The Frawley Closure Thread

[crackertiger]

I will never forgive that toss, that draft when we picked up Fleming, Nicholls and other ordinary players should never be forgotten!

Set us back at least 3 or 4 years.

 

[AstuteTiger]

By his own admission on footy classified he admitted that he thought that after the finals series in 2001 we were closer to a grand final and topped up with older experienced type players, we call them rejects. He goes on and says hindsight is a wonderful thing and that he will put his hand up for mucking up 2 of those drafts out of his tenure, i say he stuffed up 3 drafts but nontheless those hacks he recruited with the help of miller cost us dearly, ATM when i see those names of players he picked i am not in a forgiving or forgetting type of mood....By the way, can anyone remember when we picked up Paul Hudson from the dogs?

Richmond Draft Picks 1999

Type Round Pick Player
National 1 3 Aaron Fiora
National 2 22 Ezra Poyas
National 3 39 Scott Homewood
National 4 52 Andrew Mills
National 6 78 Ty Zantuck
Rookie 1 5 Ben Haynes
Rookie 2 21 Royce Vardy
Rookie 3 37 Rob Taylor
Rookie 4 51 Teghan Henderson
Rookie 5 61 Troy Kirwen


Richmond Draft picks 2000

Type Round Pick Player
National 1 9 Kayne Pettifer
National 2 25 Mark Coughlan
National 3 40 Chris Hyde
National 3 41 Andrew Krakouer
National 4 55 Chris Newman
National 4 57 Steven Sziller
Rookie 1 8 Garth Taylor
Rookie 2 24 Adrian Burgiel
Rookie 3 39 Micheal Barker
Rookie 4 52 Craig Ednie


Richmond Draft picks 2001

Type Round Pick Player
National 2 33 David Rodan
National 4 63 Adam Houlihan
National 6 68 Chris Hyde
National 6 77 Martin McGrath
Rookie 1 14 Kristian De Pasquale
Rookie 2 30 Brad Miller (Melbourne)
Rookie 3 45 Matt King
Rookie 4 56 Simon Hart


Richmond Draft Picks 2002

Type Round Pick Player
National 1 12 Jay Schulz
National 3 41 Tim Fleming
National 4 47 Bill Nicholls
National 5 62 Daniel Sipthorp
Rookie 1 3 Kelvin Moore
Rookie 2 19 Matthew Shir
Rookie 3 35 Adam Pickering


Richmond Draft Picks 2003

Type Round Pick Player
National 2 21 Alex Gilmour
National 3 37 Father/Son Thomas Roach
National 4 53 Daniel Jackson
National 5 64 Shane Morrison
National 6 70 Brent Hartigan
National 7 73 Shane Tuck
National 8 76 Andrew Raines
National 9 79 Simon Fletcher
National 10 81 Kyle Archibald
Pre-Season 1 4 Ben Marsh
Pre-Season 2 11 Luke Weller
Rookie 1 4 Nathan Foley
Rookie 2 20 Marc Dragicevic


Terry Wallace Drafted players.....

Richmond Draft Picks 2004

Type Round Pick Player
National 1 Priority Brett Deledio
National 1 4 Richard Tambling
National 1 12 Danny Meyer
National 1 16 Adam Pattison
National 2 20 Dean Polo
National 3 36 Luke McGuane
National 4 52 Dean Limbach
National 5 65 Mark Graham
Pre-Season 1 1 Trent Knobel
Rookie 1 1 Will Thursfield


Richmond Draft Picks 2005

Type Round Pick Player
National 1 8 Jarrad Oakley-Nicholls
National 2 24 Cleve Hughes
National 3 40 Travis Casserly
Pre-Season 1 5 Matthew White
Rookie 1 5 Angus Graham
Rookie 2 21 Jeremy Humm
Rookie 3 36 Cameron Howat


Richmond Draft Picks 2006

Type Round Pick Player
National 1 13 Jack Riewoldt
National 2 26 Shane Edwards
National 4 58 Daniel Connors
National 4 60 Carl Peterson
National 5 73 Andrew Collins
Pre-Season 1 6 Kent Kingsley
Rookie 1 8 Tasman Clingan
Rookie 2 24 Jake King

 

[Tigerfan]

....By the way, can anyone remember when we picked up Paul Hudson from the dogs?

AROUND NOV 2001

 

[AstuteTiger]

....By the way, can anyone remember when we picked up Paul Hudson from the dogs?

