Australia Day Poll

[TT33]

Would there still be the same objections if it was changed to January 1st. This is the date when Australia became a Nation in 1901.

Call it Australia Day or Federation Day.

I'm sure some agitators would still cut up rough just for the sake of it.

 

[Baloo]

People would object because Jan 1st is already a public holiday

 

[TT33]

People would object because Jan 1st is already a public holiday

That's true Baloo, maybe we should just delay it by 25 days & call it Australia Day

 

[Giardiasis]

No irony there.

Unlike the irony in people advocating for large immigration today and yet disparaging it back in 1788.

 

[tigertim]

Unlike the irony in people advocating for large immigration today and yet disparaging it back in 1788.

Or the irony in people saying “Aborigines are the first Australians and should be listened to and respected.”

But the “second” Australians shouldn’t......

But the “third” Australians (Greeks, Lebs, Vietnamese, Italians etc) should.....

Segregation, ain’t it great.....

 

[mrposhman]

i asked you because in your original posts you said you think the date should stay the same. you then said the date was irrelevant.

i dont think anyone is suggesting changing the date Australia Day is celebrated will lead to instant drastic change in the living conditions of Indigenous Australians, but it doesnt need to. it is not one or the other. The date can be changed while attempts are made to make change on the ground.
celebrating the day Cook landed and decided Sydney would be a good place for a penal colony, which led to the slaughter of thousands of Indigenous Australians offends many people, and not just Indigenous Australians.

suggesting changing the date is in any way similar to change the name of our country is nonsense, as is comparing changing the date of Australia Day to changing the date of Christmas. Australia Day has been celebrated on Jan 26 across the country for about 20 years. the comparison is about as useful as many of those used in the marriage equality debate.

Brodders, but isn't the issue that the indigenous leaders have indicated that they don't want a date change, they want the day abolished altogether as they don't want to celebrate that they were invaded. Changing the date will do nothing.

If we want to resolve these issues in totality then both sides have to give a little. The indigenous leaders need to accept that Australia is here to stay, 20m people are not going to up and leave. Australia will not "burn to the ground". History is history whether its good or bad, all countries have history that they wish they could take back but its just that and its history that we must learn from.

IMO olive branches should be offered to the indigenous community to increase their feeling of involvement and integration into the country of Australia that has been built around them. I stated on the previous page that we should integrate the Aboriginal flag into the Australian flag, whether they may be through changing the star colours, or imbedding the flag inside say the Southern Cross I don't know but it would go some way to them feeling involved.

Australia Day should still be celebrated as a celebration of what Australia stands for today.

However, inclusion will never occur if the indigenous leaders still want to go down the route of full restitution and wanting Australia to somehow disappear / burn to the ground, however some of their leaders want to describe it. If that occurs then they will always be in the glass half full camp and will always therefore feel excluded.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

Would there still be the same objections if it was changed to January 1st. This is the date when Australia became a Nation in 1901.

Call it Australia Day or Federation Day.

I'm sure some agitators would still cut up rough just for the sake of it.

In all honesty I would've been prepared to countenance moving the date to Jan 1 and enacting a new public holiday celebrating the contribution of Aboriginals. However the movement has shown its hand - they don't hate the day, they hate white colonisation. It's enough for me to shut the door on any discussion.

Even Fairfax isn't touching the latest outburst from the group which organised the Melbourne protest. Jealous destroyers, like most hard-core lefties.

 

[Al Bundy]

Nearly 55% want the date kept on this poll.
Majority have spoken.

The other thought ive had is if the British didnt colonise Aust. Which country wouldve come in to take over. There was no chance in hell they could have maintained control as they had not industrialise yet and were behind to rest of the world.

Not saying its right how they were treated. Many cultures/countries have been colonised over history. A number freed themselves but here they couldnt.

I dont have answers to how it can diplomatically be resolved. In roads have been made and parcels of large land given back under certain criteria. Its a polarised problem. There are now 16 million people living here from many parts of the world calling this country home.

 

[TigerFlag2017]

I am currently reading Stan Grant's book Talking to my Country. It is a very moving book from a fellow Australian that I would highly recommend.

 

[tigertim]

I am currently reading Stan Grant's book Talking to my Country. It is a very moving book from a fellow Australian that I would highly recommend.

I bought this book last year and try as i might i couldnt get into it.

 

[easy_tiger]

a new public holiday celebrating the contribution of Aboriginals.

great idea

maybe call it 'contribute a continent' day?

 

[MD Jazz]

i asked you because in your original posts you said you think the date should stay the same. you then said the date was irrelevant.

i dont think anyone is suggesting changing the date Australia Day is celebrated will lead to instant drastic change in the living conditions of Indigenous Australians, but it doesnt need to. it is not one or the other. The date can be changed while attempts are made to make change on the ground.
celebrating the day Cook landed and decided Sydney would be a good place for a penal colony, which led to the slaughter of thousands of Indigenous Australians offends many people, and not just Indigenous Australians.

suggesting changing the date is in any way similar to change the name of our country is nonsense, as is comparing changing the date of Australia Day to changing the date of Christmas. Australia Day has been celebrated on Jan 26 across the country for about 20 years. the comparison is about as useful as many of those used in the marriage equality debate.

Agree with all this. The date is extremely relevant to many in a negative way. Not sure how many feel a significant connection to the date in a positive way?

The date of the birth of Australia as many know it can still be acknowledged, but it should be acknowledged warts and all - the good and the bad.

 

[tigertim]

moving the date to Jan 1 and enacting a new public holiday celebrating the contribution of Aboriginals.

