I supported the Gibcus selection & still believe it was the correct call, part of that assessment was the likelihood of him transitioning to the forward line, I think the flame still flickers, it may even be necessity in the coming years.
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2022 Draft Thread
- Thread starter Scoop
- Start date
My reservations with Van Rooyen still stand, he seems to have heavy legs, this is both evident with his kicking depth and ability to get airborne. You can get away with this at VFL level but I'm not so sure he'll have the same impact at AFL level. My conclusion after seeing all of Van Rooyen's goals at VFL level is that he's probably got a Tim Membrey type ability, 40 goal forward probably the ceiling, I don't think he ever wins a Coleman.
Thats a very high pass mark
I was a fan of JVR and still think list wise he would have been the better choice and post jack a 40 goal foward would have been fine and our list structure would have been better. Hoping Brown lives upto expectations and we all get proven wrong
im still taking Gibcus where we did though
It's more a comment about opportunity cost, we lost a 40 goal forward in Mabs, I don't detect a huge amount of seller's remorse in that particular instance. I also think if we lose a triple Coleman medalist the aim should be to get a replacement. Finding a 60 goal sharp shooter will be infinitely harder than finding a 40 goal player, not picking Van Rooyen won't come back to bite as I believe the open market will offer up similarly talented forwards. The challenge will be to find a 3 goal a match forward, to win a premiership we will need at least one but I daresay two will probably be the premiership template heading into the future.
Sorry is JVR a Chol type, low possession, 2 goal a game forward (at best so far), or a Membrey type who gets up the ground and gets a lot more involved in play?
Understand your position on Gibcus. Fair enough.
What about the focus issue? Your thoughts on combinations of smalls and talls seems far removed from the way the club has approached it over the last few years. I think a combination of rule change and virus impact is at the root of this changed approach and would be interested to have your thoughts on what is a justification of the Clubs position?
He's more Membrey, work at ground level solid for a player his size, he's also very capable playing in defence. High point was 22 touches which indicates excellent work rate.
I think we've underplayed our hand with talls, since 2015 I think I've identified missed opportunities with Sam Taylor, Peter Ladhams, Bailey Williams and more recently Isaac Keeler & Will Verrall. These players are your bread & butter for trading & playing key forward roulette. In the case of Ladhams we could have significantly improved our draft hand in the event he was deemed a surplus requirement. Clarke has done ok with Balta, Miller & Gibcus but it's still unders compared to the Jackson era. As far as the Jackson era is concerned, I think he missed a few that I threw up but made up for that with players like Grimes & Astbury. Here's a list going back to to 2005.
Mitch Clark in 2005 (better than JON at least)
Jack in 2006 (and nearly smashed my car window like Frank when we traded pick 8)
Rance in 2007
Vickery in 2008 (although happy to have fixed that with the Bolton acquisition)
Ben Griffiths (poor pick in hindsight)
Sam Reid in 2009 (although I missed Astbury)
Darling in 2010 (at pick 6 which was fair value considering his underage year)
Membrey in 2012
Ladhams in 2015 (rookie)
Chol in 2016 (rookie)
Balta in 2017
Ben Miller 2017
Sam Taylor in 2017
Bailey Williams in 2018
** no picks in covid era
Josh Gibcus 2021
Isaac Keeler 2022
Will Verall 2022
I think you need to keep stockpiling, Jackson kept the pace up even after securing Jack & Rance, Clarke benefitted by getting a draft pick for Chol and securing Lynch as a free agent. As a strategy I'm not convinced this is sustainable given destination clubs struggle to remain in the frame for long periods. Geelong is the exception but many have capitulated like Brisbane, Hawthorn & West Coast.
Darling & Taylor are the obvious misses but i think Oscar Allen was our biggest miss taking Jack Higgins at #17
Allen , Taylor & Balta would have been a dream result and set up our team beautifully for the next 10-12 years
I was also a Bailey Williams fan and still think he would have been a great get with Bytel if we had traded our pick #20 for the doggies 2 picks #32 and something cant remember what it was atm
But Williams i believe will eventually end up back in Victoria and might become an option in the future if Soldo decides to move for greener pastures
The Williams/Bytel approach would have cost a future first, as a strategy it was risky but that would have been the bill to satisfy the Doggies who were positioning for West. In the end we won the premiership & selected Dow with that pick. Being totally objective I think Bytel & Dow are probably even Stevens but the extra tall makes that trade a winner.
As for Higgins & Allen, in hindsight I take Allen but I still maintain Higgins cops a raw deal on PRE, the fact he wanted to leave was due to a lack of opportunity & I also reckon brain surgery has hampered his progress, no one can plan for something like that. Perusing his stats he's now played 37 games for the Saints & booted 57 goals, those are decent numbers, last year he polled 7 votes at the Charlie, he still influences games even as a small forward. In his draft year I think he was seen as a midfielder first & foremost, I reckon that will occur more often now he's entering his prime years.
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Agree on Higgins, he ain't a bust. Wrong place, wrong time. But I don't think he's got much improvement left. Amazing effort for him to get back to playing footy. Did we use that pick on Tom Brown?
I am not sure I have clearly explained why I think the club now takes a different approach (see posts 3418 and 3426),
but let me just quote my favourite modern poet,
Come senator’s and congressman throughout the land and don’t criticise what you can’t…..
…..
The times they are a changing.
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I never seen him play forward in any nab games,but there wasn't anybody else to fill his spot down back.
It was a pick swap of 21 for pick 17 & we received a future second which was used on one of Sonsie/Banks/Clarke, not sure which one exactly but given they were in a block I'd probably say Judson Clarke.
I believe he played forward prior to NAB league, I also remember Richmond stating he had potential in that area, that was enough for me to give him the dual position tick, an element of shooting blind but given he possesses such an outstanding vertical leap I felt it was a risk worth taking. He did kick an outstanding goal from the boundary last year, I think he's got decent range & won't be limited when kicking from outside the arc.
And we swapped 17 to Geelong in 2020 for their 2021 first, which we used on Brown.
