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Cricket

Gideon Haigh on Langer and the Selectors:

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/opinion/gideon-haigh/tradition-lost-by-a-secret-knock-at-the-selection-door/news-story/db651760d3663915fd5fd046c68cdb73

Australian cricket has a new obsession. “The line” has been replaced by “the door”, on which selectors have for some time been bemoaning the absence of insistent pounding.

“Try being a selector at the moment,” coach Justin Langer complained after the Boxing Day Test’s contribution to the #nationalbattingcrisis.

“We’ve got to be careful not to reward poor performances but … it’s not as if the guys are absolutely banging the door down. Most of our batters knocking on the door are averaging in the 30s (in the Sheffield Shield).”

Langer is an appealingly frank sort of fellow, and probably unused as yet to having his every word parsed.

Yet this hardly stood up to scrutiny. For a start, there is no “door” of first-class cricket for anyone even to scrabble at at the moment; there is the five-bar gate of the Big Bash League, on which is being scribbled graffiti such as “Darcy Short 4 Me” and “I Heart Marcus Stoinis”.

Also, as my colleague Peter Lalor noted yesterday, Langer’s remarks lack empirical support.

Since moving back to Tasmania after losing his Test spot, for example, Matthew Wade has made 1225 runs at 51. Maybe that’s not banging from the golden age of doors, but it deserves respect.

Over the same period Queensland’s Joe Burns has ground out 1197 runs at 52, Victoria’s Glenn Maxwell 833 at 49, NSW’s Daniel Hughes 1123 at 43.2 and Kurtis Patterson 1110 at 40.7.

Again, not perhaps comparable to those imagined glory days when every batsman in the Shield averaged 50 and every bowler 15, but still solid performances sustained over extended periods despite being compromised, as is the modern way, with ceaseless interruption.

After all, it’s hardly possible to talk about a “first-class season” in Australia since the Shield was cleft in twain by the BBL.

Historically a huge advantage of home countries staging Test matches has been their wider pool of active talent available for selection. A touring team in practice has only its own ranks to draw on; a host has in theory the whole of its first-class competition as a field of candidates.

We decided we were so good seven years ago that we could safely forfeit this edge. Now we’re stuck discussing piecemeal remedies such as more second XI games and shadow squads, or musing sagaciously about “rapid format changes” as though this is somehow a skill rather than simply a necessity.

Under these circumstances, the selectors deserve a measure of sympathy, as they are frequently relying on form with a time decay element. Yet they do not help their own cause by their seeming lurchings from one theory to the next. Just what are the criteria for Australian selection at present? Character? Cover drives? Heredity? Horses-for-courses? Mentions in Ponting’s commentary or on Warnie’s Twitter?

One inference that can be drawn from Langer’s remarks is that the door has a secret knock which you need to know. For the problem appears to be not that nobody is making runs, but that it’s not the people the selectors want.

Wade is 31, Maxwell is 30, Burns is 29. They’ve been tried; they’ve, apparently, been found wanting. There’s already a specialist batsman in the Australian team, Shaun Marsh, with an average less than his age. The selectors seem to dream of a wunderkind, who would not only alleviate the pressures on the Australian team but also vindicate the cricket system — a new Ponting, a tyro Gilchrist, a kid Clarke.

One suspects that these are the “batters knocking on the door” to which Langer refers. Unfortunately this generation are actually not averaging 30 this season; they’re averaging 20.

That’s your Hilton Cartwright, Jake Weatherald, Sam Heazlett, Josh Philippe, Ben McDermott, Jason Sangha, Jack Edwards et al, into whom years of coaching and managerial resources have been ploughed, and for whom enormous futures have been prophesied, almost mandated.

Cricket Australia’s high-performance empire has hardly had a better day than in early November when teenagers Sangha and Edwards put on 180 for the sixth NSW wicket against Tasmania. But that memorable occasion aside, the pair have 286 first-class runs at 17.9 to show for this season.

For his club Manly-Warringah, meanwhile, tall right-hander Edwards has actually never made a century, from fifths to firsts; at first-grade level he has just two fifties.

Strip these from his first-grade record, in fact, and it contracts to 121 runs at 8.64. Yet in some eyes, Edwards will be closer to Australian selection than Wade, Maxwell and Burns.

It’s unkind to single Edwards out: he’s hardly picked himself. He may yet succeed; one hopes he does. But so far he’s been offered opportunities well in advance of his performances. What door has he banged on? Or has he simply tapped politely on an open one?

