2014 Hindsight Draft

[bullus_hit]

Having just gone over the 2008 draft I have to say it might just take the record for the best draft of the decade, certainly at least for games played.

- Out of the first 44 players drafted 23 have played 100 games.
- Of the remaining 21 players, 10 have passed the 50 game milestone
- By the conclusion of the 2016 season the number of centurians will likely be 27 out of the first 44.
- From picks 45-Rookie there have been twenty two 50 gamers
- The rookie draft and preseason draft has produced 11 centurians.

The Steals of the Century

Pick 29 - Dane Beams (126 games)
Pick 30 - Dan Hannebury (148 games)
Pick 44 - Rory Sloane (122 games)
Pick 5 PSD - Tom Rockliff (119 games)
Pick 76 Rookie - Sam Jacobs (131 games)

Who nailed the draft?

Carlton drafted four centurians but staggeringly traded them all out. Most have gone onto career best form.

Pick 6 - Chris Yaran (119 games)
Pick 40 - Mitch Robinson (124 games)
Pick 6 Rookie - Jeff Garlett (131 games)
Pick 76 Rookie - Sam Jacobs (131 games)

Fremantle have produced close to the perfect draft, in a couple of years they will likely have drafted 8 centurians. From my recollection no team has come close to this number and I doubt we'll ever see this occur again.

Pick 3 - Stephen Hill (155 games)
Pick 21 - Haydn Ballantyne (125 games)
Pick 24 - Nick Suban (133 games)
Pick 37 - Zach Clarke (89 games)
Pick 53 - Michael Walters (76 games)
Pick 19 Rookie - Matt De Boer (135 games)
Pick 48 Rookie - Clancee Pearce (98 games)
Pick 74 Rookie - Greg Broughtan (110 games)

Richmond's Draft

Pretty woeful if we're being honest, Fremantle built a grand final team on the back of one draft, FJ had a golden opportunity but blew it, particularly the Post pick which was as left field as they come. Athletically Post was below average, he also was an overage kid who didn't play state football. We also traded pick 42 for Adam Thomson.

Pick 8 - Tyrone Vickery (106)
Pick 26 - Jayden Post (30)
Pick 58 - Tom Hislop (20)
Pick 6 PSD - Ben Cousins (32)
Pick 8 Rookie - Robin Nahas (109)
Pick 24 Rookie - David Gourdis (4)
Pick 39 Rookie - Andre Browne (12)
Pick 53 Rookie - Alroy Gilligan (0)

 

[tigertim]

Richmond's Draft

Pretty woeful if we're being honest, Fremantle built a grand final team on the back of one draft, FJ had a golden opportunity but blew it, particularly the Post pick which was as left field as they come. Athletically Post was below average, he also was an overage kid who didn't play state football. We also traded pick 42 for Adam Thomson.

Pick 8 - Tyrone Vickery (106)
Pick 26 - Jayden Post (30)
Pick 58 - Tom Hislop (20)
Pick 6 PSD - Ben Cousins (32)
Pick 8 Rookie - Robin Nahas (109)
Pick 24 Rookie - David Gourdis (4)
Pick 39 Rookie - Andre Browne (12)
Pick 53 Rookie - Alroy Gilligan (0)

Yep, that's why I ranked this draft a 2/8 ( the 2 being Ty and Robin). Even then rating them a "success" is over stating it a bit....

 

[Scoop]

Having just gone over the 2008 draft I have to say it might just take the record for the best draft of the decade, certainly at least for games played.

- Out of the first 44 players drafted 23 have played 100 games.
- Of the remaining 21 players, 10 have passed the 50 game milestone
- By the conclusion of the 2016 season the number of centurians will likely be 27 out of the first 44.
- From picks 45-Rookie there have been twenty two 50 gamers
- The rookie draft and preseason draft has produced 11 centurians.

