Seriously? The one fumble he’s had in his career and that’s what you judge him on. Mate, he’s as sure a ball handler as we have in our side at present. And yes, that was a bad and costly fumble but it’s a rarity with Nick. The guys a gun
-
IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
Bowden v Vlastuin
- Thread starter Merveille
- Start date
I remember that incident distinctly. Yep, Vlastuin screwed up, although in his defence he was going for the ball and had little choice - he had to go for it with Betts nearby, we all know how dangerous Betts was, and the ball took a nasty bounce for him. It happens.
But, what really struck me then, and now, was his response after the fumble. Clearly someone asked him how he was, Vlastuin thumbs up told me that it was an everyday fumble, not over-awed by the fact he was in a Grand Final. That gave me a lot of confidence, I knew then that the players were in a good mind set and we were going to give it a hell of a shake. Didn't convince me we would necessarily win, but did convince me they were ready to play. As it turns out, ready to play a game which would pull Adelaide apart
That Vlastuin could accept he made a mistake and then get on with playing his role in a Grand Final raised him in my estimation.
DS
Great point and being in their first GF for so long, was a great indication the psychology of the group and playing in the moment, looking forward not dwelling on mistakesI remember that incident distinctly. Yep, Vlastuin screwed up, although in his defence he was going for the ball and had little choice - he had to go for it with Betts nearby, we all know how dangerous Betts was, and the ball took a nasty bounce for him. It happens.
But, what really struck me then, and now, was his response after the fumble. Clearly someone asked him how he was, Vlastuin thumbs up told me that it was an everyday fumble, not over-awed by the fact he was in a Grand Final. That gave me a lot of confidence, I knew then that the players were in a good mind set and we were going to give it a hell of a shake. Didn't convince me we would necessarily win, but did convince me they were ready to play. As it turns out, ready to play a game which would pull Adelaide apart
That Vlastuin could accept he made a mistake and then get on with playing his role in a Grand Final raised him in my estimation.
DS
I was there that night.
He was ‘on fire’ that first half against a premiership team.
3 years on and I still can’t get over Byrne-Jones getting AA over Vlastuin. It still burns me because it was a F@rkin joke. I honestly didn’t know who Byrne-Jones was at the time.
The AA committee claimed consistency over the course of a few years helps get you on the radar. Vlastuin was good for a few years and was great in 2020. Byrne-Jones came from nowhere to get an undeserved gig. And we all know what Dusty did to him in the 2020 Prelim.
Vlastuin’s disposal is elite. He’s better than Bowden under pressure for mine. He would have to be in the top percentile of being able to hit a target under pressure. But Bowden would have superior creativity.
Tony Lockett kicked more goals than anyone in the history of the name, but arguably his most famous moment was a point.
Last edited:
In checking the stats Waiting I noticed that Joel was born in June 1978 and played his first game in June 1996. That means he must have been 17 when he joined the club.
I didn’t realise 17 year olds were still eligible to play then? Clearly they were
Didn’t explain well.
These days a player must turn 18 by the end of the year in which they are drafted. Joel Bowden was drafted (as a F/S) in 1995 but didn’t turn 18 until June of the next year, just a few weeks before he played his first game
If the rules were the same then as they are now Joel wouldn’t have been able to play until 1997
Isn't that a massive contradiction? If you don't know the bloke how can you possibly know if he deserved it or not.
Same thing happened with Luke Ryan that year, because he was off-broadway people were outraged but anyone who watched him play all year would know he would have been the first one picked.
DBJ had an exceptional year in 2020. Played amazing footy. He also didn't get picked in place of Vlastuin, because they are different players. DBJ is more of a Jayden Short type. Nick Haynes was picked ahead of Vlastuin if anyone was.
Bowden had loads of talent in a team with many fringe players. Its no wonder he had to be moved around to positions he really wasn't used to - yet still thrived. 2 x AA, once as the CHB, despite his size. Absolute gem in some average times for the Tiges.
Vlas is a fantastic player, but has had the luxury of working in the same position with the same guys for an extended period of time.
Love them both, and clearly time will say Nick has had the better career but Joel was a favorite - a gun.
Vlas is a fantastic player, but has had the luxury of working in the same position with the same guys for an extended period of time.
Love them both, and clearly time will say Nick has had the better career but Joel was a favorite - a gun.
From memory - I reckon he had another mishap in the next few minutes - a wayward set kick from defence that was intercepted?I remember that incident distinctly. Yep, Vlastuin screwed up, although in his defence he was going for the ball and had little choice - he had to go for it with Betts nearby, we all know how dangerous Betts was, and the ball took a nasty bounce for him. It happens.
But, what really struck me then, and now, was his response after the fumble. Clearly someone asked him how he was, Vlastuin thumbs up told me that it was an everyday fumble, not over-awed by the fact he was in a Grand Final. That gave me a lot of confidence, I knew then that the players were in a good mind set and we were going to give it a hell of a shake. Didn't convince me we would necessarily win, but did convince me they were ready to play. As it turns out, ready to play a game which would pull Adelaide apart
That Vlastuin could accept he made a mistake and then get on with playing his role in a Grand Final raised him in my estimation.
