Sound the alarm series - Grand Final Coaches Box footage | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Sound the alarm series - Grand Final Coaches Box footage

Let me have one more go at articulating this.

We will take it as read that our talent identification and draftee profiling is first class. Competition best, if you like.

When we make a pick we nail it, take the right kid, that suits our needs and ticks all the boxes every time. (Even though that is not even close to the case, no matter how good you are)

However in most cases, picking the right kid at that point in time is not particularly beneficial. Only a very small percentage have an impact at 18, we are drafting for players who will develop into good consistent players at about the time they can reach 70-100 games, so 22,23,24 years of age and then if we are going to be a really successful side, the premiership age average is more like 26-28.

So when you are taking that kid in the draft, the art isn't the here and now, it is what are they going to be like in 5 and 10 years time.

Think about you and the people you know and how they changed as people over the decade from when they were 18. How accurately could you have predicated how their personalities and lives would develop?

So let's start with the biggest piece of luck of all, the physical. When you pick those kids out of the draft, tell me which one is going to do a knee at 19 and miss 18 months of footy, setting his development back irreparably? Which one is going to cop a few knocks which turn into a susceptibility to concussion and end their career? Which one has a chemical imbalance that is going to lead to mental health issues? Which one breaks a leg, develops a stress fracture, tears a muscle and picks up some scar tissue that causes it to become chronic?

Medical screenings? Physical assessments? Injury history? Not at all useful in most of those instances.

So there is your first huge piece of luck that's required. Those draftees need to be healthy enough to be developed into players and then to play when you need them. They also need to not be injured at the wrong times or at the same times. You also can't have your more senior players injured which then requires the kids to play before they are ready.

And that's only a tiny part of the future prediction. Tell me which kid you draft is going to move out of home, get a taste of independence and alcohol and all the other things that can turn an 18 year olds head and completely lose all the motivation and dedication they had previously?

Show me which one enrols in a university course and after three years of mixing with other students and discussing the meaning of life decides football isn't really for them?

Tell me which ones can't stop reading newspapers and watching TV footy shows, which ones can't get off social media.

Who is going to be a model citizen, develop beautifully then start to have some success and recognition, have doors open and opportunities present and then lose focus? Who is going to want to earn the cash from sporties or sponsors work? Who is going to develop business opportunities outside of footy that take time and focus?

Which players are going to like each other and dislike each other? Who will grow apart as they get older? Who is going to like or dislike the coaches? Which player's girlfriend is not going to like another girlfriend? Who is going to meet a girl that pushes them to ask for more money? Which ones are going to be loyal? Which ones are going to resent a team mates contract or success?

Who is going to be married with kids later in their career and able to take in and mentor draftees in a settled environment? Who is still going to be living as a bachelor and not want to take that burden on? Who will be a good influence on draftees? Who will be a bad one?

It goes on and on and on and on. The odds stacked against making it as an AFL player, let alone a successful one, let alone an ultimately successful one are huge.

And this is where the argument goes it's culture and leadership and development and all those things and yes, they are important and they can mitigate and eliminate lots of things but they are only as good as the individual's response to them and one unequivocal fact is that despite it all, human beings will go whichever way they ultimately choose.

We started forming our 2017 premiership side in 2006. It was over a decade worth of negotiating all of the physical, mental, spiritual, social, financial and other challenges to get to a position where we had 50 odd guys on our list capable of winning a premiership. And even then any number of factors still had to click for us to be able to do it.

If you don't think there's a good chunk of chance in that then I'd suggest you head into an AFL club and ask for a six or seven figure contract to sign and deliver them a flag.
sorry mate but it wasn't so long ago you were claiming culture isn't important, now you're grudgingly allowing that it is. the backpedal is in full motion now.

enjoy your posts and find them informative, but this is one you can't win. we have the best culture in the league by an absolute mile, it's stunning how connected players/coach/administration are.
 
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Let me have one more go at articulating this.

We will take it as read that our talent identification and draftee profiling is first class. Competition best, if you like.

When we make a pick we nail it, take the right kid, that suits our needs and ticks all the boxes every time. (Even though that is not even close to the case, no matter how good you are)

However in most cases, picking the right kid at that point in time is not particularly beneficial. Only a very small percentage have an impact at 18, we are drafting for players who will develop into good consistent players at about the time they can reach 70-100 games, so 22,23,24 years of age and then if we are going to be a really successful side, the premiership age average is more like 26-28.

So when you are taking that kid in the draft, the art isn't the here and now, it is what are they going to be like in 5 and 10 years time.

Think about you and the people you know and how they changed as people over the decade from when they were 18. How accurately could you have predicated how their personalities and lives would develop?

So let's start with the biggest piece of luck of all, the physical. When you pick those kids out of the draft, tell me which one is going to do a knee at 19 and miss 18 months of footy, setting his development back irreparably? Which one is going to cop a few knocks which turn into a susceptibility to concussion and end their career? Which one has a chemical imbalance that is going to lead to mental health issues? Which one breaks a leg, develops a stress fracture, tears a muscle and picks up some scar tissue that causes it to become chronic?

Medical screenings? Physical assessments? Injury history? Not at all useful in most of those instances.

