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Patrick Naish
- Thread starter caesar
- Start date
CC TIGER said:
I’m with you, both as youngsters can go forward as mids, both are very smart users of the ball and both while not overly quick make the game go in slow mo around them. I think Naish is chronically undersold. 506 meters gained per game.
E
easy_tiger
Guest
Daigoro said:
If he's anything like Lappin he should go in the top 5.
Guy was a freak. Highly underrated due to amazing talent around him. Cant see the resemblance myself
bullus_hit said:
Yep very dangerous. Plus from what I've seen I wouldn't call him an elite disposer or decision-maker which, if you are outside, is very important. Happy to punt on him at a lower pick but I am really not sure on him as a top 25.
E
easy_tiger
Guest
Blind Turn said:
I havnt seen much of young Naishy, but the couple of games ive seen on the Wireless,
he seemed to cover the ground very well with a laconic gait,
and he uses the ball long and very well by foot.
Lappin did those things.
I can see what Daigoro sees
Could this be why the Club has flagged the possibility in the media that it may not match a bid that it considers too high?bullus_hit said:
Jonesracing82 said:
I think there's some truth to that, if there was a slider, say Stephenson for arguments sake, we'd overlook Naish. I prefer Lochie O'Brien as an outside runner, not sure how the club feels but I'd definitely make the tough call. Reckon we'll dodge any bid until North, get past that and we're home and hosed.
Not sure it’s wise to assume an 18 year old will always be anything !! Let’s just wait and see.nikolasmia said:
As I have posted before I know one recruiter who says he will be a jet
bullus_hit said:
Stephenson has to be higher on the board than Naish and if you were taking one or the other there wouldn't be too many bold enough to take Naish. On the matter of Lochie O'Brien versus Naish I think your take is quite an orthodox one given the current love for star runners. Andy McGrath obviously found himself ranked at 1 last year and Lachie O'Brien shares that star athletics background with him. He can really run. But even with superior running ability he isn't as prolific as Naish and you couldn't teach him the tricks Naish has if you tried. As good a runner as O'Brien is, Naish is the prettier ball carrier and the man I'd prefer to dish the ball to. Ball hunting is easier with a tank so perhaps O'Brien could become more prolific in time, but we are well positioned to back our man in over a bloke like O'Brien IMO.
On type, there are legitimate concerns with how Naish will go at the next level. But he does have tricks. He's a glamour. O'Brien's a runner not without his own nice shoe, but he's not as involved in the game as our man. We are in the very fortunate position that he's tied to us and we've made the prudent move to get draft points in the bank.
tigerlove said:
I've seen a bit of him over the last two years and could understand why you'd think his disposal wasn't up to scratch, TL. He is prone to mind boggling turnovers as you've noticed. But if Naish was trained to pull the trigger sparingly (1-3 times a game) and pick the conservative option the rest of the time he would have a disposal efficiency in the high 80s. He's a prodigiously talented kick. He is reckless with his decision making to the point of being almost suicidal. This bravery by foot needs to still encouraged but within reason. We've got a premiership football department. The coaches will sort this out quickly.
SCOOP said:
Daigoro said:
SCOOP said:
CC TIGER said:
easy said:
Love the positivity, lads. You're in the queue early. I'm not getting a lot of Sidebottom or N Lappin but I hope you're right. Naish has a couple of red flags for mine but the bag of tricks, the draft points in the bank and the 20% discount mean we are in a great position to bank on his talent overriding his limitations and is why I'd prefer him over a more defensive selection in O'Brien. I think he's a clear upgrade on a PRE darling in Corey Ellis, a man who played in Richmond's last loss and struggled badly while Motlop went apeshit. Naish walks in with a much better offensive game (could've kicked 4 against country but seemed happy with 2
) than Corey but probably walks in with similar defensive limitations. Time with Fly will do him good and hopefully we can get a couple of games into him next year. Maybe a premiership medal. ;D
The closest we have to Lappin (a champion, no doubt) is Menadue, in type if not quite quality (we'll see). I've been trying to think who Naish reminds me of. A little bit of Bryce Gibbs, perhaps. A touch of Caracella. Farren Ray.
Gyps and Scoop are right about his kicking and class. He's glamour.