DS
At the time I was fearing that his confidence could have been quite affected.
Fortunately - as you say - he showed his class and strength of character. Gun!
Dangerous exercise to compare two top line players for the same club
I come out as horribly woke here and say we should celebrate both
From the outside it looked like Joel was a real onfield leader , he and Wayne Campbell the target of a lot of illegal late hits
I think recall an oppostion coach be asked about targeting that pair and the response was along the line of cut the head off the snake
Premierships weren't possible for Joel , thru no fault of his own , he showed high skill levels was very versatile and do believe team focused
Joel was used as a ball distributor , sometimes as the quaterback , sometimes as the guy to deliver into the F50 , and he was placed under huge physical pressure
and would hang tough and still try to deliver quality ball and not panic and throw the ball on the boot , and to me that is bravery
Vlas is famous for sitting under the high ball to the point of almost stupid brave , although not looking silky smooth Vlas hits a lot of targets under pressure
just doesn't have that eye catching style of Joel or Bachar Houli
I typically only get to one of two games per year but love to soak up the atmosphere and you get a sense of who the blue collar richmond faithful love and I think that would be similar to who the players value
the two players that stood out for me were Jake King , geez the love for that guy by our rank and file supporters sitting next the fence was huge
and the other is Tigga , boy do they love Tigga
I would not be surprised if you asked a Richmond coachfrom the last 20 years " do you want Vlas or Joel in your side ?" They say both , you need both styles in a side of 22
They are like our children
I come out as horribly woke here and say we should celebrate both
From the outside it looked like Joel was a real onfield leader , he and Wayne Campbell the target of a lot of illegal late hits
I think recall an oppostion coach be asked about targeting that pair and the response was along the line of cut the head off the snake
Premierships weren't possible for Joel , thru no fault of his own , he showed high skill levels was very versatile and do believe team focused
Joel was used as a ball distributor , sometimes as the quaterback , sometimes as the guy to deliver into the F50 , and he was placed under huge physical pressure
and would hang tough and still try to deliver quality ball and not panic and throw the ball on the boot , and to me that is bravery
Vlas is famous for sitting under the high ball to the point of almost stupid brave , although not looking silky smooth Vlas hits a lot of targets under pressure
just doesn't have that eye catching style of Joel or Bachar Houli
I typically only get to one of two games per year but love to soak up the atmosphere and you get a sense of who the blue collar richmond faithful love and I think that would be similar to who the players value
the two players that stood out for me were Jake King , geez the love for that guy by our rank and file supporters sitting next the fence was huge
and the other is Tigga , boy do they love Tigga
I would not be surprised if you asked a Richmond coachfrom the last 20 years " do you want Vlas or Joel in your side ?" They say both , you need both styles in a side of 22
They are like our children
Not at all. I had never heard of him tells me he did nothing of significance. I watched a lot of footy in 2020 due to the lockdowns and I stand by my words.
Yes they are different players, but Byrne Jones stole Vlastuin’s spot in the AA Team.
If you watched a lot of footy in 2020 you either weren't watching Port games or weren't paying attention, because you couldn't possibly have not noticed him otherwise.
He won Port's best and fairest by a big margin and was clearly amongst their best players most weeks.
I don't follow the logic of 'stealing' a spot when you are not competing for the same spot. By that logic Nic Naitanui or Max Gawn stole his spot as ruckman.
C'mon TBR. That's taking the *smile*. A defender that can't defend? Terrific. Luke Ryan can actually defend and is a great reader of the play and I reckon has universally more respect than DBJ.
You must judge players on fantasy points?
Let me guess, you are not a fan of Jayden Short? Reckon players should man up and get an opponent each?
Having 6 defenders who all go one on one with a forward and stop them just isn't the way the game is played anymore.
How well did Bachar Houli defend? How well does Daniel Rioli? We know the talk about Short.
How would any of them go stuck one on one on Dustin Martin?
There are all sorts of jobs done by defenders and some of them involve being offensive more than defensive. That's why there are other defenders whose job is to zone off and get up third to help cover them.
Short as a "defender" - no. He's poor. And I've posted plenty of stats highlighting his lack of effectiveness when he has the ball over the years. The myth that is Short's kicking. With our increased depth he could well be out of the side come end of season 2023. He won't be starting back six with Baker/Rioli/Vlastuin/Grimes/Balta/Tarrant/Broad to choose from and if we have luck with injuries there are better midfield options. He might play wing but Grover & Pickett have first dibs there. Cumberland starts befgore him as a forward. He's on the bench at best when all players are available, he does provide the running required.
I still think an AA side has to pick the best players. I don't think DBJ was that. His finals performances proved it that year. Finals generally find out those type of players.
Statistically Vlastuin was almost the equal of DBJ offenisvely in 2020, pretty good considering he also looked after the DBJ type's man and his own!
I'm still trying to work that one out, I think I preferred the good old days of chardonnay sipping, tree hugging, inner city girlie boys. Woke just seems a lazy cop out for such a wonderful array of insults that brought so much colour and life to our political discourse.