The Steals of the Century

Pick 29 - Dane Beams (126 games)
Pick 30 - Dan Hannebury (148 games)
Pick 44 - Rory Sloane (122 games)
Pick 5 PSD - Tom Rockliff (119 games)
Pick 76 Rookie - Sam Jacobs (131 games)

Who nailed the draft?

Carlton drafted four centurians but staggeringly traded them all out. Most have gone onto career best form.

Pick 6 - Chris Yaran (119 games)
Pick 40 - Mitch Robinson (124 games)
Pick 6 Rookie - Jeff Garlett (131 games)
Pick 76 Rookie - Sam Jacobs (131 games)

Fremantle have produced close to the perfect draft, in a couple of years they will likely have drafted 8 centurians. From my recollection no team has come close to this number and I doubt we'll ever see this occur again.

Pick 3 - Stephen Hill (155 games)
Pick 21 - Haydn Ballantyne (125 games)
Pick 24 - Nick Suban (133 games)
Pick 37 - Zach Clarke (89 games)
Pick 53 - Michael Walters (76 games)
Pick 19 Rookie - Matt De Boer (135 games)
Pick 48 Rookie - Clancee Pearce (98 games)
Pick 74 Rookie - Greg Broughtan (110 games)

Richmond's Draft

Pretty woeful if we're being honest, Fremantle built a grand final team on the back of one draft, FJ had a golden opportunity but blew it, particularly the Post pick which was as left field as they come. Athletically Post was below average, he also was an overage kid who didn't play state football. We also traded pick 42 for Adam Thomson.

Pick 8 - Tyrone Vickery (106)
Pick 26 - Jayden Post (30)
Pick 58 - Tom Hislop (20)
Pick 6 PSD - Ben Cousins (32)
Pick 8 Rookie - Robin Nahas (109)
Pick 24 Rookie - David Gourdis (4)
Pick 39 Rookie - Andre Browne (12)
Pick 53 Rookie - Alroy Gilligan (0)

Good work Bully. That's such a mess.

The real questions it raises are

1) How did we judge that draft internally? With the minimal amount of picks we took it would indicate that we thought it was weak but it has turned out to be historically strong. I know I wanted Ziebell at 8 but for the life of me I can't remember who I wanted at the Post pick and I can't find any postings to point me one way or the other.

2) Why did we take a Jayden Post ahead of the glut of quality midfielders when that was a issue? What information lead us to believe that Jayden Post was the best selection.

3) How did we have Andrew Browne ahead of Sam Jacobs? We will miss them and that's drafting but let's at least look at why. We wanted a ruck, what metric pointed us towards Browne and not Jacobs.

It's ok to have a poor draft every now and then, it happens. But at least look at it and learn.

 

[tigerdave]

Having just gone over the 2008 draft I have to say it might just take the record for the best draft of the decade, certainly at least for games played.

- Out of the first 44 players drafted 23 have played 100 games.
- Of the remaining 21 players, 10 have passed the 50 game milestone
- By the conclusion of the 2016 season the number of centurians will likely be 27 out of the first 44.
- From picks 45-Rookie there have been twenty two 50 gamers
- The rookie draft and preseason draft has produced 11 centurians.

The Steals of the Century

Pick 29 - Dane Beams (126 games)
Pick 30 - Dan Hannebury (148 games)
Pick 44 - Rory Sloane (122 games)
Pick 5 PSD - Tom Rockliff (119 games)
Pick 76 Rookie - Sam Jacobs (131 games)

Who nailed the draft?

Carlton drafted four centurians but staggeringly traded them all out. Most have gone onto career best form.

Pick 6 - Chris Yaran (119 games)
Pick 40 - Mitch Robinson (124 games)
Pick 6 Rookie - Jeff Garlett (131 games)
Pick 76 Rookie - Sam Jacobs (131 games)

Fremantle have produced close to the perfect draft, in a couple of years they will likely have drafted 8 centurians. From my recollection no team has come close to this number and I doubt we'll ever see this occur again.

