If I'm Graham and hearing my spot on the list is in contest with Ross, I'm sleeping pretty well at night.
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Jack Ross
- Thread starter Tigertool
- Start date
I get your point.
But the fact they're both being considered as 'like for like' might give Graham the odd unsettled night's sleep.
Im struggling to get Graham into our best 22. Same for Ross.
That'd be their concern but a great position for us to have.
Especially with the professional way they prepare
Graham finished 16th in the BNF from 20 games last year. The players he finished directly (but barely) above were Edwards (21 games but diminishing form to say the least) Cumberland (8 games) & Maurice Jnr (14 games medical sub multiple times)
And this is before we recruited 2 ball winning mids.
I wouldn't be sleeping easy at all if I were Graham.
I guess the out clause is he was carrying an injured toe - so maybe just battling on and carrying a role when we were struggling in midfield with prestia out a lot too.
Hard to know.
EDIT: Could say he was injured for that too though despite being declared fit
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Sounds like there is a pretty compelling injury impact on last year though.
For me Graham is a proven big game performer who can be relied upon to deliver in the key moments. The sort of guy that you feel good running out with in a final because you know what you will get.
At the moment Jack Ross is the sort of guy you feel uneasy about running out with in a final because deep down you wonder if he is good enough. That's a big difference.
I'd say you're overstating Graham's "big game" performances.
Yes, he kicked 3 goals in the 2017 GF - great performance.
Played through a busted shoulder in the 2019 PF - Brave performance.
I'd contest his last above average big game performance though was the 2017 GF 6 years ago. I would have said his other 7 big game performances were barely passable at best or below average for his position.
His finals averages is 12 touches per game as a mid from 9 matches. (I didn't include the 2019 PF disposal tally in there given that's obviously not fair to Graham.)
I cannot for the life of me see where Graham fits in a fully fit squad for us this year.
I also thought Ross' EF performance was pretty strong, and his end to the year was also very good.
is it fair to say , for Ross to be top 22 he needs the list to have injuries or he would need to improve
and Jack G is lineball top 22 without the list having injuries , but he does have to recapture his pre injury form
and Jack G is lineball top 22 without the list having injuries , but he does have to recapture his pre injury form
That's all pretty true, TBR. But Ross did perform in the elimination final. 23 disposals, a goal, 3 goal assists (most in the game) and 9 contested possessions (equal 2nd for us behind only Nank whose were mostly grabbing it out of the ruck and handballing to Neale).
He also stepped up with 25 disposals and 6 clearances when we were undermanned against Geelong.
@Danjam might be right that with Chimp, Dion and Dusty not having long left in the game we look to keep both. Or one or both could see the writing on the wall and make a move. With Graham hampered in the pre-season, Ross is likely to get first crack.
All I can say about the Ross and Graham conversation is that both are AFL level players and if we are struggling to get one or both in the team then we are in a good spot.
I may not have said that about Ross before last year but he was very good, especially in the 2nd half of the season.
Bodes well for when we have the inevitable injuries during the year.
To finish top 4 we probably need a strong top 30
At the moment I struggle to get more than one of Ross, Graham and Sonsie in my best 23 and to me it is only a matter of time before Sonsie overtakes the other two, if he hasn’t already.
I like Jack Ross, he strikes me as someone who is improving all the time and works really hard to do so.
I may not have said that about Ross before last year but he was very good, especially in the 2nd half of the season.
Bodes well for when we have the inevitable injuries during the year.
To finish top 4 we probably need a strong top 30
At the moment I struggle to get more than one of Ross, Graham and Sonsie in my best 23 and to me it is only a matter of time before Sonsie overtakes the other two, if he hasn’t already.
I like Jack Ross, he strikes me as someone who is improving all the time and works really hard to do so.
I was never a Ross fan until the latter stages of last season - if he can build on that form he’s a keeper. But he’s not an inside mid - he’s a linking mid.
Graham I’ve always liked - but he’s backup material with the talent we have now. It’s a good thing.
Graham I’ve always liked - but he’s backup material with the talent we have now. It’s a good thing.
I reckon the same applies to Graham- he might look like an inside mid, but when we have the ball he does his best work running forward.
If neither are inside mids then who is our next up and coming big bodied inside mid? We are going to need more than just Taranto and Hopper post 2023. Absolutely love Sonsie but he is more of a balanced mid with an inside/outside mix and will probably not be that pure contested type player.
So our next trade or draft targets are big inside mids and key position forwards. I'd be happy if that's all they looked for in the next 3 years to be honest. Pretty happy with our rucks, key position backs, small backs and small forwards. Could always do with more outside run - but that's a lesser priority. I'm confident that we'll get the right types through the door in that 3 year period.
Yes I think for this years draft/trade period we have to pick up another big bodied mid who can run as well as a ready made key forward via trade or free agency (really like the look of Jacob koschitzke from Hawthorn) and a developing key forward from the draft. That’s gives us the building blocks to compete for premierships over the next 5 years.
If one of either Jack Ross or Jack Graham get pushed out at the end of the year that will hopefully net an early or mid second round selection to help secure some more high end talent.
if he is relegated to just out side best 22, with Ross, well Ross would be a lot cheaper salary cap wise.
I see Jack Ross as being a considerable improver this year. Last year I had MJ as being that player, and this year I’ve got Ross.
I think he can become regular 22. He closed the year off pretty well. His kicking is elite.
Given the right role and opportunities, think he can find a couple of levels this year.
I think he can become regular 22. He closed the year off pretty well. His kicking is elite.
Given the right role and opportunities, think he can find a couple of levels this year.
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