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Any Computer programmers on PRE?

23.21.159

A Tiger in Denmark
Aug 9, 2003
5,145
369
Denmark
www.dafl.dk
I'm a programmer by profession (mainframe software) and dabble with php/mysql/apache running my own website.
I know what Java, sql and php are but I'm not really sure how you would be using Java with php. Can you elaborate?
I use http://www.php.net/manual/en/ as my php reference, and if you really mean MySQL I use http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.6/en/ for that.
 

Baloo

Delisted Free Agent
Nov 8, 2005
35,513
2,411
https://www.codecademy.com Is your Friend.

What your are learning is good for websites, which is everyone's direction at the moment. It wouldn't hurt to get a good understanding of HTML5 and CSS.

Python and Ruby (on Rails) are other platforms worth looking at.

I'm an amateur coder/hacker of other people code. The last time I cut code professionally BASIC still hadline numbers and COBOL was the lamguage of choice.
 

23.21.159

A Tiger in Denmark
Aug 9, 2003
5,145
369
Denmark
www.dafl.dk
Don't laugh baloo, but I use cobol almost everyday in my working life.
Still many zillions of lines of cobol code running businesses around the world.
 

Baloo

Delisted Free Agent
Nov 8, 2005
35,513
2,411
Yep. The systems I support have undocumented COBOL running them. Back in the Y2K days I seriously considered taking up COBOL coding again.
 
Jun 4, 2006
24,476
1,574
Melbourne
SQL isn't really 'programming' in the accepted sense. Relatively easy to get a feel for the major constructs (SELECT, INSERT, UPDATE, DELETE) compared to a fully-fledged programming language.

Although there is a standard version of SQL (ANSI), you'll find each software package has its own minor but important variations, e.g. Oracle SQL is different to SQL Server SQL is different to MS Access SQL is different to MySQL SQL...

One of the best ways to cut your teeth is to download SQL Server Express (free version of SQL Server). There are plenty of texts around that will get you up to speed in a short time, e.g. Teach Yourself SQL in 10 Minutes, Teach Yourself SQL in 21 Days etc. If you get stuck I can supply you with some eBooks in PDF format.

If you're going down the MySQL path (which it sounds like you might be), then Murach's PHP and MySQL might be a suitable book. I haven't used this particular text but have found other books in the Murach's... series to be relatively easy for beginners to understand, and straight to the point.

Now that we're onto the subject of web programming, I'm outta here...
 

TigerForce

Richmond has a better list.
Apr 26, 2004
49,502
1,641
As Windows 7 faces the guillotine on January 14, anyone know if Norton is good enough to keep it going as I don't want to upgrade Win 10 to an 8 year old notebook I use (i.e. rather buy a new computer but I'm not ready)
 

DavidSSS

Tiger Superstar
Dec 11, 2017
1,519
924
Melbourne
As Windows 7 faces the guillotine on January 14, anyone know if Norton is good enough to keep it going as I don't want to upgrade Win 10 to an 8 year old notebook I use (i.e. rather buy a new computer but I'm not ready)
At work we are now required to "upgrade" to Win 10 (and on my last day before a break the computer was not working at all - couldn't even boot it up) but at home I'm certainly not going to bother. I can understand why a large organisation would want to upgrade but the reality is that Win 7 will no longer be supported by Microsoft and that is all that is happening. What this means is no more updates, or fixes to any bugs. Woopee wow! It will still work and I would assume that for a long time we will still get updates to firewalls and the like. I see no need to upgrade to Win 10 on the home desktop.

In reference to Antman's post above, I bought a laptop about a year ago and it is not a low spec machine. It runs like a 286 trying to handle large photoshop files in Win 10. Win 10 seems to always have the CPU running at close to 100% even when there are no programmes running, it is a resource hog. Hence I tried Linux on my laptop and it is so much faster and easier it just isn't funny, I doubt I will boot up Win 10 again on this machine and would remove it if I could be bothered. I can't do this on the desktop as my partner uses that for work stuff.

In short, if you are the only user of the laptop, seriously consider Linux. It is not difficult at all. If you don't want to try Linux then just stick with Win 7, it's not like it will disappear from your computer or cease to do what it has always done.

DS
 
Jun 4, 2006
24,476
1,574
Melbourne
the reality is that Win 7 will no longer be supported by Microsoft and that is all that is happening. What this means is no more updates, or fixes to any bugs. Woopee wow! It will still work and I would assume that for a long time we will still get updates to firewalls and the like. I see no need to upgrade to Win 10 on the home desktop.
This is a common attitude partly thanks to Microsoft's habit of releasing a bad version of Windows after every good version.

Windows 98 - good
Windows ME - bad
Windows XP - good
Windows Vista - bad
Windows 7 - good
Windows 8 - bad
Windows 10 - good

Breakdown worldwide is currently

64% Windows 10
27% Windows 7
5% Windows 8.1
4% other versions

You're correct in that you'll see no obvious practical disadvantage when an OS stops being supported, but the major drawback is that they stop patching newly-discovered security holes. As new computer viruses are developed, this leaves you increasingly vulnerable with time.