Pick 3 - Stephen Hill (155 games)
Pick 21 - Haydn Ballantyne (125 games)
Pick 24 - Nick Suban (133 games)
Pick 37 - Zach Clarke (89 games)
Pick 53 - Michael Walters (76 games)
Pick 19 Rookie - Matt De Boer (135 games)
Pick 48 Rookie - Clancee Pearce (98 games)
Pick 74 Rookie - Greg Broughtan (110 games)

Richmond's Draft

Pretty woeful if we're being honest, Fremantle built a grand final team on the back of one draft, FJ had a golden opportunity but blew it, particularly the Post pick which was as left field as they come. Athletically Post was below average, he also was an overage kid who didn't play state football. We also traded pick 42 for Adam Thomson.

Pick 8 - Tyrone Vickery (106)
Pick 26 - Jayden Post (30)
Pick 58 - Tom Hislop (20)
Pick 6 PSD - Ben Cousins (32)
Pick 8 Rookie - Robin Nahas (109)
Pick 24 Rookie - David Gourdis (4)
Pick 39 Rookie - Andre Browne (12)
Pick 53 Rookie - Alroy Gilligan (0)

Good work bullie!

That's deplorable on our behalf!

 

[Baloo]

Good work Bully. That's such a mess.

The real questions it raises are
3) How did we have Andrew Browne ahead of Sam Jacobs? We will miss them and that's drafting but let's at least look at why. We wanted a ruck, what metric pointed us towards Browne and not Jacobs.

Bad Bad Andrew Bowne was a ranga. We have a Ranga quota at the club. Part of our social service work

 

[tigertim]

Good work Bully. That's such a mess.

The real questions it raises are

1) How did we judge that draft internally? With the minimal amount of picks we took it would indicate that we thought it was weak but it has turned out to be historically strong. I know I wanted Ziebell at 8 but for the life of me I can't remember who I wanted at the Post pick and I can't find any postings to point me one way or the other.

2) Why did we take a Jayden Post ahead of the glut of quality midfielders when that was a issue? What information lead us to believe that Jayden Post was the best selection.

3) How did we have Andrew Browne ahead of Sam Jacobs? We will miss them and that's drafting but let's at least look at why. We wanted a ruck, what metric pointed us towards Browne and not Jacobs.

It's ok to have a poor draft every now and then, it happens. But at least look at it and learn.

I'm not sure what our criteria is for picking rucks but when I look at this list: Hampson, Browne, Derrickx, Graham, Cartledge there seems to be 1 outstanding common denominator......

 

[Rancey18]

Good stuff Bully and SCOOP, really enjoying your work :clap

 

[bullus_hit]

In light of the Yarran discussions I think the draft selections for 2015 need to factor in this decision and despite acknowledging Yarran as a good footballer I'm revoking the decision for my own side for a number of reasons. Firstly, Adam Saad was selected for that very role and finished 4th in GC's B&F, I also recruited Hibberd as a potential rebounding defender so I just don't feel this is an area of need. Secondly, my defence is threadbare at the moment and not having a player like Grimes on the list puts the team in a vulnerable position. Not that I was against the Grimes pick but I didn't have him in the frame until he was selected to train with the club, full credit to Jackson on both the player and process. Thirdly, the draft next year will be laden with quality onballers and I don't feel it's in the interests of the squad to miss out on this opportunity.

So with the lost pick I select Marcus Adams, a player I earmarked for the Doggies in the real draft, having a guy who can play on both talls & smalls is critical in this modern age, particularly quick ones like Adams. Here's a rehash of the draft discussions.

Same height, same ability to read the play, same sort of build, the big difference is one is lightening quick and the other very slow. This is the kicker with me, Collins has the turning circle of Mac truck and Adams has just recorded a repeat sprint of 24.85, his leap is also superior with a vertical jump of 76cm - by far the better athlete. His form in the WAFL has also been huge, BOG in a final, 4th in the B&F as a defender, can play forward when need be. If the Doggies land Adams they have played this super smart in my opinion, will slot in nicely down at the kennel.