AROUND NOV 2001

Thanx DDT we will attribute that great pick to frawley too...I wasn't 100% sure but i kind of remember spud saying that we needed some goal kickers as he thought we were close to playing in a grand final, by memory was hudson about 32 yrs old when we drafted him?

 

[Dyer'ere]

A lot is made of the idea of bottoming out.

Under Frawley, Richmond did the opposite. With a handy list in 2001 we finished 3rd, albeit smashed by the Grand Finalists during the finals series. We threw everything at maintaining that position and topped out.

What has followed is the depression we had to have. Trouble is we've got no Premiership to show for it. Just a distant third. But it beats the *smile* out of finishing 9th every year.

Frawley was a dud? Yeah. I suppose. But I'm over it.

 

[AstuteTiger]

Cant speak for everyone but i think ill be over it when we start playing finals and like the old cliché, everything is fine and you tend to just let slide when the team is consistently playing finals and we can see that we have the structure in place which we have been waiting years for, then the past becomes just that.
Still to fresh in my mind but like anything yes im sure ill move on like others.

 

[AstuteTiger]

Just remembered i didn't include traded players or draft picks....IE: Stafford, Johno, Simmonds, Brown, Polak etc

 

[roywoj]

We've only had 2 champions in the modern era - Knights and Richardson - he sacked Knights and humiliated richo by sending him to the reserves - whilst biddiscomesque type players remained unscathed to play

 

[AstroboyUK]

We've only had 2 champions in the modern era - Knights and Richardson - he sacked Knights and humiliated richo by sending him to the reserves - whilst biddiscomesque type players remained unscathed to play

oh get off it roywoj....... Richardsons on field behaviour at that stage was an absolute disgrace and embarrasment to the club: Richo 'humiliated' ??? Give me a break. It was long overdue and he deserved every bit of it. At least Spud didnt shirk the issue.

As for Knighter, yes I agree he was a great player and deserved a better send off, but frankly he was never as good after the ankle injury. He was so slow; and was always getting caught; it may have been cruel/stupid to cut him when and how we did, but a ruthless club would have cut him even earlier when they saw he was too slow.

As for the Spud era; Im over it: I understand what went wrong .... infrastructure, topping up, ..topping out....inexperience... yep.. All registered; happy to move on: Hope they reappoint TW for another 5 years

 

[Al Bundy]

We've only had 2 champions in the modern era - Knights and Richardson - he sacked Knights and humiliated richo by sending him to the reserves - whilst biddiscomesque type players remained unscathed to play

oh get off it roywoj....... Richardsons on field behaviour at that stage was an absolute disgrace and embarrasment to the club: Richo 'humiliated' ??? Give me a break. It was long overdue and he deserved every bit of it. At least Spud didnt shirk the issue.

As for Knighter, yes I agree he was a great player and deserved a better send off, but frankly he was never as good after the ankle injury. He was so slow; and was always getting caught; it may have been cruel/stupid to cut him when and how we did, but a ruthless club would have cut him even earlier when they saw he was too slow.

As for the Spud era; Im over it: I understand what went wrong .... infrastructure, topping up, ..topping out....inexperience... yep.. All registered; happy to move on: Hope they reappoint TW for another 5 years

Astro concur with all your views. IMO Knights was carried a fair bit. He also had ongoing o/pubis problems & was continually played when in reality he should have been rested for a year. In hindsight maybe Frawley should have played him for that 100 game & then dropped him.

Overall Frawley got us to 3rd & I am proud of that. Although in hidnsight topping up in 2001 was an error many would have made that mistake but he admits it.

If anyone wants to blame anyone, see phantoms reason, they are spot on. Frawley should not be a scapegoat for our current situation.

We have drafted well the last few years & it will take time to come togerther.



I blame Miller more as he was at the helm as well.

 

[Silent Bob]

Blind freddy could see we were miles off a flag at the end of 2001. We got thrashed by 70 points in the qualifying final by Essendon, then a couple of weeks later we were thrashed by 70 points by Brisbane. And Frawley thought we were a few top up players short of winning a grand! How dumb was he?

As far bringing new players to the club goes, it's the recruiting department thats responsible for the draft selections, but the coach is responsible for selecting the recyled players. I refuse to let Frawley off the hook for bringing all those recycled duds to the RFC.

 

[Tiger Attack]

'Scoping?' 'Football division?'

What the? ???

 

[North Sea Tiger]

I'm over it. Really loved 2001, it was a great time to be a Tiger fan and I thank him for that. Disappointed on the Knights front, can't believe that he didn't think a guy who had killed them in the guts his entire career didn't have a season in him in the fwd pocket or pinch hitting off the bench. Oh well.