Gyps and Scoop are right about his kicking and class. He's glamour.
Interesting comment Gypsy.Gypsy__Jazz said:
While I'm more than loath to make any form of comparison, there's a bloke already on our team who fits this scenario perfectly. Chunky Kiwi bloke goes by the name of Dusty. Always had a hoof on him that most could only dream about, yet would at times ( often last year ) butcher the ball as if he was using a chain saw. For a while there Dusty seemed to forever be trying to achieve the impossible kick or change his mind mid disposal as to what he was trying to do and simply flub the most inept looking disposal.
Not this year though, almost everything he attempted worked perfectly.
Don't mind the idea of youngsters challenging themselves and pushing the boundaries hard while they are learning, there's always plenty of polishing gets done as they mature n learn to balance their capabilities with their ambitions. I'm hoping Naishy gets to us after our first three live draft picks and we can play cheap bonus F/S pick, but if he's got the polish by foot and the run n carry capacity to go with it. I'll be comfortable enough wherever we pick him up, always room in the side for elite ball users.
Richmond could secure father-son Patrick Naish outside its top three draft picks
SAM LANDSBERGER, Herald Sun
November 20, 2017 9:41pm
Subscriber only
RICHMOND is set to be spared a difficult draft call on Patrick Naish with the Tigers likely to secure three top-25 talents before a bid arrives on the father-son prospect.
The Tigers will target tall players at Friday night’s draft and using picks 17, 20 and 25 before matching a bid for Naish would be a dream finale to a premiership year.
Richmond has been nervous that an early bid would come after five clubs visited Naish’s home during the season and then Fremantle also interviewed him at draft combine.
TOP PICKS: BUCKY NAMES HIS TOP 50 PROSPECTS
DRAFT 2017: HIGGINS NO. 1 IN CHAMPION DATA’S TOP 30
ARMSTRONG: WHAT REALLY HAPPENS ON DRAFT NIGHT
But queries on whether the outside midfielder can win his own ball should help Richmond secure the son of 143-game Tiger Chris Naish at a cheaper price.
Naish’s junior career failed Champion Data’s “Magic Number” rule.
That states that draft prospects who win less than 30 per cent of their possessions contested usually struggle in the AFL.
Naish recorded a contested possession rate of 27 per cent from 32 matches.
He averaged 22 possessions for Vic Metro this year, but only 4.5 contested.
Patrick Naish in action for Vic Metro. Picture: Stephen Harman
A bunch of high draft picks have failed to kick on after recording similar numbers — James Aish, Billy Hartung, Cale Morton and Jimmy Toumpas.
By contrast, No. 1 favourite Cameron Rayner won an impressive 53 per cent of his junior disposals contested across 29 matches.
Rayner and top-five pick Paddy Dow went at 60 per cent at the national championships.
Naish only cracked 100 SuperCoach points in four of his 32 matches.
But he boasts a beautiful right foot and was the No. 1 metres gained player at the national championships.
Naish’s average of 516m was 105m better than the next player as he impressed some recruiters with his natural dare and offensive run.
Odds_Banners_AFL.jpg
Tigers coach Damien Hardwick has also shown the ability to reprogram outside players.
This year Brandon Ellis went from an uncontested player to one who could win his own ball and use it aggressively.
While Naish can sometimes bite off too much by foot, one recruiter said he had a raking kick and would “look good in (our) jumper”.
Naish’s two younger brothers- Xavier, 16 and Charlie, 12 — are also hopeful of playing for Richmond.
The diehard Richmond fan kicked 10.3 in his 100th junior match and has trained at Punt Rd the past two summers.
Patrick Naish is likely to land at Richmond. Picture: Getty Images
Naish grew up idolising Brett Deledio. He sat in the MCG stands watching Richmond’s premiership after recording 21 disposals at 90 per cent efficiency in the curtain-raiser.
He would add a lick of class to Richmond’s existing pressure and grunt.
The Tigers could secure sliding swingman Jarrod Brander at pick 17 on Friday night.
