Australia Day Poll

[DavidSSS]

It takes little effort to find out what the representatives of the indigenous communities have asked for, just go here: https://www.referendumcouncil.org.au/

Of course this was rejected out of hand by the government.

This is a representative statement and report so not all indigenous people, or even indigenous leaders, agree with the recommendations. Just like our own communities, there is more than one opinion.

Every day we live in this country we benefit from the dispossession of the original inhabitants. When we gain benefit we also need to take responsibility for how that benefit was gained.

DS

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

Is that what their cultural leaders want? have they stated that, or is it again based on what others think is right for their culture.

I would love to see their "final" blueprint to all the issue they raise. What is the end point where they will be happy to co-exist with all cultures here now. Will they comprise? its very polarised. I don't know but ask.

No matter how they feel they were going to be colonised by someone 200yrs ago. Rest of the world was so advanced and seeking new lands to expand to. They had no weaponary to match the power of other cultures. They did not stand a chance. (Eg similar the native Indians in USA).

There is no united front. Some, like Warren Mundine, suggest what is needed is head down, arse up. Others, like the Tarneen thing, want to destroy the country and take back possession of the land.

After previously supporting the idea of recognition in the constitution, I'm now very, very wary.

 

[Giardiasis]

Every day we live in this country we benefit from the dispossession of the original inhabitants. When we gain benefit we also need to take responsibility for how that benefit was gained.

No, we really don't. If someone can demonstrate a clear family link to someone with a clear ownership of property who was wrongly dispossessed, then they should have restitution, even to the extent of having the land returned to them. Otherwise the claim of ownership really is lost in antiquity.

There is no responsibility whatsoever to wallow in someone's misfortune from 200 years ago. So much land has been wrongly dispossessed in the world, pretty much everyone has an ancestral link to a dispossessed relative.

 

[Panthera Tigris]

No, we really don't. If someone can demonstrate a clear family link to someone with a clear ownership of property who was wrongly dispossessed, then they should have restitution, even to the extent of having the land returned to them. Otherwise the claim of ownership really is lost in antiquity.

There is no responsibility whatsoever to wallow in someone's misfortune from 200 years ago. So much land has been wrongly dispossessed in the world, pretty much everyone has an ancestral link to a dispossessed relative.

More than that. You would find pretty much every person in the world has an ancestral links to people dispossessed and those who have done some dispossessing through out human history. Essentially every single piece of land inhabited by humans has been settled, invaded, reinvaded and reinvaded again many times over.

 

[glantone]

How so?

Glantone said:
And National Sorry Day says:
“National Sorry Day is an annual event that has been held in Australia on 26 May, since 1998, to remember and commemorate the mistreatment of the country's indigenous population.”

Sounds like we already have the day Glantone wishes for.

tigertim, I might be wrong and probably am but I think the National Sorry Day is more about being sorry for the decades of abducting indigenous children from indigenous mums and dads and all the unimaginable pain and suffering that caused in order to culturally cleanse Australia of indigenous ways rather than being sorry for all the dispossession and killing. That's another matter.
(sigh) .... so many things to do when you take over a land and its peoples by force ..

 

[glantone]

So you think Australia Day should be a day to focus on negatives?

Hey there Rosy I think Australia Day should be a day when indigenous and non indigenous Australians can focus on the positives. Really celebrate together. Have fun. But let's face it that’s never going to happen on Jan 26.

If the majority of the indigenous Australians feel it is wrong to celebrate Jan 26 (haven't seen any coverage of them partying) then as the injured party their claims - given the depth of abuse, murder and loss they endured – carries a little more weight from my pov than those of non indigenous Australian’s wanting to pop corks and party it up.

Triple J would never pick the 11th of the 11th to count down the hottest 100 nor will they ever go back to the 26th Jan... We just need another date which is approved by the majority of indigenous Australians and non indigenous Australians.

What do you reckon?

 

[glantone]

........We don’t have to take personal responsibility for the wrongs but we can and should acknowledge them more formally. It can only help.

yeah, I can never get that default position of cherry picking history to suit one's cause. It retards progress.