 

[Freezer]

IMO Knights was carried a fair bit.

The only time Knighter got carried was after his last game. And that was only because after 279 games in 14 seasons (generally carrying the weight of 20 odd other players), he could no longer walk.

Along with Richo, the only true Tiger Legend of the modern era.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

2002 won 4 of first 8, then 3 of last 14
2003 won 6 of first 8, then 1 of last 14
2004 won 4 of first 8, then 0 of last 14

A 'youth policy' would have made these results more palatable, but the club appeared to have no obvious long-term direction.

I actually agree with Frawley's decision to phase out Knighter. He was struggling early in that final season - getting caught with the ball, missing targets, running out of steam during matches; he was tried as a forward and a tagger with limited success. The way it was done was very sad.

 

[Hayfever]

Spud was to RFC what potato blight was to Ireland :'(

 

[philipwalsh]

One thing that really dissapointed me with Frawley ,not sure why all this has stuck in my mind, but I remember both events clearly.

The year after he finished, early in the season, Tigers were playing St Kilda,

On triple M,in his new job as commentator, just before the game, one of the other commentators asked him who he was going for,

Without hesitation he answered "St Kilda,old habits die hard "

I then rememberd back to Robert Walls, after he was sacked by Richmond , calling on 3AW, in almost identical circumstances, Richmond were playing Carlton,he was asked the same question , and he answered the Tigers, Its not a matter of choosing between the clubs he said, I still feel a loyalty to the players. I really respected Walls for saying that. After all he is Carlton through and through.

Sadly when Danny left, he did'nt give a rats about Richmond.

Don't worry, a couple of weeks after he left he was in the papers saying he was wearing st. kilda socks etc. He used to try and seduce us by saying he was a "richmond man", what a tosser. He wasn't richmond, and he was barely a man.

 

[it me willow]

I've never held Frawley to blame for what happened during his tenure at Tigerland. He was merely a symptom, not the cause. One man doesn't make a club.

In his first 2 years at Tigerland, 2000 & 2001, Frawley did lift the club into the finals. One of only 2 times since 1982. So his initial efforts in fact lifted the team to a contemporary club high.
Unfortunately one man isn't enough and, I believe, that the poor infrastructure of the Tiger organisation was a load far too heavy for Frawley to carry.

This points to the modern day coach being more than just a coach but, in fact, a football division director.

In 2000 the Tiger football division needed to set itself up for the next decade, I don't believe Frawley had the mandate nor ability to make this happen. But that's not Frawley's fault. Responsibility belonged to those who scoped the mandate and chose the best candidate. As memory serves, the lack of interest in the position reflected the lack of scope presented by those at Tigerland, ie the Board.

I will never blame 2002, 2003 or 2004 on Danny. There were times that I shouted from the boundary, regarding some poor decisions he may have made, but he was never the cause of this wasted time. I regretted deeply, as a Tiger supporter, the pressure he & his family, especially his wife, endured during that time. His wife's courage, that year, exceeded more than what was shown by the entire Tiger list.

The positive is that 2004 acted as a catalyst for fundamental change of thinking at Tigerland. The mainstream Tiger supporter became more educated into football strategy and became prepared to take a long term view of things. Remember, 6 of the 9 places on the Board changed in 2004. There was also a fundamental change in thinking when scoping the coaching role, and a proper organisational structure was put in place, which we are beginning to benefit from now.

For those still pondering the Tigers today. Remember that decisions made between 1998 and 2003 are impacting on the Tigers now - roughly a 7 year time lag. The benefits of decisions made in 2004 should not impact till around 2011.
As long as we hold a long term view in both our structures & recruiting then eventual success will be assured.

somebody that makes some sence well said phanto hear hear

 

[IanG]

Blind freddy could see we were miles off a flag at the end of 2001. We got thrashed by 70 points in the qualifying final by Essendon, then a couple of weeks later we were thrashed by 70 points by Brisbane. And Frawley thought we were a few top up players short of winning a grand! How dumb was he?

As far bringing new players to the club goes, it's the recruiting department thats responsible for the draft selections, but the coach is responsible for selecting the recyled players. I refuse to let Frawley off the hook for bringing all those recycled duds to the RFC.

Well said, there's got to be some personal responsibility taken. Writing someone off as being symptomatic of the club completely ignores the issue of personal responsibility. The fact is the decisions that are holding the club back now were made by Frawley, he's even admitted as much himself. We're missing an entire generation of players, of course it takes years to get back on track.