Talking Politics | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Talking Politics

It mightn't be a "Landslide" to the ALP but it certainly is a "Landslide" away from the Libs.

If they want to remain relevant they'll need to change their mindset on many of their policies, especially their environmental & fiscal policies.

They're currently too beholden to the coal & fossil fuel industries.

Agree on this. Its a clear landslide away from the coalition, but not really for the ALP.

Agree also on the Libs. If they continue to campaign with the view that climate change doesn't exist / doesn't affect them, then they will be dumped in the political scrapheap for decades.
 
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Although it's a self fulfilling loop. The more stuff we consume, the more energy intensive our lifestyle and then the motivation for extraction of materials to create that energy (fossil fuels or otherwise). Super and investments I do take that into account Angry, absolutely. Although I must tell you it was an interesting process finding a 'green' option that didn't package up a whole host of unrelated social agenda I was skeptical of.

And which is the preferable option? Keeping your 10YO car (that you bought as a 5YO used car) until it dies in another 10 years (as in, consuming astronomically less materials and energy in the manufacturing process). Or buying into the consumerist mindset that I must buy a brand new electric car so I can be seen, along with that nice new car smell. I look at Universities too, moving out of perfectly good buildings that have plenty of life left in them. The redevelopment funded by 'green bonds'. The new ones have more 'green credentials' sure. But is it really that green demolishing buildings that still have decades more life left in them, in order to consume a whole lot more resources and carbon emissions in the process of creating those resources? I’m aware that new architectural and engineering techniques are building into the lifecycle of a building that it will one day will be demolished, so they maximise how much of the building’s materials can be reused. Which I am a huge supporter of. I think that is great. But I dunno, it just feels so inherently wrong to me demolishing stuff that still has life in it. I think it’s in my frugal DNA that the throw away disposability mindset just feels so wrong from every angle.

I don't have all the answers, but I sometimes think the green movement has lurched into being a form of consumerism itself in a cruel twist of irony.

Good on you PT - I'm with an "ethical" Super fund- returns are lower than some others but you have choice about what your money goes to.

My car is 17 years old but its a Subaru but keeps on keeping on. My motorbike is nearly the same age. Both gas of course - I'd go electric if I ever bought anything new. Buying new sh1t all the time definitely doesn't help.

On buildings and other infrastructure/capex you do have to consider the total cost/environmental cost of lifecycle including lifespan/decommissioning costs both financial and environment. As a society we don't think about that enough.
 
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In fact, Labor might be forced kicking and screaming to do much more. Dr Monique Ryan was on TV yesterday saying she will push Labor to change their 2030 reduction targets from 43% to 60%.

As for the Liberals, I honestly do not see them changing in the short term. There will be no self-reflection because they probably think they can win in 2025. I can see them shifting further to the right with many of their so-called moderates gone. I hope I am wrong though.

I hope they do. Their target of 43% still isn't big enough. The ALP need to link in with those billionaires willing to put their money where their mouths are regarding the environment. People like Mike Cannon-Brookes and Andrew Forrest. The first place they can start is making a big statement around the AGL demerger, the quickest way to dump the demerger is to show that the AGL's board with the coal mines is a joke and they won't be allowed to remain open as long as the demerger plans.
 
Post election has been pretty funny.

The Libs and far right got smashed so the Sky right wing nut-jobs (Sky has suddenly become watchable) suggest they need to push further right. The Sky hosts keep decrying the bed-wetters of the electorate but it is hard to find a group of people more prone to bed-wetting than that lot.

It doesn't matter that it is not a landslide to the ALP if that is how people want to frame it. But is was a landslide against the LNP and we are a two party country.

My biggest hope is that the religion creep into politics suffers a big reversal. The LNP should be questioning their god now after this disastrous result.
 
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My car is 17 years old but its a Subaru but keeps on keeping on. My motorbike is nearly the same age. Both gas of course - I'd go electric if I ever bought anything new. Buying new sh1t all the time definitely doesn't help.
My Toyota is 19 years old and still going strong. Japanese cars are the best.
 
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Post election has been pretty funny.

The Libs and far right got smashed so the Sky right wing nut-jobs (Sky has suddenly become watchable) suggest they need to push further right. The Sky hosts keep decrying the bed-wetters of the electorate but it is hard to find a group of people more prone to bed-wetting than that lot.

It doesn't matter that it is not a landslide to the ALP if that is how people want to frame it. But is was a landslide against the LNP and we are a two party country.

My biggest hope is that the religion creep into politics suffers a big reversal. The LNP should be questioning their god now after this disastrous result.
Did you see Rowan Dean's 'bedwetting' melt on Outsiders yesterday morning? :mhihi
 
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The Libs and far right got smashed so the Sky right wing nut-jobs (Sky has suddenly become watchable) suggest they need to push further right. The Sky hosts keep decrying the bed-wetters of the electorate but it is hard to find a group of people more prone to bed-wetting than that lot.
I don't watch those Sky morons but have read a bit of what you are referring to. A lurch to the right hey? It wasn't One Nation and UAP that was winning traditional LNP inner city seats; it was the Teals and Labor. So moving further to the right will bring those voters back?

FFS could they be any more stupid??
 