Windows 10 gave me a big problem a few years ago when a major update failed, but these days it's a mature, stable OS that is pretty customisable. For example I use a cheap app called Start10 to keep the Windows 7 start menu as I've never been a fan of Windows tiles.
 
Jun 4, 2006
24,476
1,574
Melbourne
Win 10 seems to always have the CPU running at close to 100% even when there are no programmes running, it is a resource hog. Hence I tried Linux on my laptop and it is so much faster and easier it just isn't funny
Something is wrong there. Maybe your anti-virus didn't install properly or wasn't compatible. Windows 10 is actually leaner than previous versions, but of course Linux is leaner again.
 

Baloo

Delisted Free Agent
Nov 8, 2005
35,513
2,411
As L2R mentioned there are no more security patches for Windows 7. The next vulnerability that's discovered will leave you compromised whenever you connect to the interweb.

I have no doubt that there will be a flood of viruses etc whenever a new vulnerability is discovered. Unprotected Windows 7 will be a happy hunting ground for the naughty people out there.

Actually, don't be surprised if some groups have already discovered holes in Win 7 and they are just sitting on them waiting for yesterday to happen.

Windows 10 is a very good Windows OS. My oldest machine is a 7yo i3 and it handles Win 10 just fine. To stay unexposed is a bit like drink driving, what damage you could do to yourself is immaterial compared to the damage you can do to others (anyone on your contacts or same network).
 

TigerForce

Richmond has a better list.
Apr 26, 2004
49,502
1,641
At work we are now required to "upgrade" to Win 10 (and on my last day before a break the computer was not working at all - couldn't even boot it up) but at home I'm certainly not going to bother. I can understand why a large organisation would want to upgrade but the reality is that Win 7 will no longer be supported by Microsoft and that is all that is happening. What this means is no more updates, or fixes to any bugs. Woopee wow! It will still work and I would assume that for a long time we will still get updates to firewalls and the like. I see no need to upgrade to Win 10 on the home desktop.

In reference to Antman's post above, I bought a laptop about a year ago and it is not a low spec machine. It runs like a 286 trying to handle large photoshop files in Win 10. Win 10 seems to always have the CPU running at close to 100% even when there are no programmes running, it is a resource hog. Hence I tried Linux on my laptop and it is so much faster and easier it just isn't funny, I doubt I will boot up Win 10 again on this machine and would remove it if I could be bothered. I can't do this on the desktop as my partner uses that for work stuff.

In short, if you are the only user of the laptop, seriously consider Linux. It is not difficult at all. If you don't want to try Linux then just stick with Win 7, it's not like it will disappear from your computer or cease to do what it has always done.

DS
Thanks DavidSSS and ant. I know it will still run, but am just a bit worried on how my Norton security will act against any virus or hacking. I use Win 10 at work also which has affected some of the software so I want to be careful before upgrading, but I will look into Linux.
 

antman

Tiger Legend
Nov 25, 2004
16,936
1,186
Thanks DavidSSS and ant. I know it will still run, but am just a bit worried on how my Norton security will act against any virus or hacking. I use Win 10 at work also which has affected some of the software so I want to be careful before upgrading, but I will look into Linux.
Yes, if you are using any specialized software for work or have tricky network certifications and logins then linux won't suit.
 

DavidSSS

Tiger Superstar
Dec 11, 2017
1,519
924
Melbourne
L2R2R, you forgot Windows NT4 and Win 2000, no idea why you would run the alternatives back then unless you had to. I used to work as a graphic designer and ran Win NT4. I knew a lot of people running MacOS back then (pre OSX) and their machines would crash daily, mine crashed a couple of times a year. There were some drawbacks, no USB support in NT4 was one, but it was so far ahead of Win95 (and Mac OS9) it just wasn't funny.

As for Linux, a couple of things to watch out for: Adobe don't support acrobat on linux - this would be a killer for me at work but at home is fine. I often need to create, edit and stitch together acrobat files at work. We have one system at work which will only run on windows (uses .net) so again a killer for work, although given how bad that system is (along with all of the rest actually, why are large systems so bad (slow, clunky, bug ridden etc) these days, is it just lazy programming, I don't know) we would be best off finding a better one.

I understand the point about vulnerabilities not being fixed, but given the smaller number of users Win7 won't be the main target any more. I also hope Zone Alarm will keep it safe and I presume there will be some sort of hardware firewall on my router. In any case I rarely get viruses as I am fairly careful. Although, I do remember the first scam message I ever got, this was decades ago and these things weren't known about back then. The mistake the scammer made was to ask for my banking details for my Citibank account, I have no Citibank account! From then on I knew to be careful.

DS
 
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