So there is your first huge piece of luck that's required. Those draftees need to be healthy enough to be developed into players and then to play when you need them. They also need to not be injured at the wrong times or at the same times. You also can't have your more senior players injured which then requires the kids to play before they are ready.

And that's only a tiny part of the future prediction. Tell me which kid you draft is going to move out of home, get a taste of independence and alcohol and all the other things that can turn an 18 year olds head and completely lose all the motivation and dedication they had previously?

Show me which one enrols in a university course and after three years of mixing with other students and discussing the meaning of life decides football isn't really for them?

Tell me which ones can't stop reading newspapers and watching TV footy shows, which ones can't get off social media.

Who is going to be a model citizen, develop beautifully then start to have some success and recognition, have doors open and opportunities present and then lose focus? Who is going to want to earn the cash from sporties or sponsors work? Who is going to develop business opportunities outside of footy that take time and focus?

Which players are going to like each other and dislike each other? Who will grow apart as they get older? Who is going to like or dislike the coaches? Which player's girlfriend is not going to like another girlfriend? Who is going to meet a girl that pushes them to ask for more money? Which ones are going to be loyal? Which ones are going to resent a team mates contract or success?

Who is going to be married with kids later in their career and able to take in and mentor draftees in a settled environment? Who is still going to be living as a bachelor and not want to take that burden on? Who will be a good influence on draftees? Who will be a bad one?

It goes on and on and on and on. The odds stacked against making it as an AFL player, let alone a successful one, let alone an ultimately successful one are huge.

And this is where the argument goes it's culture and leadership and development and all those things and yes, they are important and they can mitigate and eliminate lots of things but they are only as good as the individual's response to them and one unequivocal fact is that despite it all, human beings will go whichever way they ultimately choose.

We started forming our 2017 premiership side in 2006. It was over a decade worth of negotiating all of the physical, mental, spiritual, social, financial and other challenges to get to a position where we had 50 odd guys on our list capable of winning a premiership. And even then any number of factors still had to click for us to be able to do it.

If you don't think there's a good chunk of chance in that then I'd suggest you head into an AFL club and ask for a six or seven figure contract to sign and deliver them a flag.

That was comprehensive. What I take out of it is that the one thing that separates RFC from all the other teams, the reason we have been more successful in a Team oriented way, is that we have Emma Murray.

:D
 
I'm not sure how anyone can watch that video and not see a gaping gap between the two coaches.

When we were down Dimma was all over the reasons and working to correct them ie forwards getting up too high etc etc.

When the cats were on top, Chris s\Scott seemed to be clueless as to why they were on top. His comments were the sort of comments you'd expectto hear from the guy sitting in the stands next to you. It was almost as if he was a supporter who'd been given the strings!

The idea that they were doing us slowly while we ran over them like an out of control B-Double was cringe worthy. Yes project confidence, but don't sound like a delusional idiot.

Adding to his misery was that eery time Dustin Martin got the ball it hurt Geelong. Every time Patty Clangerfield got the ball.................. it hurt Geelong!

Dimma knows the shape of our game, and he seems to know how to control the shape of the oppositions game, so long as the boys come to play. THat first half we were rattled by a few injuries and seemed to lose some composure, but that Hawkins goal putting them 22 points up, not the half time siren, was the turning point.

As soon as we were 22 points down, it was like as a collective group we've thought "Ok guys, we're getting in the sh!te here, we better step on it" and we did, controlling the game pretty much from the moment the ball went back to the centre to the final siren.
 
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Hardwick will need to dig deep into his bag of footy coaching tricks in order to reinvigorate the team's approach and the collective desire to succeed. I believe he will have these matters in hand, as best he can. Going to be very interesting viewing over the next few weeks to see how Dimma goes about coaching the team and addressing the need to change aspects of the game plan.
 
Glad I watched that vision of the grand final from the coaches' perspective before I watched Friday night's game!
 
Let me have one more go at articulating this.

We will take it as read that our talent identification and draftee profiling is first class. Competition best, if you like.

When we make a pick we nail it, take the right kid, that suits our needs and ticks all the boxes every time. (Even though that is not even close to the case, no matter how good you are)

However in most cases, picking the right kid at that point in time is not particularly beneficial. Only a very small percentage have an impact at 18, we are drafting for players who will develop into good consistent players at about the time they can reach 70-100 games, so 22,23,24 years of age and then if we are going to be a really successful side, the premiership age average is more like 26-28.

So when you are taking that kid in the draft, the art isn't the here and now, it is what are they going to be like in 5 and 10 years time.

Think about you and the people you know and how they changed as people over the decade from when they were 18. How accurately could you have predicated how their personalities and lives would develop?

So let's start with the biggest piece of luck of all, the physical. When you pick those kids out of the draft, tell me which one is going to do a knee at 19 and miss 18 months of footy, setting his development back irreparably? Which one is going to cop a few knocks which turn into a susceptibility to concussion and end their career? Which one has a chemical imbalance that is going to lead to mental health issues? Which one breaks a leg, develops a stress fracture, tears a muscle and picks up some scar tissue that causes it to become chronic?

