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What to do about the conspiracy theory problem?
- Thread starter tigersnake
- Start date
Michaelia Cash makes me think there may be some truth to this aliens in positions of power thing.
watched "the Truth V Alex Jones"
Gripping documentary. In terms of the conspiracy theory its all standard stuff, plucking out illogical questionable apects of a case and being obsessed with it and refusing to accept and counter claims or arguments. For example, the CTs are obsessed with "why were there no emergency helicopters?". As one parent of a 6yo murdered child says, "because everybody was dead".
Alex Jones is an extremely disturbed person. Makes extreme false claims that have huge impacts and takes no responsibility for it. I know we are used to this post facts, Trump world, but the fact Trump appeared on Jones' show and endorsed him is staggering.
The power of the doco is in the effects that these disturbed people have on real innocent people. These poor people had to cope with children being murdered, then they have to cope with nutcases harrassing them and saying they are lying. These parents would be walking down a street and get recognised and abused by random strangers for lying, being paid actors. They put up with it for years, thinking it would go away, imagine? it didn't so they sued. Incredible film. Depressing, but compelling.
Gripping documentary. In terms of the conspiracy theory its all standard stuff, plucking out illogical questionable apects of a case and being obsessed with it and refusing to accept and counter claims or arguments. For example, the CTs are obsessed with "why were there no emergency helicopters?". As one parent of a 6yo murdered child says, "because everybody was dead".
Alex Jones is an extremely disturbed person. Makes extreme false claims that have huge impacts and takes no responsibility for it. I know we are used to this post facts, Trump world, but the fact Trump appeared on Jones' show and endorsed him is staggering.
The power of the doco is in the effects that these disturbed people have on real innocent people. These poor people had to cope with children being murdered, then they have to cope with nutcases harrassing them and saying they are lying. These parents would be walking down a street and get recognised and abused by random strangers for lying, being paid actors. They put up with it for years, thinking it would go away, imagine? it didn't so they sued. Incredible film. Depressing, but compelling.
my eldest was born in 1990 and at that time there was a movement questioning/raising the benefits/dangers of vaccination
that was before internet and social media so the movement has grown since then
the truth is there are deaths from vaccination , there are people who get severely affected and some of those permanently from vaccination
in recent years there was a Measels out break in Samoa and something like 70 deaths due to poor vaccination roll out in the country , the Health Minister was sacked
our immunisation program was developed by and ongoing supervision is done by ATAGI , in that link you can find the panel members
Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunisation (ATAGI)
The Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunisation (ATAGI) advises the Minister for Health and Aged Care on the National Immunisation Program (NIP) and other immunisation issues.
the vaccination schedule is here
National Immunisation Program schedule
This schedule card provides recommended vaccines and schedule points under the National Immunisation Program from 1 November 2023.
diseases like polio are basically gone in 1st world countries due to vaccination
deaths and serve reactions possibly due to vaccination are taken very seriously and are investigated by the Therapeutic Goods Administration TGA
and that information is shared with the World Health Organisation WHO
Both the ATAGI and WHO bodies are focused on saving as many lives as possible , hence they are very pro vaccination
the sad side is nothing is perfect and with vaccinations very small numbers can have bad even tragic outcomes
its a juggling act and these bodies have to play God , I'm comfortable that they use medical science in their decision making process
and constantly followup to make sure it is the best decision
Well, kind of. In Samoa in 2018 there was misadministration of a measles vax program and two children died - basically nurses prepared the MMR vax incorrectly.
This led to RFK Jr. and antivax crew campaigning heavily which led to vax hesitancy in Samoa in 2018 - when a real measles outbreak occured in 2019, 83 people died, around 70 of which were children under 4 years old.
2019 Samoa measles outbreak - Wikipedia
The different emphasis and omitted facts is a great little case study. "Around 70 deaths due to poor vax program" sounds like people died from the vax, when they actually died due to not being vaxed.Well, kind of. In Samoa in 2018 there was misadministration of a measles vax program and two children died - basically nurses prepared the MMR vax incorrectly.
This led to RFK Jr. and antivax crew campaigning heavily which led to vax hesitancy in Samoa in 2018 - when a real measles outbreak occured in 2019, 83 people died, around 70 of which were children under 4 years old.
2019 Samoa measles outbreak - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
I remember an invermectim tweet showing reduced death rates as the headline.
The context implied it was the Covid wonder drug.
The details showed reduced death rates in animals suffering from the parasitic infection that invermectim was designed for.
It’s like a chart showing a massive spike of <pick your item to mislead on>. The chart shows a straight line going up diagonally from left to right.
In small font The y axis starts at 10000 and ends at 10001
Sheeple. (can sheeple be singularised?)my eldest was born in 1990 and at that time there was a movement questioning/raising the benefits/dangers of vaccination
that was before internet and social media so the movement has grown since then
the truth is there are deaths from vaccination , there are people who get severely affected and some of those permanently from vaccination
in recent years there was a Measels out break in Samoa and something like 70 deaths due to poor vaccination roll out in the country , the Health Minister was sacked
our immunisation program was developed by and ongoing supervision is done by ATAGI , in that link you can find the panel members
Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunisation (ATAGI)
The Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunisation (ATAGI) advises the Minister for Health and Aged Care on the National Immunisation Program (NIP) and other immunisation issues.www.health.gov.au
the vaccination schedule is here
National Immunisation Program schedule
This schedule card provides recommended vaccines and schedule points under the National Immunisation Program from 1 November 2023.
diseases like polio are basically gone in 1st world countries due to vaccination
deaths and serve reactions possibly due to vaccination are taken very seriously and are investigated by the Therapeutic Goods Administration TGA
and that information is shared with the World Health Organisation WHO
Both the ATAGI and WHO bodies are focused on saving as many lives as possible , hence they are very pro vaccination
the sad side is nothing is perfect and with vaccinations very small numbers can have bad even tragic outcomes
its a juggling act and these bodies have to play God , I'm comfortable that they use medical science in their decision making process
and constantly followup to make sure it is the best decision
scratch the surface of any anti-vax info and it falls apart.
