Unions

[Liverpool]

I think its about time the police went in and dismantled this ILLEGAL blockade with water cannons and rubber bullets, if need be.

People have a right to go to work and not be harassed, bullied, and intimidated by these standover merchants.
The public also have a right to go into the city without having streets blocked off and barricaded because of these criminals.

I see one of the things they are protesting about is the right to wear union colours on Grocon sites.....sounds petty, but its how they can distinguish who is in the union and who they can bully to join the union.

I hope Grocon shut the site down for a few months and see if the unions pay the mortgages and bills of their members protesting.
One for all and all for one, eh?

 

[Ian4]

as PRE's resident right-winger, i'm surprised you didn't go harder at bashing the unions.

 

[Liverpool]

as PRE's resident right-winger, i'm surprised you didn't go harder at bashing the unions.

I'm just misunderstood on here, Ian4 ;D

Actually, with my position, I should be totally anti-union however, believe or not, I do have a heart and have seen instances where workers have needed a union or someone to turn to when fellow managers or companies have tried to take advantage of a situation that was either unfair or unsafe.

There is a place for unions to balance things out, however they should be a silent, co-operative, and a positive force for workers and employees to turn to....not some militant, loud, aggressive mob-rule that we are seeing on TV and in our media, using threats, blackmail, and intimidation to try and get things 100% their way.

The problem for the employee in this situation is that if they do go back to work, there is tension and bad-blood then between management and the workforce and as a worst-case scenario, if the unions get a win...it may in the end force the business to close down or move offshore.
Will the unions be there for the employees then, when they are unemployed becauase of their aggressive tactics?

 

[tigertim]

No time for unions like the CFMEU and their low brow, violent, "money for nothing" mentality. No time.

 

[Al Bundy]

The union conducted an illegal blockade and cost thousands of dollars of damages to a business (irrespecive of who). They were out of line & I hope in this instance they are sued & forced to pay damages.

I don't mind unions as they helped so many people but they did cross the line recently.

 

[MB78]

The union conducted an illegal blockade and cost thousands of dollars of damages to a business (irrespecive of who). They were out of line & I hope in this instance they are sued & forced to pay damages.

I don't mind unions as they helped so many people but they did cross the line recently.

Very well summed. I'm in a union and I expect them to be hard working and professional like I have to be at work.

 

[Al Bundy]

Very well summed. I'm in a union and I expect them to be hard working and professional like I have to be at work.

Well said.

Personally had the Financial Sector union helped me and my colleques years ago in the 90s. If it wasn't for them over 150 employers were going to get screwed over. They were very professional, fought through the courts and won ! We were paid correctly upon the forthcoming retrenchment for all of us. I commend them for their support & conduct.

 

[Freezer]

Where's Maggie when you need her?

 

[Streak]

No time for unions like the CFMEU and their low brow, violent, "money for nothing" mentality. No time.

X2.

 

[Streak]

Well said.

Personally had the Financial Sector union helped me and my colleques years ago in the 90s. If it wasn't for them over 150 employers were going to get screwed over. They were very professional, fought through the courts and won ! We were paid correctly upon the forthcoming retrenchment for all of us. I commend them for their support & conduct.

Unions certainly have a place, but the CFMEU need to be put into theirs. This is a disgrace.

 

[tigergollywog]

We need corrupt, militant, ruthless, violent unions to counterbalance the psychopathic CEOS (did you know a psychopath cannot feel the pain or even imagine the persective of another person? In the regular population, you can expect 1 psycho per 100 people. In positions of power (politics and boardrooms), you could expect 4/100. interesting hey? These numbers say to me that capitalism favours the psychopath!). If unions were all driven by the teachings of ghandi, the psycho CEO would be licking his lips as he crushed his workers like mice. Reactions and equal and opposite reactions and all that ... its rocket science.

 

[Big Cat Lover]

We need corrupt, militant, ruthless, violent unions to counterbalance the psychopathic CEOS (did you know a psychopath cannot feel the pain or even imagine the persective of another person? In the regular population, you can expect 1 psycho per 100 people. In positions of power (politics and boardrooms), you could expect 4/100. interesting hey? These numbers say to me that capitalism favours the psychopath!). If unions were all driven by the teachings of ghandi, the psycho CEO would be licking his lips as he crushed his workers like mice. Reactions and equal and opposite reactions and all that ... its rocket science.

Sounds like the argument some use when condoning torture and other interrogation techniques of suspects/terrorists. An eye for an eye and all that stuff.

 

[Ian4]

We need corrupt, militant, ruthless, violent unions to counterbalance the psychopathic CEOS (did you know a psychopath cannot feel the pain or even imagine the persective of another person? In the regular population, you can expect 1 psycho per 100 people. In positions of power (politics and boardrooms), you could expect 4/100. interesting hey? These numbers say to me that capitalism favours the psychopath!). If unions were all driven by the teachings of ghandi, the psycho CEO would be licking his lips as he crushed his workers like mice. Reactions and equal and opposite reactions and all that ... its rocket science.

lol, pretty dramatic way of putting it. i might steal that fact for verbal diarrea talk with mates at the pub.

how about you state it in the way i prefer to state it? this country wouldn't as as properous today if it wasn't for the union movement. yes some unionists can be corrupt, but they are no less corrupt than rich businessman who rort the tax system or do everything in their power to stop a vulnerable worker of receiving the salary he is entitled to.