Anecdotally, too, there’s quite a bit of this going on, since the advent of a pathways system that encourages subjective analysis and rather deprecates mere performance. If you’ve an idle few hours, drill down into MyCricket and check out some pathways cricket averages. Some kids sure seem to get a great run. Just sayin’ …

So perhaps there’s fewer issues with the banging than with the doors themselves, traditional measures of merit having been so thoroughly subverted — often with good intentions, it needs be said, but subverted just the same. To this has lately been added an additional layer, post-Cape Town. The search for “good people as well as good cricketers” is laudable; but what if those the search overlooks end up being regarded as in some ways personally deficient and those who benefit court scorn for being part of the in-crowd?

This is actually unfair to both groups. Perception can be hard to shift; it can even be self-reinforcing, and damaging of the culture it seeks to build. Because doors bear heavily on the rooms into which they open.
 
Good one. Thanks for sharing.

So true. This selection policy and promotion of young kids that haven't earnt the right has Greg Chappell's imprint all over it.

What is wrong with picking guys 30 y.o's if they are clearly the best performed in the next level down.
 
Interesting parallels with Anthony Miles last year.

Wrong players knocking.

I guess the main difference is, how could Australia's team get any worse?
 
Bad toss to lose (again). So important these days.

India under Kohli - 18 wins and 3 draws from 21 correct calls. When he loses the toss, it's 8 wins, 10 losses and 6 draws.

Says a lot about today's pitches when the difference is so decisive.

Overseas team should automatically win it ILO. Would instantly get a fairer contest.
 
Good articles by Haigh (mostly) and Geeves, and agree with Leysy's posting. I can't be arsed going into detail, suffice to say Cricket Australia and the selectors are a pack of *smile* idiots as far as I'm concerned, and like them, 'Elite Honesty' Langer tells the truth as he wants it to be, not as it actually is.

On the Vics, Leysy: Elliott, Hodge and Jamie Siddons would all have played 100 Tests for any other country, and should have had far more opportunities than they got. Maxwell is being crucified, and Agar has been left to wilt on the vine after the most astonishing Test debut innings ever played. Cameron White has a better first-class batting average than any of the current side bar Khawaja (not that I am advocating for his selection). You can bet Ian Harvey would have got far more opportunity and would have played Test cricket if he were from one or three other states.

Having said that, Victorian cricket has not produced a Test champion batsman since Bill Lawry. From all reports Bob Cowper might have been one but he retired at 27 for financial reasons with a Test triple century and an average of 47 under his belt (first-class average rising 54). And anyway, Lawry was still playing, that's how long ago that was. Jones reckons he was a better batsman after the age of 30 but all but the last 3 of his Tests were played before then, before selectors in their wisdom decided a 21-year-old with one year in the game was a better option than the man who had just led the scoring in the most recent series. As much as I loved Damien Martyn as a player, he was not ready when they picked him, which is why it took him another 8 years to cement his spot. Meanwhile, we got 46 Tests of Greg Blewett mediocrity while Jones averaged 75 in Shield cricket.

The Victorian system is far from immune from criticism. The state selectors have picked the wrong players. My Dad, a great judge who has been involved in cricket since the 1940s and whose favourite batsman ever is still Neil Harvey, rates Warren Ayres as one of the best batsmen he's ever seen. Not Premier Cricket batsman - which is where Dad has only ever seen him bat - but any batsmen. Ayres made 7 first-class centuries as an inconsistent but talented young man, then was discarded and never picked again despite making more runs than any player in the history of the state at the next level down. 15,000+ runs, 41 centuries. Meanwhile, they put 20 Shield games into someone like Shawn Craig, not half the cricketer.

Darren Dempsey was another who should have got a go at state level. He's from Mt Gambier and played 3 first-class games for SA with no success, but the only 6 batsmen to make more runs than him in the history of Premier Cricket all played more matches. 10,000 first-grade runs at 43, with 27 tons, and they never picked him. Simon Dart similar - a few first-class games as a kid, none after the age of 23 despite nearly 9000 runs at almost 44 at Premier level. Grant Gardiner, Rohan Larkin and Ben Fletcher are other prolific scorers who should have been given greater opportunity. Aiden Blizzard had too much talent to never get a go for his home state.

And then of course, there is Victoria producing what - 56%? - of AFL footballers, which steals talent from cricket.