Adams didn't play early in his career due to a bout of OP, he's a fresh face as far as the state leagues are concerned, the fact he can play forward is also a bonus.

So Scoop, I know you weren't a fan of the Yarran trade so feel free to reinstate pick 31 when you update your team, I know you liked Bonner who is another rebounding defender so there's sound rationale behind keeping the picks.

 

[spook]

How good's my boy Lever. Gun.

 

[bullus_hit]

How good's my boy Lever. Gun.

Yep, he was my second preference behind Weller, given I have Frost sitting there as my full back Lever would be a massive upgrade. I guess this goes to show that it pays to fill the spine out with top 20 picks. Riewoldt, Darling, Parker, Rance & Lever would have been a top shelf nucleus.

Another observation from tonight's game was the continued growth of Rory Atkins, pick 81 in the draft as well. What did we with our 5th rounder? We invested in Aaron Edwards, a washed up player who contributed a paltry 12 games to the club. Disgraceful recruiting yet so typical of the past 30 years.

 

[bullus_hit]

Here were my thoughts on Lever pre-draft.

Lever is another dark horse, being injured this year hasn't dampened his stocks and he could well turn out to be the best tall out of the entire draft class.

And I actually had him ranked very highly in September, maybe I was sidetracked by our desperate need for pace, in fact that is the truth of the matter. In any case, I'm happy enough with Weller but will look at addressing full back with the next batch.

1. Petracca
2. McCartin
3. Brayshaw
4. Heeney
5. Lever
6. Wright
7. Durdin
8. Moore
9. Laverde
10. Pickett
11. Ahern
12. Weller
13. Goddard
14. Marchbank
15. Duggan


Smokies - Kyle Langford (has the skill set of Bonti so maybe clubs will sit up and take notice)
Peter Bampton (these are the types that make for excellent 2nd rounders, hard and tough inside ball winner in the Parker mould)
Connor Blakely (another in the Parker mould, again if we can nab one with a second rounder then it will make for an excellent draft)
Connor Menadue (silky smooth outside runner who could go as high as top 15, still very light though and hopefully drifts into the second round)

 

[bullus_hit]

The last two games for Darcy Byrne-Jones have been exceedingly impressive, backed up his 21 touches with another 26 possessions this week. Frank picked up Gordon with this pick, yet another recycled bomb.

Since 2006 this is Frank's recycled resume -

Kent Kingsley - 3 games
Clayton Collard - 0 games
Tristan Cartledge - 2 games
Cameron Howat - 1 game
Tom Hislop - 20 games
Brad Miller - 24 games
Ben Cousins - 32 games
Graham Polak - 3 games
Addam Maric - 10 games
Ricky Petterd - 30 games
Sam Lonergan - 2 games
Orren Stephenson - 7 games
Todd Banfield - 0 games
Anthony Miles - 39 games
Matt Thomas - 15 games
Nathan Gordon - 21 games

Note - This doesn't include Gourdis & Arnot who were re-rookied after being on the main list. Trades for recycled players do not feature and Houli isn't on the list given he was Blair's target and was heavily discussed during trade week.

By my reckoning there has been only one quality pick, Anthony Miles, a player who literally came knocking on our door asking for another opportunity. Choco can take most of the credit for this one and kudos to Miles' manager for being persistent.

But overall the list is a stark reminder of the club's negligent list management, 16 picks and only 2 still remaining, although I suspect Moore won't be adding to his games tally anytime soon. The fact that many of these players only managed to hit single figures is also damning, one would think with the benefit of AFL exposure, a more accurate picture could be formed. This has and will continue to be Richmond's undoing, for 3 decades the club has attempted to turn around ailing careers, we never seem to accept that you can't polish a *smile*.