Sure a tiny minority has adverse reactions, but to stretch it to vax is harmful or evil is lunacy.
There was this guy in the goldfields in the 1850s, this is a true story, he wasn't very bright. He struck it rich, dug up a huge nugget. He was *smile*-a-hoop, over the moon, Bought some whiskey, got on his horse, with his huge nugget in one hand, bottle of whiskey in the other, and galloped through the diggings cheering and yelling, He hit his head on a tree branch and was killed instantly. Using anti-vax logic, the moral of the story is striking it rich will kill you,
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Or if it didn’t kill him, was the *smile* headache from the whiskey or the tree branch.
The real conspiracy is, who planted the tree? Why did the horse aim for that particular branch? If the government had mandated helmets for ecstatic whooping galloping gold miners, the branch may have just broken. Why weren’t they mandated? Who was head of the ecstatic whooping gallop goldminers department? Or was the huge nugget buried by someone else
Theres a lot to think about in that piece of history. Was it ever solved I wonder? A real mystery.
Thats a good point, I hadn't thought of that. Maybe the branch wasn't there the day before? You can't prove that it was.
i saw a video of this on FB. It is clearly a fake, perpetrated by the government of the day, after they murdered him and stole his gold. im not sure why they had to cover up the murder, surely the governor of the day had immunity for any crimes he (or she) committed?
Watched this last night. I'm not sure what can be done to stop pricks like Alex Jones without running the risk of a censorship law that would be easy to manipulate later on.
Social Media has a lot to answer for. It could be easy to write off the supporters of Jones and other conspiracy theorists like the anti-vax brigade and the 911 troofers as low IQ idiots, but that's not the reality. These conspiracies drag in people from all walks of life.
the root cause is the social media companies (in general) can't be sued for content that people using their platform post and the damage this causes
always the downside of capitalism is that it will ruthlessly exploit any externalities it can and the regulatory system to stop this is a 30-50 years behind (see tobacco industry)
this is the org behind "the social dilemma" on netflix that dealt with teenage suicde with facebook / insta / tik tok etc. and looking to drive change if interested
Solutions Overview - Center for Humane Technology
While addressing the harmful effects of the extractive tech ecosystem aren't easy, there are steps each of us can take to align tech with humanity's best interests. We've listed actions you can take as a citizen, student, parent, educator, leader, technologist, policymaker, investor...
www.humanetech.com
Yeah. Jones saw an opportunity and rode the wave. The more he doubled down on the crazy conspiracies, the more viewers, the more money.
I've read a lot of analysis of the conspiracy theory phenomenon. The how is all pretty clear, the why is less so. My theory is a lot of people just don't want to accept the reality of the world we live in, growing inequality, racism, sexism, ecological crisis. So they'll grasp any theory that refutes that reality. Easy for idiots, requires willful, dogged maintenance of a huge blindspot if you aren't (or that could be just another flavour of idiot).
There was a classic moment in Truth V AJ, when the chief Sandy Hook CT "investigator" said he was positive it never happened, and then he says "if I'm wrong, I should be in a mental institution". Ummm...
My grandfather grew up in the Bendigo goldfields , didn’t hear that story , one that did tickle my fancy , some of the Chinese that didn’t strike it rich turned doing market gardens , in the irrigation channels and dams would appear yabbies , the Chinese didn’t eat them . My grandfather said he was polite to the Chinese unlike other kids and was allowed to catch the yabbies and his mother was very happy as it was food for the table when his father wasn’t getting any money
The worst people in the anti-vax movement are the exploiters. Many of these people don’t necessarily believe in the cause. They just take advantage of the gullible people that do.
Avi and Monica are the main 2 in Australia. Avi threatens to sue, asks people to donate to his legal action, then quietly drops it at a later date. Monica uses donation money to gallivant around the world and claim she is doing “research.” But at least Monica is facing charges for her grifting.
Then you have Ralph Babet, who claims to be the spokesman in parliament for the anti-vax movement… But what he won’t admit to is that he is fully vaccinated. He’s a lame duck politician who is trying to create controversy to gain relevance.
Even the Murdoch Media buys into all the conspiracy stuff. The Herald Sun especially have a fascination with Dan and the steps and the bike accident. Why? Because the only people that believe these stories are gullible enough to provide them with the clickbait. They have lowered themselves to profiting off the stupid.
As for Alex Jones, Tucker Carlson, et all, I’m sorry, but people shouldn’t be watching any of their content. Tucker Carlson is coming to Australia and charging $200+ per head to spread his bulldust. The government should grow some balls and cancel his visa.
I go for a walk in my area most days. One of the routes I take, I pass by a “For Sale” board in front of a house with this snake oil salesmans face plastered on it. He looks like a sleazy used car salesman.
Driving today, on the radio the question was asked, why is he so popular. People rang in saying he tells the truth, he’s an honest journalist, presents the real news that other news outlets won’t etc. I felt like ringing in to point out that even his own employer at the time (Foxnews), said in court that what he says should be taken with a grain of salt, that he wasn’t a reporter and just gave his opinion not fact. But I thought I’m just wasting my time , like all the maga adherents, you won’t change their minds
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