Coronavirus

[Al Bundy]

No point arguing with Ian4.

His three great loves in order are Dan Andrews, Melbourne Victory and Richmond Football club.

So you need to accept that’s it’s the Fed’s, NSW and Murdoch press fault.

If rusted on ALP/Green voters questioned the policies of the government they would listen a lot more to these people as they are their voters, their meal tickets. At the moment there is stuff all accountability, parliament is not even open.

I just want accountability, personal responsibility and reward the efforts and the behaviours of those doing the right thing. Those that won’t get vaccinated don’t get any rewards.

At least we agree on the RFC. Haha

Ive been a swingin voter. Have voted for Labor most( not all) of my life. Not last election.

 

[Al Bundy]

Al, are you aware of how many HQ breaches there actually were last year? The answer is 2. Every state has had HQ breaches and somewhere on this thread is a list of how many. I believe that NSW actually has had more than Vic.
I have said over and over again on this site that the breaches were not the real issue, it was what happened afterwards. The contact tracing was poor but they were also lied to. Contact tracing was also the VIc governments responsibility clearly so they can’t walk away from that.
As soon as it got into aged care it was all over, that’s where the majority of deaths came from and as someone who is aware of how that played out I can tell you the conditions in some were appalling. SCOMO must take some responsibility for that, they regulate aged care.
Dan has enormous responsibility for what happened but if we say it was just him we will be wrong imo.
We have not had a problem with HQ since, our contact tracing is now so much better than it was then and aged care is much better protected. So we have learned from it.
However if we are going to take Dan to the gallows for those 800 deaths last year SCOMO and Coldbeck have to go with him imo.

I understand everything u are stating. A lot i agree with too. Not all. Thats what opinions are about.

Age care has been F@#$^d for many many years. The crap with HQ last year & cover ups are criminal. Hiring a security firm in 5 mins with lack of proper protocols & quickly by text to some mate of a mate. No training, oh 1 day, no proper ppe, cause hundreds of deaths. They lack accountability. Forced a 2 mth lockdown to deal with the govt mistake. Busineeses went under, sucides, deaths, 4.5 billion of fed support to help last yr to try to ease the pain & we still dont know who made the decisions.

Ive bagged scomo on a number of things but this narrative & q is pulling it away from the bs comments i laughed at. Blaming a newspaper for a current outbreak. Come on. Thats tje bs beung peddled atm by Dans key bot on twitter to distract his failings.

On HQ Even his own dept were questioning why that particular security firm was allowed to get 30mill and not on the authorised govt list. Prev firm was kicked out on a false narrative of sexual harassment. That vanished or proof shown.

 

[Tigers of Old]

YouTube to block misinformation videos about all vaccines

YouTube says it will block all anti-vaccine content, moving beyond its ban on false information about the COVID vaccines to include all misinformation about other approved vaccines also.

www.abc.net.au

 

[DavidSSS]

Clearly the lockdown is not having the desired impact at the moment. Many reasons for this all discussed above.

There is one, and one only, way out of this, and that is for everyone to get vaccinated.

Those arguing that we somehow need to wait to find out the long term effects of the vaccinations are simply pathetic. We have used vaccines for decades, longer. If we had the same mind-numbingly stupid arguments a couple of decades ago we would still be living with smallpox, polio etc. Vaccines are well known technology and there is no reason to think there will be long term effects.

What we do know is the short term effect of not having vaccines - people contract COVID, people get sick and people die.

There is simply no comparison - there is an infinitesimal chance of some long term effects of vaccination, there is an immediate and proven impact of not vaccinating.

DS

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

YouTube to block misinformation videos about all vaccines

YouTube says it will block all anti-vaccine content, moving beyond its ban on false information about the COVID vaccines to include all misinformation about other approved vaccines also.

www.abc.net.au

Even though misinformation is a great disservice, YouTube as supreme arbiter of truth is troubling. This is how most North Koreans are unaware Americans have landed on the moon.

 

[AngryAnt]

The vaccine program always was, and still is, the only exit to the pandemic.

Amazing how many people still don't understand this, or are in denial about it. Vaccination will not solve all the problems but its the only solution we have.

 

[AngryAnt]

I find that difficult to believe.

and Im not totally sure you can misinterpret a cartoon?

He's a rampant anti-vaxxer and has been for many years. Guardian article from 2015, the equation of vaccination with fascism is something he's been on about for years.