 

[tigertim]

The last two games for Darcy Byrne-Jones have been exceedingly impressive, backed up his 21 touches with another 26 possessions this week. Frank picked up Gordon with this pick, yet another recycled bomb.

Since 2006 this is Frank's recycled resume -

Kent Kingsley - 3 games
Clayton Collard - 0 games
Tristan Cartledge - 2 games
Cameron Howat - 1 game
Tom Hislop - 20 games
Ben Cousins - 32 games
Graham Polak - 3 games
Addam Maric - 10 games
Ricky Petterd - 30 games
Orren Stephenson - 7 games
Todd Banfield - 0 games
Anthony Miles - 39 games
Matt Thomas - 15 games
Nathan Gordon - 21 games
Andrew Moore - 1 game

Note - This doesn't include Gourdis & Arnot who were re-rookied after being on the main list. Trades for recycled players do not feature and Houli isn't on the list given he was Blair's target and was heavily discussed during trade week.

By my reckoning there has been only one quality pick, Anthony Miles, a player who literally came knocking on our door asking for another opportunity. Choco can take most of the credit for this one and kudos to Miles' manager for being persistent.

But overall the list is a stark reminder of the club's negligent list management, 15 picks and only 2 still remaining, although I suspect Moore won't be adding to his games tally anytime soon. The fact that many of these players only managed to hit single figures is also damning, one would think with the benefit of AFL exposure, a more accurate picture could be formed. This has and will continue to be Richmond's undoing, for 3 decades the club has attempted to turn around ailing careers, we never seem to accept that you can't polish a *smile*.

Excluding the outlier (Miles) the others ave 10 games each. I guess the stats show it's a failed policy. I know the stats will also show kids drafted at the end of the draft probably fail too but I'd prefer to give a kid a go rather than a recycled AFL player. But with our serial underdevelopment of our kids they'd be doomed to failure too.

 

[bullus_hit]

It get's even worse when you include trades like Thomson, Farmer & Edwards who contributed 4, 28 & 12 games respectively.

Working on the presumption that there's a 33% chance of nailing a late pick, we have effectively robbed ourselves of 5 core footballers. Jackson can lament decisions like the McMahon fiasco but he's largely been the architect of his own demise.

 

[Scoop]

It get's even worse when you include trades like Thomson, Farmer & Edwards who contributed 4, 28 & 12 games respectively.

Working on the presumption that there's a 33% chance of nailing a late pick, we have effectively robbed ourselves of 5 core footballers. Jackson can lament decisions like the McMahon fiasco but he's largely been the architect of his own demise.

This is beyond dispute. And the crazy thing Bully is that these late picks & rookie picks are almost guilt free if taken on untried kids.

Would you or I be furious if Chol or Cal Moore don't make it? I suspect not because the process is sound.

 

[bullus_hit]

The other aspect of our flawed philosophy has been the frequent selections of unproven non- athletes. I don't need to remind many people of this guy.



Others who arrived at the club without the required athleticism were Dean McDonald, Andrew Browne & Ben Jakobi. The club has generally been of the opinion it can get these guys up to scratch but it just adds another element of uncertainty, particularly when they have had limited exposure to top line football. The best recruiters don't leave this aspect to chance, if a player is unproven at state level then they must have the required athleticism to become an AFL footballer, two unknowns is a recipe for disaster.

 

[thegdog]

Has the mature-age experiment stunted Richmond's growth?
Nathan Schmook
April 24, 2016 10:00 AM

AFL 2016 Rd 03 - Richmond v Adelaide
Ben Lennon was dropped by Damien Hardwick this week
WHEN Richmond coach Damien Hardwick went on radio two weeks ago to explain his "half-step back" strategy, Ben Lennon and Corey Ellis were two players he said the club needed to stick with at selection.

"We'll continue to invest in those two boys … they're probably the little half-step back that we take," he said.

