Australia Day Poll | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
  • IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.

Australia Day Poll

Which applies to you?

  • Celebrate Australia Day. Keep the date.

    Votes: 43 52.4%
  • Celebrate Australia Day. Change the date.

    Votes: 26 31.7%
  • Don't celebrate Australia. Keep the date.

    Votes: 2 2.4%
  • Don't celebrate Australia Day. Change the date.

    Votes: 7 8.5%
  • Prawn sandwich on the barbie

    Votes: 2 2.4%
  • Other...please specify.

    Votes: 2 2.4%

  • Total voters
    82

Brodders17

Tiger Legend
Mar 21, 2008
17,811
11,990
tigertim said:
What’s silly is they don’t want to recognise the day but still take the public holiday off. Hypocritical really.

except they cant not give staff the public holiday. it is the law.

http://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/what-would-it-take-to-change-the-date-of-australia-day/8209122
it appears the 'tradition' that some are adamant we have to protect isnt really much of a tradition at all.
 

tigertim

something funny is written here
Mar 6, 2004
30,097
12,509
Brodders17 said:
except they cant not give staff the public holiday. it is the law.
People are allowed to work on a public holiday. Tens of thousands of retail and service staff do it every public holiday.

If they felt THAT strongly about it they’d go to work on the 26th January.
 

YinnarTiger

Tiger Legend
May 2, 2007
7,541
732
75
Gippsland
tigertim said:
People are allowed to work on a public holiday. Tens of thousands of retail and service staff do it every public holiday.

And most get paid penalty rates if they do. That's why Kennett and Greiner declared January 26 as the Australia Day public holiday.
 

glantone

dog at the footy, punt rd end
Jun 5, 2007
1,390
439
The mob I work for close on Jan 26. And I don't get paid. If I'm gunna lose a day's pay it better be for something better than a couple of centuries ago England dumped a bunch of down trodden law breaking chavs and rotten toothed soldiers on these lands and then went on to treat the locals like fauna.

Perhaps the gov should include the indigenous community in identifying a more appropriate date or would that be outrageously conciliatory?
Whatever date Maurice Rioli put pen to paper will do me.

Currently, the whole thing is a farce - calling for all Australians to come together and celebrate Jan 26 whilst continuing to ignore the growing and obvious resentment from the indigenous community is so …so…so..Trumpacious.
 

LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
33,186
11,546
Melbourne
glantone said:
The mob I work for close on Jan 26. And I don't get paid. If I'm gunna lose a day's pay it better be for something better than a couple of centuries ago England dumped a bunch of down trodden law breaking chavs and rotten toothed soldiers on these lands and then went on to treat the locals like fauna.

Perhaps the gov should include the indigenous community in identifying a more appropriate date or would that be outrageously conciliatory?
Whatever date Maurice Rioli put pen to paper will do me.

Currently, the whole thing is a farce - calling for all Australians to come together and celebrate Jan 26 whilst continuing to ignore the growing and obvious resentment from the indigenous community is so …so…so..Trumpacious.

Now they have their mits on Anzac Day. Can you not see what is happening here?
 

Al Bundy

Premiers 2017, 2019, 2020 ...2021?
Aug 27, 2003
7,141
616
Melbourne
https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/state/vic/2018/02/04/anzac-day-frontier-wars-indigenous/

9:00pm, Feb 4, 2018 Updated: 10:13pm, Feb 4

Anzac Day political feud over Indigenous ‘frontier wars’

The state government has denied it plans to make Anzac Day inclusive to Indigenous survivors of the Frontier Wars. Photo: AAP

Rachel Eddie

Reporter

The Victorian government has rubbished reports Anzac Day could be used to commemorate Indigenous people killed defending their communities during British colonisation.

A report commissioned by the premier’s department, seen by The New Daily, last year canvassed “the social value of war commemorative events”.

Views on recognising the Frontier Wars on Anzac Day or Remembrance Day were considered on page 36 of the 46-page report. It found such a move would be divisive and unpopular, but said there was “goodwill” for acknowledging Indigenous experiences more generally.

It prompted Opposition frontbencher Tim Smith to claim Premier Daniel Andrews was “ashamed to be Australian”, The Herald Sun reported.

Mr Smith said expanding Anzac Day would be politicising “our most sacred day” through “warped ideology”.

He said he had seen some of the survey results, but not the report, and questioned whether the questions were loaded.

