What went wrong and what may fix it.

[Motown]

He was on the Board, so I'll accept his informed comments over dribble on an internet forum.

Fair enough, you don't know me, so I can accept that my word's not worth much more than any other internet wanker.

So, given you don't seem to remember much about us in 2004, maybe this might jog your memory:
Schwab sets high sights for Hawks

Here's our own HHQ preview of 2003:
2003 Hawthorn Season Preview
Doesn't really read like a preview of a club in rebuild mode, really.

I'll happily concede that we won our flag "early" or "ahead of plan", whatever that's worth, so there's no need to try and contort history to try and fit us into a more conventional 6-7 year premiership model. Clarkson admitted as much himself on GF day, conceding he thought he had a Premiership team in the making, not thinking we'd win so quickly. In fact, in all the functions I've attended where he presented his Premiership plan, he's proposed a 6-8 year journey as best-case to typical. To some extent, this was presented to keep member expectations under control, but it was also based on his studies of other clubs in the draft era (core to his presentation when applying for the job).

Happily for us, we reached the summit in Year 4 of a 6-8 year plan. A plan that began in 2005.

 

[mexican_radio]

personally I would like to see the hawthorn discussion taken to another thread, no matter how well researched or carefully reasoned any given posting might be. Yes I know it could be relevant in terms of what we can learn from their experience, but still....I'd prefer to see us focus on what the RFC can do.

I was thinking about the importance of innovation. This is something 21st century enterprise is waking up to. Since nothing we have tried has produced any results for 25 years or more, perhaps it's time to try completely new and original ideas. The club should consider unique and all-new ideas about how to partner with industry, government and the community. With innovative programs in place that involve the playing group, we might see boys develop into community leaders and in turn *maybe* become more mentally strong players.

I would like to see RFC set new standards in innovative thinking and approaches to running a football club. No idea should be off the table. Even if it means taking some risks, we have to explore new avenues that may lead to success.

 

[Motown]

personally I would like to see the hawthorn discussion taken to another thread, no matter how well researched or carefully reasoned any given posting might be. Yes I know it could be relevant in terms of what we can learn from their experience, but still....I'd prefer to see us focus on what the RFC can do.

How can one reasonably do this without consideration of what's happened at other clubs?

To do that, one must analyze their experience in the correct historical context lest the conclusions be flawed. For example, an extremely simple analysis of the Brisbane dynasty would seem to indicate that all you need to do is add Leigh Matthews and he'll take you from cellar to penthouse within a few years. Rabble to royalty. Obviously this ignores the fact that Brisbane were already a top-4 quality side who'd just had one disastrous year on and off the field.

The issue with the discussion of what's happened at the Hawks is that the historical context is being mangled to suit some preconceived model of "how it should be done". Fact of the matter is that it didn't happen that way. Nothing useful is going to be added to the discussion analyzing an illusory long-term premiership plan that didn't exist.

I'd have thought the Hawthorn example would give hope to the Tiger's faithful as it shows it can all happen within four years with good planning, people and a liberal dose of luck.

 

[mexican_radio]

My point is that copying other clubs to try and produce success has not worked, we need to come up with our own ideas.

 

[Massai]

You can't just write off other clubs and how they have gone about the way to succeeding. There are clear cut lessons in how Hawthorn has gone about winning its flag, ditto Geelong and its for sure we can learn a lot from Carlton (as much as I hate to admit it).

To write off other AFL clubs is simply stupid. Its also stupid to copy them to the letter, that can't happen because only the successful club has the right blend of staff and players, something that Richmond clearly does not have.

What Richmond via the Board can do is determine right, what are our strength's (stuff all) and what are our weaknesses (everything) across the board at the club. We all know the players are playing pathetic football, but we also know that a lot of these players can play the game, its just they are so damn inconsistent. Therefore that means the Coaching and Football Department need a thorough review to find out all the in's and out's, something that is currently being done and we will just have to wait and see what's in the review. Other area's of the club appear to be managing well in the off field areas but again appearances can be deceptive, we'll just have to wait for the review to be completed and what the Club President tells us.

Hopefully the review of the club is "warts and all" no holds barred. Everything and I mean everything from player relationships to player/coach relationship's, to development of players, to where the club wants to be onfield by 2015 should be thoroughly scrutinised and the questions asked duly answered without fear or favour.

The real issue is whether people will try to cover their arse's or whether they will realise that come what may, they must do what is right by Richmond today, tomorrow and for years to come.

 

[goose]

Easy answers to these questions"

What went wrong - Draft: we have the worst record (maybe freo are up there with us) in the competition

What may fix it : Draft - get better at it.

Taht may sound simple but it is the only way. Unfortunately for us we blew the best chance we had and fluffed 5 picks in the top 20. Going to be a long road back. get ready for pain.(or more of the same I s'pose)

 

[mexican_radio]

just before anyone else calls me stupid, I don't think ignoring other clubs paths to success is sensible either. I just was trying to advocate that RFC should get on the front foot and try to come up with some of our OWN original initiatives.

 

[K3]

just before anyone else calls me stupid, I don't think ignoring other clubs paths to success is sensible either. I just was trying to advocate that RFC should get on the front foot and try to come up with some of our OWN original initiatives.

Looks like someone needs a hug... ;D

 

[pahoffm]

just before anyone else calls me stupid, I don't think ignoring other clubs paths to success is sensible either. I just was trying to advocate that RFC should get on the front foot and try to come up with some of our OWN original initiatives.

Agree with you entirely.

Everyone learns from the experiences of our own and of others.

It's called evolution. It's what makes us stronger.

As individuals, we learn from mentors and colleagues. In footy terms, that's why retiring players often take assistant coaching roles outside of their own clubs.

Same happens at a Team level. We learn as we play other teams, their tactics and their strategies.

Infact, I'd go so far as stating that as soon as a club isolated itself from those around, it becomes backward.

I'm all for Tiger people rising up and taking off-field leadership roles at the RFC. Equally, I believe that:
1. those Tiger people should be seeking external experience for development, and
2. the club should be attempting to attract talented individuals from outside.