Leunig's anti-vaccination stance reveals the fantasy world he lives in | Eleanor Robertson

There’s a reason Leunig’s cartoons are pinned up where people are desperately unhappy: the cartoonist has been encouraging a retreat from reality for years

www.theguardian.com

As for misinterpreting a cartoon, of course you can. Or if you like, everyone can have a different take. In this case he's saying vaccination is equivalent to the Tiananmin Massacre, and people who stand against it are heroes like the famous bloke with a shopping bag who stood against the tanks. That bloke was doubtless very dead a short time after that happened.

Dunno how someone finds that parallel amusing, but there you go.

 

[Sintiger]

I understand everything u are stating. A lot i agree with too. Not all. Thats what opinions are about.

Age care has been F@#$^d for many many years. The crap with HQ last year & cover ups are criminal. Hiring a security firm in 5 mins with lack of proper protocols & quickly by text to some mate of a mate. No training, oh 1 day, no proper ppe, cause hundreds of deaths. They lack accountability. Forced a 2 mth lockdown to deal with the govt mistake. Busineeses went under, sucides, deaths, 4.5 billion of fed support to help last yr to try to ease the pain & we still dont know who made the decisions.

Ive bagged scomo on a number of things but this narrative & q is pulling it away from the bs comments i laughed at. Blaming a newspaper for a current outbreak. Come on. Thats tje bs beung peddled atm by Dans key bot on twitter to distract his failings.

On HQ Even his own dept were questioning why that particular security firm was allowed to get 30mill and not on the authorised govt list. Prev firm was kicked out on a false narrative of sexual harassment. That vanished or proof shown.

I haven't commented on the newspaper bit . I have been a critic of Dan's style going back to pre COVID days

I have commented last year on how the security firms were appointed last year and I know a few people who have some knowledge of what happened although not directly involved themselves. I said at the time that knowing the public service and how it works I could totally understand how such decisions could be made in a way that was described by the Royal Commissioner. There was such chaos in the DH and Dept of jobs and precincts then.

I am not defending it and ultimately the Premier is responsible for everything that happens in the state public sector but I do understand how it could happen the way it appears to have.

 

[BT Tiger]

Al, are you aware of how many HQ breaches there actually were last year? The answer is 2. Every state has had HQ breaches and somewhere on this thread is a list of how many. I believe that NSW actually has had more than Vic.
I have said over and over again on this site that the breaches were not the real issue, it was what happened afterwards. The contact tracing was poor but they were also lied to. Contact tracing was also the VIc governments responsibility clearly so they can’t walk away from that.
As soon as it got into aged care it was all over, that’s where the majority of deaths came from and as someone who is aware of how that played out I can tell you the conditions in some were appalling. SCOMO must take some responsibility for that, they regulate aged care.
Dan has enormous responsibility for what happened but if we say it was just him we will be wrong imo.
We have not had a problem with HQ since, our contact tracing is now so much better than it was then and aged care is much better protected. So we have learned from it.
However if we are going to take Dan to the gallows for those 800 deaths last year SCOMO and Coldbeck have to go with him imo.

Victoria's outbreak was the first of about 45 other outbreaks from hotel quarantine nationally. We learned the hard way that postcode restrictions don't work and that state wide lockdowns are required to prevent rapid transmission. We learned through experimenting with masks that the virus is airborne, so the focus shifted away from hand hygiene. Most of the other states learned from Victoria's mistakes and implemented their own short, sharp lockdowns when cases were detected, except of course NSW who arrogantly dismissed the need for lockdowns, and had their pants pulled down by Delta.

I'm pretty tired of this myth that Dan Andrews is solely responsible for the 800 fatalities last year. At least 650 of those deaths occurred within private aged care facilities, and therefore the aged care minister Richard Colbeck, and by extension Scotty from Marketing, is equally responsible (if not more so) for the high death rate. Pretty sure there was an enquiry after the Ruby Princess docked that indicated private aged care was particularly susceptible to an outbreak, yet nothing was actioned.

 

[Ridley]

how the security firms were appointed last year and I know a few people who have some knowledge of what happened although not directly involved themselves.

According to Dan, his ministers, key bureaucrats and basically anyone who fronted the inquiry, no one was directly involved in that process.

It just, er, um, happened......................................