A government spokesperson confirmed there would be no change to Anzac Day or Remembrance Day.

“We do everything we can to back our veterans and honour the sacrifice of all servicemen and women.”

The spokesperson confirmed the government would not consider adding a separate public holiday to commemorate Indigenous lives lost, either.



Opposition Leader Matthew Guy said Anzac Day was “not negotiable”.

The survey results

More than 500 Victorians responded to an online survey for the report, commissioned by the Department of Premier and Cabinet. The study also included interviews and group discussions with stakeholders, commemoration participants and non-participants.

“The study demonstrates that there is an expectation that commemoration will continue in a recognisable form, for perpetuity,” the report found.

Premier Daniel Andrews was accused of being "ashamed to be Australian". He's pictured with Melbourne Lord Mayor Robert Doyle and Victorian Governor Linda Dessau at the Anzac Day service last year.
Premier Daniel Andrews is pictured with Melbourne Lord Mayor Robert Doyle – who is on leave while he’s investigated for sexual harassment allegations – and Victorian Governor Linda Dessau at the Anzac Day service last year. Photo: AAP

Thirty per cent of respondents agreed that Indigenous people killed while defending their communities between 1790 and 1930 should be reflected in Anzac ceremonies. Nineteen per cent disagreed.

Participants were more reluctant to agree the Frontier Wars should be recognised in Anzac or Remembrance Day ceremonies in the group discussions.

“Some said they didn’t want to feel guilty on a day where they liked to feel pride. Others said they disliked Indigenous Australians ‘getting more’ – this was almost framed as a battle for cultural resource,” the report said.

An Indigenous veteran in the study said different events served different purposes for him – allowing him to reflect as a serviceman at Anzac services, and reflect on the Indigenous struggle at the Victorian Aboriginal Remembrance Service on May 31.

“Importantly, he valued both of these opportunities to commemorate,” the report said.

One-quarter of survey respondents agreed Anzac Day had changed over time and would continue evolving, while 7 per cent disagreed.

Comparatively, one-third said “any change to how we do Anzac Day would destroy the meaning of the day”.

Almost half (44 per cent) agreed Anzac Day should “reflect the impact of all wars that have affected Australians, no matter where they have come from”. Five per cent disagreed.

More than one-fifth agreed Anzac Day should be changed to be more inclusive, while one-quarter disagreed.

“It has to be about Anzacs first and foremost,” one participant said.

“ If you dilute that too far by making it about everyone impacted by war, no matter they come from or who they fought for, it will end up just being an ‘international recognition of war day’.”


The report recommended the government work with local Returned Service Leagues (RSL) and the Shrine of Remembrance “to explore the gentle evolution towards the inclusion of more diverse stories as part of commemorative events, without undermining what people hold dear about the day”.

It also recommended the government “explore community interest in a more prominent Victorian Aboriginal Remembrance Service”.

“There was general interest and good will in this study to do with the experiences of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people. While exploration of specific events, such as the frontier conflicts, within the structure of Anzac Day is likely to lead to resentment and conflict, the VARS offers a less controversial vehicle for Victorians to recognise their state’s Indigenous past.”

The Aboriginal population of Australia dropped by about 90 per cent between 1788 and 1900.
 

martyshire

^^ Jack Graham that is
Aug 11, 2007
1,664
8
Rowville...or maybe London
YinnarTiger said:
Tim Smith making outrageous claims so that he can get his name in the newspaper?
Polly makes outrageous claim. There is no news here. They all do it (especially when in opposition)

Just the HS trying to create more fear and division. That paper will be the death of this country. If only Supercoach wasn't so popular.
 

LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
33,186
11,546
Melbourne
glantone said:
No I can't. How about telling me what is happening.

For a branch of politics describing itself as "liberal", the Left is hellbent on taking our freedoms away. White males made this country great, accept it or go and live in China.
 

glantone

dog at the footy, punt rd end
Jun 5, 2007
1,390
439
Al Bundy said:
https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/state/vic/2018/02/04/anzac-day-frontier-wars-indigenous/

9:00pm, Feb 4, 2018 Updated: 10:13pm, Feb 4

Anzac Day political feud over Indigenous ‘frontier wars’

The state government has denied it plans to make Anzac Day inclusive to Indigenous survivors of the Frontier Wars. Photo: AAP

Rachel Eddie

Reporter

...................... The Aboriginal population of Australia dropped by about 90 per cent between 1788 and 1900.