All eyes on Pucovski...
 
Yes i don't mind the idea of the visiting team having the choice whether they bat or bowl, they's been a bit of talk about bringing in.

It looks like a good batting pitch, i bet S Marsh get runs, entrenching him in the test team for another 12 months.
 
Great posting lads.


Not keen on Vics policy of recycling or recruiting so many players from other states and then trying to claim them as Vics. Why they would bother playing Dan Christian is a real mystery.


ON the toss, as it is so critical, they should toss once. The winner has the option in the first test and then the teams alternative for the remainder of the tests of any given series.
 
spook said:
Good articles by Haigh (mostly) and Geeves, and agree with Leysy's posting. I can't be arsed going into detail, suffice to say Cricket Australia and the selectors are a pack of *smile*ing idiots as far as I'm concerned, and like them, 'Elite Honesty' Langer tells the truth as he wants it to be, not as it actually is.

On the Vics, Leysy: Elliott, Hodge and Jamie Siddons would all have played 100 Tests for any other country, and should have had far more opportunities than they got. Maxwell is being crucified, and Agar has been left to wilt on the vine after the most astonishing Test debut innings ever played. Cameron White has a better first-class batting average than any of the current side bar Khawaja (not that I am advocating for his selection). You can bet Ian Harvey would have got far more opportunity and would have played Test cricket if he were from one or three other states.

Having said that, Victorian cricket has not produced a Test champion batsman since Bill Lawry. From all reports Bob Cowper might have been one but he retired at 27 for financial reasons with a Test triple century and an average of 47 under his belt (first-class average rising 54). And anyway, Lawry was still playing, that's how long ago that was. Jones reckons he was a better batsman after the age of 30 but all but the last 3 of his Tests were played before then, before selectors in their wisdom decided a 21-year-old with one year in the game was a better option than the man who had just led the scoring in the most recent series. As much as I loved Damien Martyn as a player, he was not ready when they picked him, which is why it took him another 8 years to cement his spot. Meanwhile, we got 46 Tests of Greg Blewett mediocrity while Jones averaged 75 in Shield cricket.

The Victorian system is far from immune from criticism. The state selectors have picked the wrong players. My Dad, a great judge who has been involved in cricket since the 1940s and whose favourite batsman ever is still Neil Harvey, rates Warren Ayres as one of the best batsmen he's ever seen. Not Premier Cricket batsman - which is where Dad has only ever seen him bat - but any batsmen. Ayres made 7 first-class centuries as an inconsistent but talented young man, then was discarded and never picked again despite making more runs than any player in the history of the state at the next level down. 15,000+ runs, 41 centuries. Meanwhile, they put 20 Shield games into someone like Shawn Craig, not half the cricketer.

Darren Dempsey was another who should have got a go at state level. He's from Mt Gambier and played 3 first-class games for SA with no success, but the only 6 batsmen to make more runs than him in the history of Premier Cricket all played more matches. 10,000 first-grade runs at 43, with 27 tons, and they never picked him. Simon Dart similar - a few first-class games as a kid, none after the age of 23 despite nearly 9000 runs at almost 44 at Premier level. Grant Gardiner, Rohan Larkin and Ben Fletcher are other prolific scorers who should have been given greater opportunity. Aiden Blizzard had too much talent to never get a go for his home state.

And then of course, there is Victoria producing what - 56%? - of AFL footballers, which steals talent from cricket.

All eyes on Pucovski...

I hope Pucovski can have some luck with his health, as he looks to be a super talent. I watched him get a double century at the WACA a couple of months ago. He played some of the best on drives you could wish to see, although it wasn't the greatest bowling side he was up against.
 
spook said:
Good articles by Haigh (mostly) and Geeves, and agree with Leysy's posting. I can't be arsed going into detail, suffice to say Cricket Australia and the selectors are a pack of *smile*ing idiots as far as I'm concerned, and like them, 'Elite Honesty' Langer tells the truth as he wants it to be, not as it actually is.

On the Vics, Leysy: Elliott, Hodge and Jamie Siddons would all have played 100 Tests for any other country, and should have had far more opportunities than they got. Maxwell is being crucified, and Agar has been left to wilt on the vine after the most astonishing Test debut innings ever played. Cameron White has a better first-class batting average than any of the current side bar Khawaja (not that I am advocating for his selection). You can bet Ian Harvey would have got far more opportunity and would have played Test cricket if he were from one or three other states.