Medical screenings? Physical assessments? Injury history? Not at all useful in most of those instances.

So there is your first huge piece of luck that's required. Those draftees need to be healthy enough to be developed into players and then to play when you need them. They also need to not be injured at the wrong times or at the same times. You also can't have your more senior players injured which then requires the kids to play before they are ready.

And that's only a tiny part of the future prediction. Tell me which kid you draft is going to move out of home, get a taste of independence and alcohol and all the other things that can turn an 18 year olds head and completely lose all the motivation and dedication they had previously?

Show me which one enrols in a university course and after three years of mixing with other students and discussing the meaning of life decides football isn't really for them?

Tell me which ones can't stop reading newspapers and watching TV footy shows, which ones can't get off social media.

Who is going to be a model citizen, develop beautifully then start to have some success and recognition, have doors open and opportunities present and then lose focus? Who is going to want to earn the cash from sporties or sponsors work? Who is going to develop business opportunities outside of footy that take time and focus?

Which players are going to like each other and dislike each other? Who will grow apart as they get older? Who is going to like or dislike the coaches? Which player's girlfriend is not going to like another girlfriend? Who is going to meet a girl that pushes them to ask for more money? Which ones are going to be loyal? Which ones are going to resent a team mates contract or success?

Who is going to be married with kids later in their career and able to take in and mentor draftees in a settled environment? Who is still going to be living as a bachelor and not want to take that burden on? Who will be a good influence on draftees? Who will be a bad one?

It goes on and on and on and on. The odds stacked against making it as an AFL player, let alone a successful one, let alone an ultimately successful one are huge.

And this is where the argument goes it's culture and leadership and development and all those things and yes, they are important and they can mitigate and eliminate lots of things but they are only as good as the individual's response to them and one unequivocal fact is that despite it all, human beings will go whichever way they ultimately choose.

We started forming our 2017 premiership side in 2006. It was over a decade worth of negotiating all of the physical, mental, spiritual, social, financial and other challenges to get to a position where we had 50 odd guys on our list capable of winning a premiership. And even then any number of factors still had to click for us to be able to do it.

If you don't think there's a good chunk of chance in that then I'd suggest you head into an AFL club and ask for a six or seven figure contract to sign and deliver them a flag.
Would think that over a ten year period of time with 18 clubs and around 1500 individual players during that period the randomness of LUCK would be fairly evenly spread to everyone. As the old saying goes, you make your own luck in life n usually those that work harder n smarter than the rest tend to somehow make more luck.
 
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Dare I say it, we have been lucky to have more solid citizens than not. ;)
Lucky enough to have enough solid citizens to be able to take some risks with not so solid citizens and have a reasonable success rate in the higher risk category even.
Dusty, as flaky as they come as a young fella, been amazingly successful.
Cuz, only club in the comp willing to try n help a lost cause.
Stacka, obviously some life issues restricting his upbringing n growth as a young man, still somewhat shaky and a work in continuous progress.
Fish, difficult past n well in the process of rebuilding his life where we created the opportunity to help write a modern sporting fairy tale.
 
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the start of the 3rd quarter, where the coaches are addressing the players at half time. Scott says "they (Richmond) are shitting themselves around the contest" Dreaming Scott! Near the end of the second quarter, even without Dusty's goal, we were playing much better and geelong were very ordinary.
 
Lucky enough to have enough solid citizens to be able to take some risks with not so solid citizens and have a reasonable success rate in the higher risk category even.
Dusty, as flaky as they come as a young fella, been amazingly successful.
Cuz, only club in the comp willing to try n help a lost cause.
Stacka, obviously some life issues restricting his upbringing n growth as a young man, still somewhat shaky and a work in continuous progress.
Fish, difficult past n well in the process of rebuilding his life where we created the opportunity to help write a modern sporting fairy tale.


Yes. Our club does have an influence on how our players grow and develop.
 
So, Mark Neeld = Any all time great coach?
Brisbane at the time had 3 brownlow medialists in the team. Fearless CHF and a number of all Australian. with that team, it was the cattle.
For us, it was the coach, his ideas, his belief and his game style, coupled with great culture and the willingness of the players to play their role.
 
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I'm not sure how anyone can watch that video and not see a gaping gap between the two coaches.

When we were down Dimma was all over the reasons and working to correct them ie forwards getting up too high etc etc.

When the cats were on top, Chris s\Scott seemed to be clueless as to why they were on top. His comments were the sort of comments you'd expectto hear from the guy sitting in the stands next to you. It was almost as if he was a supporter who'd been given the strings!
spot on. chalk and cheese. a Grand Canyon-sized chasm between them. Dimma was all about us and what we needed to do, it was ;we we we'. Scott was all about us as well, how to react to what we were doing, it was all 'they they they'. Dimma was giving directives to the assistants, Scott was asking his assistants questions, and mostly stupid or pointless questions at that, he came across as afraid to make a decision.

It also fits with Dimma saying he loves his job and Scott saying he hates his job.

on another note, Scott came across as all huff and puff, no substance, a bit of a *smile* head, but Adam Simpson made him look like a genius warrior prince! FMD, the man is a complete idiot.