 

[tigertim]

tigertim, I might be wrong and probably am but I think the National Sorry Day is more about being sorry for the decades of abducting indigenous children from indigenous mums and dads and all the unimaginable pain and suffering that caused in order to culturally cleanse Australia of indigenous ways rather than being sorry for all the dispossession and killing. That's another matter.
So many things to worry about when you take over a land and its peoples by force.

So 2 different days to say sorry?

 

[Al Bundy]

....
Every day we live in this country we benefit from the dispossession of the original inhabitants. When we gain benefit we also need to take responsibility for how that benefit was gained.

DS

Why?

Why should we?

 

[glantone]

So 2 different days to say sorry?

Well, this is just me but Jan 26 'National Day of mourning' - No problem. Feel for the Indigenous.
A separate 'Sorry Day' in response to the generations of abducted children - No problem. Feel for the indigenous.
Australia Day gets moved to another date on which everyone can party - Let the good times roll.
What's the rumpus?

 

[glantone]

Why?

Why should we?

Why should we take responsibility for how the benefit was gained?
Perhaps because we're yet to see any form of closure. The state of things remain unresolved. It is ongoing, current. The origins may be historical but the aggrieved still feel they have not yet had their day in court.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

Well, this is just me but Jan 26 'National Day of mourning' - No problem.

No you don't. You're not going to desecrate January 26.

Come up a suitable day to celebrate (as you say above) and we can talk.

 

[Al Bundy]

Why should we take responsibility for how the benefit was gained?
Perhaps because we're yet to see any form of closure. The state of things remain unresolved. It is ongoing, current. The origins may be historical but the aggrieved still feel they have not yet had their day in court.

I doubt not matter is done there will ever be closure. So then what?

So every single culture the world has that have been aggrieved, or any country in this world. How far back do we go
Where would u dtaw the line and for whom. Pick a point in history. 2000 yrs ago. Maybe 500 yrs ago. Throw a dart in a map in Europe say. Youll find an instance there too.

Not buying anything your preaching.

 

[glantone]

I doubt not matter is done there will ever be closure. So then what?

So every single culture the world has that have been aggrieved, or any country in this world. How far back do we go
Where would u dtaw the line and for whom. Pick a point in history. 2000 yrs ago. Maybe 500 yrs ago. Throw a dart in a map in Europe say. Youll find an instance there too.

Not buying anything your preaching.

So you have your doubts. So you’re not alone. But what kind of benchmark is doubt to live by?

I’m not worried about every other culture in every other country in the world now, in the past or in the future. None of them have known or will ever know I exist. Pointless argument. Everyone has to fight their own fight. But I do live here, I work, vote and pay taxes here and I'll probably die here so reckon I have a right to influence what goes on around me.

Not preaching anything. Couldn’t care less what you or anyone else thinks. It’s just an opinion. Life in all its ways goes on with or without my knowledge or consent. No preaching here.

 

[glantone]

No you don't. You're not going to desecrate January 26.

Come up a suitable day to celebrate (as you say above) and we can talk.

..hahahha... you're too funny!

 

[Al Bundy]

So you have your doubts. So you’re not alone. But what kind of benchmark is doubt to live by?

I’m not worried about every other culture in every other country in the world now, in the past or in the future. None of them have known or will ever know I exist. Pointless argument. Everyone has to fight their own fight. But I do live here, I work, vote and pay taxes here and I'll probably die here so reckon I have a right to influence what goes on around me.

Not preaching anything. Couldn’t care less what you or anyone else thinks. It’s just an opinion. Life in all its ways goes on with or without my knowledge or consent. No preaching here.

Doubts?? What r u on about. Suddenly about u? Whatever.

Oh well. Enjoy life.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

..hahahha... you're too funny!

Fed up with lefties who do nothing but whinge, belittle, destroy.

 

[tigersnake]

Fed up with lefties who do nothing but whinge, belittle, destroy.

now that is also too funny. The right never do any of those things, pisser