 

[Liverpool]

lol, pretty dramatic way of putting it. i might steal that fact for verbal diarrea talk with mates at the pub.

how about you state it in the way i prefer to state it? this country wouldn't as as properous today if it wasn't for the union movement. yes some unionists can be corrupt, but they are no less corrupt than rich businessman who rort the tax system or do everything in their power to stop a vulnerable worker of receiving the salary he is entitled to.

In the position I am in, I should hate unions...however, I am a realist and know that if it wasn't for unions, then the balance of power would be far too much in favour of businesses.

So I understand that we need both unions and businesses to keep things "in balance", so to speak.

The problem I have is that with businesses, you know a lot of the time they make decisions based on the bottom line, investors returns, and managers bonuses.
With unions however, while they are meant to be balancing these decisions by sticking up for workers rights....they also make decisions that are quite selfish...and based more on what is best for the union movement as a whole, and not on the workers they are meant to be going in to bat for.

They make decisions where we have riots in the city streets as showing everyone that the union is still a force, however what damage has that done to workers around the nation, in particular, workers at Grocon?

If Grocon shut up shop or decided to hire workers from the Pacific Islands, would the unions pay the bills and mortgages of their constituents?

When the union criticises a company and its pay structure and more or less blackmails a business to pay a certain percentage of a pay-rise...and then that business has to move offshore to survive....will the unions get their members a new job? or pay for childcare or the bills?

I've been on sites in the past where people have walked off the job because hot soup wasn't provided...FFS! :

 

[tigergollywog]

lol, pretty dramatic way of putting it. i might steal that fact for verbal diarrea talk with mates at the pub.

how about you state it in the way i prefer to state it? this country wouldn't as as properous today if it wasn't for the union movement. yes some unionists can be corrupt, but they are no less corrupt than rich businessman who rort the tax system or do everything in their power to stop a vulnerable worker of receiving the salary he is entitled to.

feel free to use any internet facts in any social situation as you see fit ian. be my guest. How about I state things my way and you state things your way? We ARE both saying the same thing, but if we both said it your way, it would appear twice and seem like I was just copying you. If you want to hear your view twice, I would recommend yelling it towards a mountain about 1km away, the echo should bring a smile to your face.

 

[Ian4]

Livers, i agree when it comes to balance. you say you can't always trust unions to always do the right thing and i say you can't always trust employers to always do the right thing. although i'd like to think in a country such as australia, the pro's of both parties outweigh the con's. what you've personally been exposed to helps mould you own view on this i guess.

i've personally had many issues with my own union. i haven't always believed they have gone about things the right way. i've refused to strike a few times (although i did walk out when they had the huge workchoices protest), but overall they have done a lot of good for us.

tigergollywog - touche.

 

[tigergollywog]

My union is as weak as *smile* (The MWWWU - the miscellaneous weird wog workers union), but I keep paying my fees because ...... together, the worker, will never be defeated. Now obviously the worker, even the organised and solid, will be defeated pretty regularly, especially on a Monday morning shovelling *smile* in 2 deg C. However, the disorganised and divided will ALWAYS be defeated. Unions can be, and often are, are a bunch of bully boy dumb corrupt (Orwellian) pigs. Craig Thompson and his successor are a case in point. Normie Gallagher was an entertaining, but nasty, peice of work. My original point earlier about Psycho CEO's was a not very articulate way of saying, there are pricks on both sides (the 4% on corporate boards compared to 1% at a Richmond V StKilda game is supportable data Ian4, you should use it tomorrow night at the Pub - I reckon its great data - A bloke recently wrote a book on it - of course at a Richmond V Carlton game, you'de be pushing the number up to 1.5-2%). I think Left Wing power corrupts (the well-meaning comrade), whereas Right Wing power attracts (the psycho) ??? The pricks balance each other out, leaving the honest working man with a roof over his head, half a bed and with a stroke of luck, beer in the fridge.

Now, I feel better after my 40 hour Abbott/Rhinehart rant. They have been getting me pretty angry of late. Thanks for reading and writing tiger brothers and sisters. I am going to have a stubby and a durry, thankfully earn more than $2 for a fair days work tomorrow, and then enjoy the finals. :-\

 

[poppa x]

2 words.
Craig Thompson.

 

[Sintiger]

Always been in favour of good Trade Unions because I have seen enough in my business career to know that there are Managements around who will exploit the workforce if given the opportunity. I have also seen Unions who see it as some sort of class war and have little or no understanding of what it takes to have a successful business.

There are good employers and bad employers, good unions and bad unions.

What we have seen in recent times is examples of really bad unions, the HSU and the CFMEU .

I have worked in Western Europe with the Workers Council concept. Some of the collaboration requirements are over the top but my experience was that it was far more a partnership relationship than a competitive one. Generally I haven't seen that in Australia.

 

[Brodders17]

2 words.
Craig Thompson.

what do those 2 words mean?