Having said that, Victorian cricket has not produced a Test champion batsman since Bill Lawry. From all reports Bob Cowper might have been one but he retired at 27 for financial reasons with a Test triple century and an average of 47 under his belt (first-class average rising 54). And anyway, Lawry was still playing, that's how long ago that was. Jones reckons he was a better batsman after the age of 30 but all but the last 3 of his Tests were played before then, before selectors in their wisdom decided a 21-year-old with one year in the game was a better option than the man who had just led the scoring in the most recent series. As much as I loved Damien Martyn as a player, he was not ready when they picked him, which is why it took him another 8 years to cement his spot. Meanwhile, we got 46 Tests of Greg Blewett mediocrity while Jones averaged 75 in Shield cricket.

The Victorian system is far from immune from criticism. The state selectors have picked the wrong players. My Dad, a great judge who has been involved in cricket since the 1940s and whose favourite batsman ever is still Neil Harvey, rates Warren Ayres as one of the best batsmen he's ever seen. Not Premier Cricket batsman - which is where Dad has only ever seen him bat - but any batsmen. Ayres made 7 first-class centuries as an inconsistent but talented young man, then was discarded and never picked again despite making more runs than any player in the history of the state at the next level down. 15,000+ runs, 41 centuries. Meanwhile, they put 20 Shield games into someone like Shawn Craig, not half the cricketer.

Darren Dempsey was another who should have got a go at state level. He's from Mt Gambier and played 3 first-class games for SA with no success, but the only 6 batsmen to make more runs than him in the history of Premier Cricket all played more matches. 10,000 first-grade runs at 43, with 27 tons, and they never picked him. Simon Dart similar - a few first-class games as a kid, none after the age of 23 despite nearly 9000 runs at almost 44 at Premier level. Grant Gardiner, Rohan Larkin and Ben Fletcher are other prolific scorers who should have been given greater opportunity. Aiden Blizzard had too much talent to never get a go for his home state.

And then of course, there is Victoria producing what - 56%? - of AFL footballers, which steals talent from cricket.

All eyes on Pucovski...

Bill Lawry?? Bloody hell. Might as well add the States favouritism in this. As a kid, through the 70s and 80s our team were full of NSW and WA players.
 
tigerman said:
I hope Pucovski can have some luck with his health, as he looks to be a super talent. I watched him get a double century at the WACA a couple of months ago. He played some of the best on drives you could wish to see, although it wasn't the greatest bowling side he was up against.
He is a beautifully balanced player - onside, offside, front foot, back foot. Genuine class.

TigerForce said:
Bill Lawry?? Bloody hell. Might as well add the States favouritism in this. As a kid, through the 70s and 80s our team were full of NSW and WA players.
I don't understand what you are trying to say, TF.
 
spook said:
I don't understand what you are trying to say, TF.

Just can't believe Bill Lawry is touted as the last great Vic batsmen in Test matches (i.e. that long ago!)

Also, Vics were barely given a chance to shine all due to the majority (favoritism?) of NSW and WA players always picked for the Test matches.
 
spook said:
He is a beautifully balanced player - onside, offside, front foot, back foot. Genuine class.

He certainly is, i'd say only bad luck with health would stop him from international honours.
 
TigerForce said:
Just can't believe Bill Lawry is touted as the last great Vic batsmen in Test matches (i.e. that long ago!)

Also, Vics were barely given a chance to shine all due to the majority (favoritism?) of NSW and WA players always picked for the Test matches.
Ah, gotcha. Jones was close to great, and the three I mentioned who should have had more of a go could have been very good international players.
 
jb03 said:
Great posting lads.


Not keen on Vics policy of recycling or recruiting so many players from other states and then trying to claim them as Vics. Why they would bother playing Dan Christian is a real mystery.


ON the toss, as it is so critical, they should toss once. The winner has the option in the first test and then the teams alternative for the remainder of the tests of any given series.
I think Paine must have kicked a black cat under a ladder on Friday the 13th.
 
spook said:
Ah, gotcha. Jones was close to great, and the three I mentioned who should have had more of a go could have been very good international players.

Yeah, Deano was one of our best along with Redpath, Stackpole and Yallop too.
 
spook said:
He couldn't handle fast bowling.
Without having a leadership bone in his body. Was made captain because there was literally no one else.

From memory he wrote a good cricket book - Lambs to the Slaughter or something like that. Or was that someone else.