The indigenous population dropped by 90% between 1788 – 1900. Can that be right?

Geez, after living here for 50,000 years or so you'd reckon someone would have left a note. Wonder where they all went?
 

LeeToRainesToRoach

Tiger Legend
Jun 4, 2006
33,186
11,546
Melbourne
glantone said:
The indigenous population dropped by 90% between 1788 – 1900. Can that be right?

Geez, after living here for 50,000 years or so you'd reckon someone would have left a note. Wonder where they all went?

Maybe to the same place they got the 1788 census figures from.
 

glantone

dog at the footy, punt rd end
Jun 5, 2007
1,390
439
Don’t see why we can have a nationally recognised day of mourning in respect for past injustices committed against indigenous Australians with at the very least all the massacres listed on some kind of memorial stone/tablet..whatever. What’s the beef with that? How are present day non indigenous Australians any lesser for it?

If as a nation we shouldn’t have to publicly and formally acknowledge these events because it makes us feel bad then we should celebrate the massacres, the injustices, etc. I mean even more overtly! Perhaps some re-enactments. Plenty of massacres to choose from.

Wishing it would all just go away is kind of childish.
 

tigertim

something funny is written here
Mar 6, 2004
30,097
12,509
glantone said:
Don’t see why we can have a nationally recognised day of mourning in respect for past injustices committed against indigenous Australians with at the very least all the massacres listed on some kind of memorial stone/tablet..whatever. What’s the beef with that? How are present day non indigenous Australians any lesser for it?

If as a nation we shouldn’t have to publicly and formally acknowledge these events because it makes us feel bad then we should celebrate the massacres, the injustices, etc. I mean even more overtly! Perhaps some re-enactments. Plenty of massacres to choose from.

Wishing it would all just go away is kind of childish.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Sorry_Day
 

MD Jazz

Don't understand football? Talk to the hand.
Feb 3, 2017
13,510
14,008
tigertim said:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Sorry_Day

I don’t think that is quite the same as what glantone has suggested.

fWIW I agree with glantone. We don’t have to take personal responsibility for the wrongs but we can and should acknowledge them more formally. It can only help.
 

Rosy

Tiger Legend
Mar 27, 2003
54,348
31
MD Jazz said:
........
fWIW I agree with glantone. We don’t have to take personal responsibility for the wrongs but we can and should acknowledge them more formally. It can only help.

So you think Australia Day should be a day to focus on negatives?
 

MD Jazz

Don't understand football? Talk to the hand.
Feb 3, 2017
13,510
14,008
rosy3 said:
So you think Australia Day should be a day to focus on negatives?

No. I think glantone is recommending we have a separate day, in no way related to aust day, where a simple acknowledgement of past atrocities and wrongs is made. It could be a day for all to hear true stories of the impacts on indigenous aust. Perhaps it could also involve discussion around ways to improve outcomes, working together.
 

tigertim

something funny is written here
Mar 6, 2004
30,097
12,509
MD Jazz said:
I don’t think that is quite the same as what glantone has suggested.

How so?

Glantone said:
glantone said:
Don’t see why we can have a nationally recognised day of mourning in respect for past injustices committed against indigenous Australians

And National Sorry Day says:
“National Sorry Day is an annual event that has been held in Australia on 26 May, since 1998, to remember and commemorate the mistreatment of the country's indigenous population.”

Sounds like we already have the day Glantone wishes for.
 

Al Bundy

Premiers 2017, 2019, 2020 ...2021?
Aug 27, 2003
7,141
616
Melbourne
MD Jazz said:
No. I think glantone is recommending we have a separate day, in no way related to aust day, where a simple acknowledgement of past atrocities and wrongs is made. It could be a day for all to hear true stories of the impacts on indigenous aust. Perhaps it could also involve discussion around ways to improve outcomes, working together.

Is that what their cultural leaders want? have they stated that, or is it again based on what others think is right for their culture.

I would love to see their "final" blueprint to all the issue they raise. What is the end point where they will be happy to co-exist with all cultures here now. Will they comprise? its very polarised. I don't know but ask.

No matter how they feel they were going to be colonised by someone 200yrs ago. Rest of the world was so advanced and seeking new lands to expand to. They had no weaponary to match the power of other cultures. They did not stand a chance. (Eg similar the native Indians in USA).