 

[eZyT]

In this case he's saying vaccination is equivalent to the Tiananmin Massacre, and people who stand against it are heroes like the famous bloke with a shopping bag who stood against the tanks. That bloke was doubtless very dead a short time after that happened.

Dunno how someone finds that parallel amusing, but there you go.

I have about 95% confidence thats not what hes saying at all.

and while I appreciate you sharing your interpretation, I have 0% desire to get in an argument about a cartoon

im a Leunig fan. If hes anti-vax, so be it, I still like his take on the world.

I loved how Alex Rance played footy and hes a Jehovahs Witness.

I love Micheal Jacksons music, and he was looney pedophile, allegedly?

p.s. that article is dreadfully conceived and constructed. Its unsurprising that as a long term Guardian subscriber, I have never heard of Eleanor Robertson

 

[mrposhman]

Any comment on the PM of NSW sending the bulk of supply up North? That's what stemmed the bleeding.

Has there been a rebalancing since NSW have got to their higher levels? Doesn't appear to be.

Whilst VIC are still scrambling around for as much Pfizer and Moderna as we can get for those under 40, NSW are now giving both of these to over 60's. Where the hell is the national strategy on this??? Slomo again just devolving decisions that he should be making to the states.

 

[BT Tiger]

BTW, now is not the time to ease back on restrictions. If you want to put more strain on the health care services, giving up on restrictions now would be a good way to do it.

As Tassie premier Gutwein said yesterday, even at 80% double dose they're expecting the virus to go gangbusters once they open up. Living with covid doesn't necessary mean a return to 2019.

 

[mrposhman]

55% of cases aged between 20-40.
1/3rd of cases linked to the long weekend, suggests there was a LOT or rule breaking over GF weekend.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

Any comment on the PM of NSW sending the bulk of supply up North? That's what stemmed the bleeding.

NSW is at 87/63, Victoria at 79/49.

Not sure that's the whole story.

 

[MB78]

Good news that it’s been announced fthat we get an extra 88k Moderna doses to use over the next week.
From the 4th October it’s 3 weeks for the second Pfizer dose.
When 50% of the eligible people have been vaccinated the cases numbers should trend down as that was the NSW experience.
Spoke about how we will be on track to open up at 80%.


Bad news was that most of the new cases are from Friday and Saturday illegal GF parties. Males 55% of the cases. The largest age group 20 to 29

 

[Sintiger]

According to Dan, his ministers, key bureaucrats and basically anyone who fronted the inquiry, no one was directly involved in that process.

It just, er, um, happened......................................

And from what I understand Ridley that is pretty much what did happen. It was made in a taskforce with little oversight and became a “decision”
Make no mistake however, that in itself is a massive failure of public administration in this state.
All I am saying is that I can totally understand how that could occur, but that is not a defence of it

 

[AngryAnt]

I have about 95% confidence thats not what hes saying at all.

but I have 0% desire to get in an argument about a cartoon

im a Leunig fan. If hes anti-vax, so be it, I still like his take on the world.

I loved how Alex Rance played footy and hes a Jehovahs Witness.

I love Micheal Jacksons music, and he was looney pedophile, allegedly?

Of course you can be a Leunig fan and like his work even if he is an anti-vaxxer. But he's an anti-vaxxer, and the meaning of that cartoon is pretty clear.

You are entitled to a different interpretation of that cartoon but I'm buggered if I can imagine what an alternative take might be. Bit weird given you are in favour of mandatory vaccinations IIRC?

 

[22nd Man]

The problem I see with Royal commissions is that they tend to be run by lawyers. Any investigation into what has happened has to include people who actually understand how things like the health system work, in a practical sense. I think they are helpful in the sense of questioning decision making processes but they have to come up with practical achievable solutions, not just aims

I was able to read the outcome of the mental health royal commission in Victoria and whilst i didn't disagree with much of the flavour of the report many of the recommendations are made without any real understanding of what is required to achieve the recommended changes. Saying something needs to be done and understanding what has to happen for those things to be done are not the same thing

in lock step. run by lawyers, presided over by lawyers. Worlds most impractical people. RCs are an abrogation of government and parliament obligations to run the State or Country. If you want to nail some individuals or uncover things that have been suppressed they have some merit (at an astronomical cost) but in terms of SOLUTIONS they create more problems than they solve.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

Pfizer doses now three weeks apart in Vic. Wonder whether Dan was panicked into it?