC.

The single biggest problem with the proposed bill is that it gives Religious belief more weight over all the other types of discrimination. Claiming religion would allow you to discriminate against whoever you want. Not only is it dangerous in it's reach, but it's giving more power to people and bodies who believe in a fictitious make believe spirits and quote from a 2000 year old piece of fiction.

Yeah, but it'd be kinda funny if a jihadist used it to be acquitted after beheading a pious infidel who booted their trans kid out of school.

 

[DavidSSS]

Hypocrisy? Staggering? seriously? A woman in her 20s has stood up to extremely powerful political forces and you begruge her baulking at times. (edit actually its more than begruging, you have come down hard). It is not hypocrisy, do you know the meaning of the word? Saying that she was all good with the PM, taking a job as script consultant with Touchstone Pictures, THAT would be hypocrisy, and it is not staggering at all, not even a little bit.

Those Murdoch hacks should be belittled. If they were belittled more often, routinely even, and exposed and fingered for the frauds they are, the world would be a better place.

It seems some people just refuse to see the power imbalance and how women are not treated the same as men. As Grace Tame and Brittany Higgins keep pointing out (although it doesn't always sink in) the issues are systemic not specific to isolated cases, much as those who benefit would like to portray these issues as isolated cases.

I don’t disagree but I think people are sick of political solutions - more people I talk to just want their party to stick fat with what they believe in, if they don’t agree, then don’t support it. It’s old fashioned leadership in away.

I am very sympathetic to what you are saying, I have never understood why some people stand for office just for the sake of it. I would very much like to see all politicians with well publicised positions on the issues of the day, the guts to say what they really think and the guts to turn around and tell people who disagree with them that they should not vote for them. But, Labor are also factoring in that the media will distort and extrapolate what they say to the benefit of the LNP and that many voters, most of whom are not interested in politics, will be swayed by the lies peddled through various media outlets. It is not a good situation but it ain't changing in a hurry and certainly not before the election.

DS

 

[eZyT]

Yeah exactly.

My point is, we can debate politics and legislation etc but we often forget about the actual real life experience of being able to deal with those changes. My point is that whilst there might be either bad or meritorious change or whatever, it isn't always easy to manage at the user end i.e. us, the constituents.

And if you already have a difficult job or life that's impacted by these changes - like a school teacher to your point - well, that makes it even tougher.

I think we agree?

That we'll all muddle along and do our best,

Despite the legislators. the *smile* in charge.