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Global Warming
- Thread starter Disco08
- Start date
But isn't 99.99999% of everything written these days biased n self indulgenced fact??? Just pick a flavour that suits your preferences.
In a word, no. Stupid statement. There is good, well researched, balanced information, there is total propaganda *smile*, and everything in between. It isn't hard to sort the wheat from the chaff, if you're savvy. Cookers, for example, are not savvy.
Based on history I am not sure if they are "facts" but i can be arsed checking any of them.
This assertion, which you hear over and over again from conservative hacks with no supporting evidence, makes want to fair dinkum spew up! It drives me *smile* mental. It is completely false on so many levels.
1) Impossible to open new mines? Mines are very difficult to build and have a long life. 1 or 2 might start production every year, if you're lucky, another 1 or 2 will close after a 20-60 year life. Its just how it works. Has always been the way, and still is, yet this clown implies its new and due to the hippie menace. he makes it sound like it would be possible to just start up a mine, say a nickel mine, if the price of nickel spikes, hey presto lets watch the cash roll in!! It is ludicrous. Moronic.
2) Re Red Tape, again, totally false. Mines in developed nations take between 5 and 15 years, sometimes more, to set up, Australia is the same as Canada, the US, Europe in terms of approvals. Heres the thing, they take the same amount of time in developing nations where there may be less stringent approvals, due to other barriers, corruption, political instability, poor infrastructure etc.
3) re Red tape again, mines are massive to set up, massive finance, engineering, approvals (or red tape as clown man NC and his idiot mates like to call it). Mining companies do the engineering and design, the financing and the approvals CONCURRENTLY. If one gets done quick, the other will tend to slow it down, but usually, they all take time, they are massive undertakings, all 3.
But Don't my word for it, lets ask the Mining Industry swinging dicks. the global mining industry economics organisation, the Canadian Fraser Institute, does an annual survey of mining Executives, published in Mining Weekly. The main line of questioning is investment attractiveness. WA is number 2 this year, Nevada 1st, SA, NT, QLD are all in the top 10. The whole top 10, is states or provinces of Aus, USA and Canada, which all have the evil red tape that dares to make sure mining companies are doing things properly.
Mining is all about the MINERAL DEPOSIT. If a company finds a high-grade deposit reasonably close to a road or a port, whether its Manangatang, Humpty Doo, Timbuktu or wherever, they will make it happen, and it take 10 to 15 years.
FFS
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Always good, well researched n balanced information when it fits a certain narrative. If not, then the cookers are running amok again, obviously
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Science and engineering has the "truth" - left and right are irrelevant except in terms of virtue signalling.
Renew Economy has an agenda to promote renewables but at least it's largely data and science based.
The main issue with renew economy is their position works (probably) in 10-15 years time and won't deal with what happens in the time in between. Its the inconvenient truth that QOL goes down a lot to transition.
genuinely not sure if you're taking the *smile* or not.Always good, well researched n balanced information when it fits a certain narrative. If not, then the cookers are running amok again, obviously
I believe he was talking about coal mines.
But where’s there’s a quid to be made. It will usually happen. A few palms greased helps politicians get over any personal beliefs or party doctrines. I refer to the Adana Mine in Queensland. Pollies soon got over any environmental concerns.
Many state and eve; the Feds have an aversion to coal, especially using it in coal fired generators. But are quick t9 give the go Achaea’s to send it overseas for other countries to spew em into the atmosphere.
As long as they get their royalties and we will all drive ev’s. That will make up for it.
He may have been talking about coal mines, its irrelevant, 1) my points all apply to coal mines, nickel mines, copper/ zinc/ lead mines, you name it. 2) Conservative hacks trot out this *smile* line, with no evidence, knowing that the vast majority of the public don't know how things work, knowing that its a good soundbite, often and in regard to any given mineral or petroleum commodity.
The Adani case is very complex, your post is a mess, a tangle of complicated interrelated factors, some are correct and I agree with, some are not. I can't write an essay, but to bring it back to my point and criticism of Cater, the Adani mine would have taken just as long to establish as it actually took, even if there was little or no environmental opposition. Thats my point, mines have very long lead times, 20 or 30 years from finding the deposit to shipping product, thats how long it takes, regardless of opposition. Conservative hacks trying to pin long lead times on evil lefty activists is lies, total *smile*.
Nearly always taking the *smile*, there's just something about being a niggling annoying old fart poking at ribs that is terribly addictive.
do you a) not look at authorship, b) not reflect on the authorship, c) dont think authorship is relevant or d) all above
check this out! - the stuff that Big Porridge dont want you to know about
'Cornflakes can solve everything - by W.K Kellogg'
not saying you are a cooker Willo,
but were all cookers sick the day in grade 2 when the librarian explained what author meant?
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Shouldn't take any more than a year or two at most once you've established you've got a suitable deposit of stuff in the ground. Use your mining equipment to scrape a track, then start digging a humungous hole in the ground so ya can send the rocks to China n make some money, jobs done easy as.