They were three little words that were analysed to their core, but the coach's reasoning made sense. He had invested in a lot of mature-age talent and the time had come to back in youth.

The question now being asked is why, two weeks on, is Lennon out of the team? And has an aggressive mature-age strategy stunted the growth of the Tigers' draftees?

Questioning draft selections in hindsight can be like shooting fish in a barrel, but the Tigers' strategy to use free agency and mature-age recruiting the way they have deserves scrutiny after their 1-3 start to the season.

Dating back to the end of 2012, the club's last exchange period before their first finals series under Hardwick, Richmond has recruited the following:

• Eight players via trade and free agency (aged 22-29)
• Three mature-age draftees (aged 22-24)
• Eight mature-age rookies (aged 23-30)

That's a total of 19 mature-age players – eight of whom have since retired or been delisted – who have collectively played 288 games for the club since round one, 2013.

In the same period they have gone to the NAB AFL Draft and recruited 12 players (excluding mature-age selections).

That dozen, which includes prized picks Lennon and Ellis, has combined for 145 games – half the output of the ready-made players the club has brought in.

It's a strategy that has helped get Richmond to three straight finals series, but recycled talent hasn't helped the club take the next step.

Recycled players who have come and gone in the past three seasons include Aaron Edwards, Nathan Gordon, Ricky Petterd, Matt Thomas, Sam Lonergan and Todd Banfield.

Aaron Edwards managed just 12 games in his two years at Richmond. Picture: AFL Media


Former Adelaide half-forward Chris Knights stands aside as a player Richmond brought in who could have been a success if not for repeated knee, quad and hamstring injuries.

The only recycled players from 2013-2015 selected in Richmond's round five squad to face Melbourne are Troy Chaplin and Sam Lloyd.

There has clearly been a shift in the Tigers' selection in recent weeks and – Lennon's omission aside – fast-tracking talented young players seems to be a priority.

"Ellis played his best game for the club last week and in (Connor) Menadue we've found a player," Hardwick said this week.

"Kamdyn McIntosh down back has been a revelation and Daniel Rioli is an excitement machine.

"We've got some really exciting talent in the side."

All would stay in the team, Hardwick said, as long as their "form continues to press their credibility".

Hardwick can't pick players who aren't ready, and injury has played a big role in keeping draftees like Nathan Drummond out of the team.

Likewise, if tall forward Liam McBean hasn't done enough to knock down the door at selection then there is no requirement on the match committee to select him.

But the numbers don't lie and the Tigers have clearly invested more game time in their mature-age picks than their talented teenagers.

Had it been the other way around they might not have three consecutive elimination finals to their name, but they may find themselves in a better position four rounds into this season.

FREE AGENT/TRADE GAMES POSSIBLE GAMES
Troy Chaplin 69 71
Aaron Edwards* 12 46
Shaun Hampson 19 50
Taylor Hunt 25 27
Chris Knights* 6 69
Andrew Moore 1 4
Jacob Townsend 2 4
Chris Yarran 0 4
MATURE DRAFT GAMES POSSIBLE GAMES
Sam Lloyd 23 50
Nathan Gordon* 21 46
Nathan Broad 0 4
MATURE ROOKIES GAMES POSSIBLE GAMES
Sam Lonergan* 2 23
Ricky Petterd* 30 69
Orren Stephenson* 7 46
Todd Banfield* 0 23
Anthony Miles 39 50
Kane Lambert 17 27
Matt Thomas* 15 46
Adam Marcon 0 4
* No longer at the club

 

[toby64]

Been some good posting bullus

 

[Dev Tiger]

Some very good posting Bullus. I have enjoyed reading your insights. Well done on your drafting as well. We would be a stronger team if you had been in charge of the recruiting department.

 

[mtench]

The other aspect of our flawed philosophy has been the frequent selections of unproven non- athletes. I don't need to remind many people of this guy.

Legend