Yes this has to be cleaned up.
It is virtually impossible to eliminate all the anomalies in these lockdowns but this is a really bad one.
-
IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
Coronavirus
- Thread starter Tigers of Old
- Start date
It is virtually impossible to eliminate all the anomalies in these lockdowns but this is a really bad one.
It’s a slightly different context MDJ but there is a lot of literature and examples about cost vs outcome in health. What people don’t understand is that these decisions are made and have been made well before COVID
For example how do we decide priority for a heart transplant between younger and older people ? Drugs that cost $500k p.a. to prolong someone’s life, a very expensive operation with a 10% survival rate, chemotherapy for an 85 year old?
These decisions are made all the time. This one we have had with the pandemic is a massive one, opening up and people die or lockdown and livelihoods get destroyed but few people die? ( it’s more complicated than that basic equation I know)
I am glad I didn’t have to make those decisions and I reckon there will be as many opinions between us all as people on this thread. There is no right answer which is what has made it so difficult for so many politicians and health leaders all over the world.
Asking for, ahem, a friend, but can he fly from Europe to Sydney and then waltz into Melbourne and avoid quarantine. He’s vaccinated.
It's the zinger that is meant to end any argument about the right time
to ease any restriction on business or even community activity.
They aren't mutually exclusive objectives.
even the most ardent promoter of welfare for anyone who wants it would agree that people are Healthier when they are have a job than sitting at home.
Show me a *smile* Economy with great health system (Cuba and North Korea excepted) and I will reassess my position.
Proviso. Assume each state with their own rules of entry could create one more class of rules and say only someone who has been Australia 14 21 days can enter the state. Cannot imagine WA rolling out the red carpet to anyone who hasn't come through their quarantine.
The worst and longest running anomaly in Vic is the "intimate partner" exception. Gave carte Blanche to teenagers and twenty somethings to move between households in and out of metro at will. That's when I knew it wasn't just health "advice".
Apparently so.
Gunna be happening as soon as N.S.W. hits 80% double vaxxed around Nov1. They'll be bringing in stranded Aussies plus tourists who are fully vaxxed and negative with no quarantine requirements.
Loving the photos of people in NSW and the rest of Australia enjoying their lives, going to the pub, visiting friends and family. Whilst in Victoria we continue to be locked in our homes 12 weeks into a 7 day circuit breaker lockdown. And when we hit 70% double vaccination we still can’t visit people in homes or travel outside of Melbourne. Yet with all these restrictions we are still seeing 2000 cases a day. The rest of Australia is marching ahead and Victorian is being left behind.
I was as critical as anyone of NSW authorities handling of this outbreak but it is clear in hindsight they have got it a lot less wrong than in Victoria. People up there are living their lives and getting 300 cases a day but we’re locked down with 2000 a day. Wouldn’t want to end up like Sydney hey Dan?
I was as critical as anyone of NSW authorities handling of this outbreak but it is clear in hindsight they have got it a lot less wrong than in Victoria. People up there are living their lives and getting 300 cases a day but we’re locked down with 2000 a day. Wouldn’t want to end up like Sydney hey Dan?
I think NSW will be 80% double dosed today or tomorrow. Australia as a whole, and Victoria will be 80% double dosed between the 29th October and 1st November. So in part, the NSW clown, by reopening is working to the "national plan" - 80% of the whole population, and then 80% of the state.
However, I think he doesn't quite understand this statement from the Phase C of the "national plan"
Gradual reopening of inward and outward
international travel with safe countries and
proportionate quarantine and reduced
requirements for fully vaccinated inbound
travellers
It gifts another reason for McGowan to not let me see the sunset on Cable Beach, and for Palaszczuk to not let me see the sunrise from Moreton Island.
Opening a state, to keep the country closed.
What a deckhead.
Once arriving in Aus, would your friend be allowed to leave when he chooses, or is that restriction still in place?
Australia still a lucky country, the below is astounding and tragic really :
**My question is: How many tens of thousands of lives have been lost by the short-sighted, (IMO), decision by countries to pause/ban AZ which is a remarkably safe and effective vaccine. That one decision created a lot of world wide hesitancy for no good reason.
www.theage.com.au
**My question is: How many tens of thousands of lives have been lost by the short-sighted, (IMO), decision by countries to pause/ban AZ which is a remarkably safe and effective vaccine. That one decision created a lot of world wide hesitancy for no good reason.
140,000 jabs for 100 million people in the least vaccinated nation on earth
Already battling Ebola, the Democratic Republic of Congo now confronts widespread vaccine hesitancy as its COVID toll mounts, sparking fears of new mutations.
Last edited:
We might be at the same point soon enough. Don't forget NSW has been locked down longer than us (this time) & were sent a heap of extra Pfizer vaccines to get them to where they are now hence why they're ahead of us. That hasn't happened for us last time I looked.
At risk of repeating myself and again incurring the wrath of the AZ harpies, Astra Zeneca caused blood clots in the brain which killed more than 70 people in the UK alone to mid-2021. Since then the death toll has been reduced to a trickle. My understanding is this is due to doctors becoming adept at recognising the symptoms.
UK scientists find way to treat rare blood clot linked to Covid vaccine
AstraZeneca blood clotting syndrome now “very treatable”
Some of the reports from May and June when concern was at its height, including those on UK government sites, are no longer accessible, and AZ has also since received a public relations makeover. But that doesn't mean there wasn't a big problem with AZ killing otherwise healthy people.
Blood clots associated with AstraZeneca vaccine are ‘rare but devastating,’ study says
- 22% mortality rate
- 41% no other health issues
- 85% under 60
No wrath here dude, it's good to call out the facts. As I said at the time, the blood clot problem would be understood better as more cases came to light and doctors would get better at treating it. That's how medical science and clinical care works.
If there are better vaccines use them - but the equation is pretty simple. Astra Zeneca saved hundreds of thousands of lives.
Your comment about AZ reports being pulled verges on loony tunes conspiracy theory, but you do you.
PS I survived Astra Zeneca and I still haven't died from Covid, thanks for your concern
PPS aren't you the guy who claimed vaccination was a low priority for Australia?
You say "MORE than 70 people" I say "ONLY 70 people, (but all deaths are tragic), how may lives were saved in UK by using AZ or would have been lost waiting for the short supply and distribution problems with Pfizer?
Yes. I don't recall anyone here denying that the blood clots were happening or were not dangerous. Just that they were very unlikely - around 7 per million doses I believe.
Plenty of articles from May-June no longer appear in Google searches. The UK is proud of its home-grown vaccine and sensitive to adverse coverage.
‘Slow’ UK response to AstraZeneca side-effects alarms experts
But early stigmas can be outgrown, e.g. few today associate IBM with the Holocaust.
It was, until Gladys *smile* up. WA and Queensland are non-starters in the race, though. They're galloping for fun.
It's a question of perspective, isn't it? My position was always that since an alternative was available, why would you roll the dice with AZ? Anyone who thinks that's illogical or unreasonable can stick it up their arse.