Ten, fifteen, twenty years of faffing around with rail lines, infrastructure, environmental, n greeny activist stuff. Bah. Humbug. World's gunna cook or choke to death in a couple of years anyway, according to all the bleaters, might as well hook in n go full throttle.
Since this is the global warming thread.
Does this mean that it'll be so warm during winter none of us will need to even consider turning our heaters on this winter? Just think of all the gas, oil, coal we can save, all the money we can save, all the atmosphere n planet we can save by not needing our heaters this winter coz the whole planet is so nice n toasty warm. Old fart might not even need the woolly long johns n fluffy slippers to keep all nice n cosy this winter.
Does this mean that it'll be so warm during winter none of us will need to even consider turning our heaters on this winter? Just think of all the gas, oil, coal we can save, all the money we can save, all the atmosphere n planet we can save by not needing our heaters this winter coz the whole planet is so nice n toasty warm. Old fart might not even need the woolly long johns n fluffy slippers to keep all nice n cosy this winter.
I thought that until recently
but their builders are collapsing owing $trillions, they're conducting fire-sales of international assets (e.g. Tasmanian dairy), and they are seriously slowing up.
I know they play a long game, but its entirely possible they may have peaked a few decades too soon?
there is a pretty interesting and dynamic interview process going on for Boss of the World right now.
Yeah and this is exacerbated by coal power stations coming to end of life and also becoming uneconomical due to falling costs of renewables. Bridging tech like gas could help but soon it's risky for investors given the timelines.
Nuclear won't be built here for 20 years or more even if legalized and is becoming increasingly expensive.
How is my post a mess? What factors are incorrect?
So out of the entire article, You take the part that says ….Its impossible to open new mines and go on a rant about “conservative hacks”
What about the rest of the article? That was more enlightening than just about opening new (coal) mines.
Whats your take on that? You missed the objective of the article of course.
Even lefty activists don’t get everything right
On Cater, he is a conservative hack. I've explained why, using one particular aspect of his argument. I could write a tome and demolish him from every angle, but I don't have the time or the inclination, what would be the point? Its been done plenty of times. He's a hack shock jock masquerading as a research analyst.
Thats him, you can accept that or reject it, thats up to you, but lets put that aside.
On your post, look mate its nothing personal, Adani was and is a very complex case. Mining analysis is what I do for a living. A few of your points:
1) re ; "where there's a quid to be made", of course, no real argument, but its much more complicated than that, but yes, mining royalties drive our economy. Its a basic reality that a lot of inner city greenies just don't get, however well meaning. You can't just stop coal mining overnight, without major disruption to our economy. 5 or 15 year phase-out sure. But there are also legalities, as I said earlier, mines take years to get up, Adani was in the pipeline for 20 years, you can't just say no at the eleventh hour after hundreds of millions have been invested. This is a big problem going forward, when do we cut-off new coal? because it has to be done at least 10 years in advance, probably 15. If the ALP says 'no new coal mines' now, that means coal mines will stop being established in 10 or 15 years, and existing ones will keep producing, if demand is there, for another 20-50 years.
2) Re Politicians aversion to coal, Broadly, the ALP supported it. Some factions and individuals more than others, some very keen, some not so, but they all supported it. Adani was important because it was a real line in the sand, opening up a massive new coal mine, and the first of a proposed 5 mines, when the energy transition is very much on. It was a big balancing act and tough issue for the ALP, you might say they are hypocritical, and I can see that, but to me they were just managing the politics of an extremely difficult issue, but in part due to 1), they are all-but legally obligated to give the go ahead, but they know it goes against all the policies we need and have to address climate change. And thats basically what they did, they said we have to approve this mine, but we hope to see coal phased out.
You can say the pollies are all hypocrites and they just love the cash, and you're not wrong, but its much more complex than that.
Tigersnake, I would take issue with the notion that mining royalties drive our economy.
Just as a comparison, given you work in that industry, and I was until recently working in tertiary education.
The figures I found on mining royalties was $112 billion in the last decade according to a Minerals Council press release in Feb 2023, so around $11 billion per annum.
In comparison tertiary education collected $9.9 billion in overseas fees in 2019, slightly down in 2020 at $9.2 billion (COVID affected). Figures from Universities Australia, so, the tertiary education equivalent.
Mining gets a lot of attention for what it contributes, but other sectors don't get the attention they deserve.
DS
Just as a comparison, given you work in that industry, and I was until recently working in tertiary education.
The figures I found on mining royalties was $112 billion in the last decade according to a Minerals Council press release in Feb 2023, so around $11 billion per annum.
In comparison tertiary education collected $9.9 billion in overseas fees in 2019, slightly down in 2020 at $9.2 billion (COVID affected). Figures from Universities Australia, so, the tertiary education equivalent.
Mining gets a lot of attention for what it contributes, but other sectors don't get the attention they deserve.
DS