Good idea. And a day to celebrate the contributions of immigrants.

And women.

And whiteys.

If only we had a day to celebrate all these people and their contributions......

 

[MD Jazz]

I bought this book last year and try as i might i couldnt get into it.

Curious as to why you would buy it?

Many on here appear to have little interest (or empathy for) indigenous life/history/struggle. Most can barely acknowledge indigenous disadvantage. Most take offence as if they are being blamed personally.

I know as a child born to middle class white parents I never went hungry, always had a comfy bed and decent clothes. Had emotional support and was encouraged at school and sport. Parents could pay for all sport participation and school camps.

I wonder how many indigenous kids had such a privileged life? I know of heaps of kids whose parents can’t pay for any of that. No money for school clothes, camps etc. barely fed properly let alone supported with discipline at home. Adequate sleep and nutrition? Domestic violence impacts? And then people call them dole bludgers (and worse) when they don’t turn out as functioning productive members of society. Many had little chance.

 

[Coburgtiger]

Good idea. And a day to celebrate the contributions of immigrants.

And women.

And whiteys.

If only we had a day to celebrate all these people and their contributions......

great idea

maybe call it 'contribute a continent' day?

"You bring the continent, we'll bring the syphilis."

 

[easy_tiger]

"You bring the continent, we'll bring the syphilis."

name your poison. literally.

I think White Middle Class day is a great idea.

Everyone could wear little paper hats made out of Saturday's Domain and cheer

 

[Rosy]

Curious as to why you would buy it?

Many on here appear to have little interest (or empathy for) indigenous life/history/struggle. Most can barely acknowledge indigenous disadvantage. Most take offence as if they are being blamed personally.

...........

Are the first sentence and the second sentence related there? It sounds to me your curiosity is born under an assumption that Tim has little interest or empathy and that he takes it as personal blame.

The second sentence is a massive assumption. I'm sure most are aware of the history and acknowledge it.

.........
I know as a child born to middle class white parents I never went hungry, always had a comfy bed and decent clothes. Had emotional support and was encouraged at school and sport. Parents could pay for all sport participation and school camps.

........

Good on you but not sure of the relevance. That wasn't the experience for everyone. Not everyone belonged to middle class white family. Far from it. Even middle class white family isn't a guarantee of positive emotional support, adequate diet, encouragement and decent clothes. Not everyone at my school growing up attended camps or participated in sport and excursions. It used to break my heart. Even myself, coming from a middle class white family, couldn't go on camp one year because business was too quiet.

........

I wonder how many indigenous kids had such a privileged life? I know of heaps of kids whose parents can’t pay for any of that. No money for school clothes, camps etc. barely fed properly let alone supported with discipline at home. Adequate sleep and nutrition? Domestic violence impacts? And then people call them dole bludgers (and worse) when they don’t turn out as functioning productive members of society. Many had little chance.

I get an impression that what you refer to as lack of empathy and interest is more a case of focusing on the present and future than wallowing in the past. Nothing can change the past. It's tragic and horrible.

We have an Aboriginal Elder friend who I've referred to before. She calls the non-indigenous, vocal rent a crowd people who speak up for them white darkies. She thinks they do more harm then good. She won't listen to excuses from or from the aboriginal youth in her area. She's not in denial of a tragic past but she is aware of what is needed for a more positive future. She knows that opportunity exists like it hasn't in the past.

Bitter and disappointingly insensitive things like Australia burning down, not resting till they get all the land back, abolishing Australia Day completely, accusations of KKK treatment, blame for treatment of women and high incarceration numbers, poems about STILL being prisoners of war, 229 years of terrorism etc can't serve any positive purpose. It's not sending Aboriginal youth a message of a positive future. Those comments coming from so called leaders are divisive and damaging. I'd love them to focus on the positives and role models. There have been several Indigenous Australians of the Year. Many top sportspeople. Many movie stars and musos. Plenty of families living akin to "middle class whites" : Focus on the future ahead. Equal opportunity in the workplace. Equal access to medical treatment and welfare.

I've said before I think changing the date is a band aid approach when the problem runs far deeper. The idea has been rejected by Indigenous people. Some out of bitterness. Some out of appreciation. You'll never please, or appease, everyone but focus on the past is never going to build a brighter future.

Lizzy Jarrett’s poem: Not sure what her message is really..but I get the feeling changing the date, a date plenty of Indigenous people do celebrate, won't change a thing. I wonder who she thinks is actually celebrating the things she mentions.

26th Jan Australia’s day to celebrate their nation

Celebrating our brave warriors murders and mutilations

Celebrating our bravest women’s rapes and molestations

Celebrating our bond of family broken by forced separations

All in the name of the great white Australia’s assimilation

So “please explain” who enjoys a celebration

Of the Genocide of our First Nations

It’s in the past, get over it they say

Okay so how about we forget about Anzac Day

For realise we are still, still STILL prisoners of war

229 years of terrorism on our shores

Today we stand strong as we have survived

BLACK and PROUD, STRONG AND ALIVE!”

 

[Tigers of Old]

Celebrate Australia Day. Keep the date.
However when we become a Republic, that would be the ideal opportunity to change it.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

great idea

maybe call it 'contribute a continent' day?

Who's going into bat for Mungo Man?

 

[casper68]

I get an impression that what you refer to as lack of empathy and interest is more a case of focusing on the present and future than wallowing in the past. Nothing can change the past. It's tragic and horrible.

100% agree Rosy3.
Sooner or later our Indigenous community needs to move forward and stop looking backward.