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Monique Ryan can say whatever she wants but the fact is that if the ALP win lower house majority she will have little influence on ALP climate change policy. The ALP will need to worry about the Senate cross bench; that is where the road blocks will be.

do we know what the final senate numbers are looking like? I'm reading Labor and the Greens will win extra seats and Hanson is out. That progressive former Rugby player is in. But i do not know what the exact numbers are. Will the Greens hold balance of power? If the answer is yes, then they might be forced into higher reduction targets.
 
do we know what the final senate numbers are looking like? I'm reading Labor and the Greens will win extra seats and Hanson is out. That progressive former Rugby player is in. But i do not know what the exact numbers are. Will the Greens hold balance of power? If the answer is yes, then they might be forced into higher reduction targets.
Not sure Bin but yes Greens may well hold the balance of power. Latest results on ABC have Coalition with 30 seats, ALP 25, Greens 12 and who knows what else. Need 39 for absolute majority vote so as it stands Greens don't hold BoP. Who knows, the ALP may try and get the Coalition to support the 43% target. As its stands they are probably closer to the ALPs target than the Greens. It appears nine seats are in doubt so it appears the ALP will need to negotiate with Coalition or Greens plus others to get stuff done in the Senate. The Senate is a crap shoot these days.

Regardless, if ALP wins lower house majority Monique Ryan has no say in ALP climate change policy.
 
Not sure Bin but yes Greens may well hold the balance of power. Latest results on ABC have Coalition with 30 seats, ALP 25, Greens 12 and who knows what else. Need 39 for absolute majority vote so as it stands Greens don't hold BoP. Who knows, the ALP may try and get the Coalition to support the 43% target. As its stands they are probably closer to the ALPs target than the Greens. It appears nine seats are in doubt so it appears the ALP will need to negotiate with Coalition or Greens plus others to get stuff done in the Senate. The Senate is a crap shoot these days.

Regardless, if ALP wins lower house majority Monique Ryan has no say in ALP climate change policy.

Still 6 seats to be decided to go into those numbers, so potential that those seats go to ALP or Greens for example, and take their combined total to upto 43 which would lead the greens to have the bop.
 
Here's a good breakdown of the "Swing away from ALP" numbers, and it does show that there was a strategic vote to get the Lib incumbent out.

Primary ALP swing in 151 electorates = -0.6% so far.
In 15 seats with new credible IND v LIB contests, ALP swing = -5.8%.
In the other 136 seats without, ALP swing = +0.8%. (exclude Fowler and it becomes +0.22%).


 
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Still 6 seats to be decided to go into those numbers, so potential that those seats go to ALP or Greens for example, and take their combined total to upto 43 which would lead the greens to have the bop.
I'm not up to date with the in doubt Senate spots but Antony Green late on Saturday night said he didn't think the Coaltion or ALP would improve on what they already had. Can't recall what he said about the Greens. They would need to win 2 of the 6 in doubt spots to hold BoP.
 
Not sure Bin but yes Greens may well hold the balance of power. Latest results on ABC have Coalition with 30 seats, ALP 25, Greens 12 and who knows what else. Need 39 for absolute majority vote so as it stands Greens don't hold BoP. Who knows, the ALP may try and get the Coalition to support the 43% target. As its stands they are probably closer to the ALPs target than the Greens. It appears nine seats are in doubt so it appears the ALP will need to negotiate with Coalition or Greens plus others to get stuff done in the Senate. The Senate is a crap shoot these days.

Regardless, if ALP wins lower house majority Monique Ryan has no say in ALP climate change policy.
Albo is a master of working across the aisle. He will (or should) give the Independents a share in ownership of legislation so they can show their electorates they have done what they were elected for, and the Libs remain shut out.
 
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do we know what the final senate numbers are looking like? I'm reading Labor and the Greens will win extra seats and Hanson is out. That progressive former Rugby player is in. But i do not know what the exact numbers are. Will the Greens hold balance of power? If the answer is yes, then they might be forced into higher reduction targets.

Unfortunately Hanson will probably get in on the last senate seat in QLD. Pocock looking good in ACT. One Nation might get another seat in one of the other states, and UAP might get one.



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Albo is a master of working across the aisle. He will (or should) give the Independents a share in ownership of legislation so they can show their electorates they have done what they were elected for, and the Libs remain shut out.

Yeah, that would need to be the 3 year strategy here. Give the independents enough input so that they can be re-elected next time around, keeping the LNUAPPHON party on the backbenches
 
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Albo is a master of working across the aisle. He will (or should) give the Independents a share in ownership of legislation so they can show their electorates they have done what they were elected for, and the Libs remain shut out.
Yep, i really hope that happens (and I think Albo is smart enough to ensure that it does happen).
 
Albo is a master of working across the aisle. He will (or should) give the Independents a share in ownership of legislation so they can show their electorates they have done what they were elected for, and the Libs remain shut out.
Dunno about that. He has stated on numerous occasions that he has gone to the electorate with a 43% emission reduction target by 2030 (Coalition was 28%). The teals and the greens want 50% or more; some have stated 60%.

Elbow appears very firm on his 43% commitment. He appears very firm on implementing his policies as he has presented them throughout the campaign. Will be interesting to see where it ends up.
 
I'm not up to date with the in doubt Senate spots but Antony Green late on Saturday night said he didn't think the Coaltion or ALP would improve on what they already had. Can't recall what he said about the Greens. They would need to win 2 of the 6 in doubt spots to hold BoP.

Looking on the ABC at the in doubt seats you could be right. Looks like ALP are only ahead in 1 of them, possibly 2 One Nation, 1 UAP and a couple of Libs I think, so potentially will struggle to get too much through without buy in from the Libs or god forbid One Nation / UAP or Jacqui Lambie.