Top-five prospect Jaidyn Stephenson might also be available as clubs reassess his heart condition.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/more-news/richmond-could-secure-fatherson-patrick-naish-outside-its-top-three-draft-picks/news-story/9111bbfaa400548255a7beb52bee7762
SAM LANDSBERGER, Herald Sun
November 20, 2017 9:41pm
Subscriber only
RICHMOND is set to be spared a difficult draft call on Patrick Naish with the Tigers likely to secure three top-25 talents before a bid arrives on the father-son prospect.
The Tigers will target tall players at Friday night’s draft and using picks 17, 20 and 25 before matching a bid for Naish would be a dream finale to a premiership year.
Richmond has been nervous that an early bid would come after five clubs visited Naish’s home during the season and then Fremantle also interviewed him at draft combine.
TOP PICKS: BUCKY NAMES HIS TOP 50 PROSPECTS
DRAFT 2017: HIGGINS NO. 1 IN CHAMPION DATA’S TOP 30
ARMSTRONG: WHAT REALLY HAPPENS ON DRAFT NIGHT
But queries on whether the outside midfielder can win his own ball should help Richmond secure the son of 143-game Tiger Chris Naish at a cheaper price.
Naish’s junior career failed Champion Data’s “Magic Number” rule.
That states that draft prospects who win less than 30 per cent of their possessions contested usually struggle in the AFL.
Naish recorded a contested possession rate of 27 per cent from 32 matches.
He averaged 22 possessions for Vic Metro this year, but only 4.5 contested.
Patrick Naish in action for Vic Metro. Picture: Stephen Harman
A bunch of high draft picks have failed to kick on after recording similar numbers — James Aish, Billy Hartung, Cale Morton and Jimmy Toumpas.
By contrast, No. 1 favourite Cameron Rayner won an impressive 53 per cent of his junior disposals contested across 29 matches.
Rayner and top-five pick Paddy Dow went at 60 per cent at the national championships.
Naish only cracked 100 SuperCoach points in four of his 32 matches.
But he boasts a beautiful right foot and was the No. 1 metres gained player at the national championships.
Naish’s average of 516m was 105m better than the next player as he impressed some recruiters with his natural dare and offensive run.
Odds_Banners_AFL.jpg
Tigers coach Damien Hardwick has also shown the ability to reprogram outside players.
This year Brandon Ellis went from an uncontested player to one who could win his own ball and use it aggressively.
While Naish can sometimes bite off too much by foot, one recruiter said he had a raking kick and would “look good in (our) jumper”.
Naish’s two younger brothers- Xavier, 16 and Charlie, 12 — are also hopeful of playing for Richmond.
The diehard Richmond fan kicked 10.3 in his 100th junior match and has trained at Punt Rd the past two summers.
Patrick Naish is likely to land at Richmond. Picture: Getty Images
Naish grew up idolising Brett Deledio. He sat in the MCG stands watching Richmond’s premiership after recording 21 disposals at 90 per cent efficiency in the curtain-raiser.
He would add a lick of class to Richmond’s existing pressure and grunt.
The Tigers could secure sliding swingman Jarrod Brander at pick 17 on Friday night.
Top-five prospect Jaidyn Stephenson might also be available as clubs reassess his heart condition.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/more-news/richmond-could-secure-fatherson-patrick-naish-outside-its-top-three-draft-picks/news-story/9111bbfaa400548255a7beb52bee7762
TigerMasochist said:
The comparison with Dusty is valid in that they both had ability that far exceeded their execution, TM. A rarity. I always attributed Dusty's error by foot to fatigue rather than reckless decision making. But it's possible it was both and we both had it half right. Nevertheless, I now rate Marto as just about the best kick I've ever seen. When the club tidies Naish up, we'll get a clearer picture of where he sits in the pecking order.
Smoking Aces said:
Thanks for that, SA. Some pots already mentioned by some astute PREnders. But back to the notion of targeting talls with these picks, I'm sure the club won't do that at 17 if a gun slides. Now despite talk about Stephenson's heart condition, I don't think he could slide to us at 17. If he does, the fact that he can't kick wouldn't deter me from prioritising him above any tall in the pool. Dangerfield was arguably the game's number 1 player in 2016 and perhaps the most consistent over the last three years and he can't kick over a jam tin. Stephenson's got some serious AFL traits and unfortunately I think we'd be dreaming to see him land with us.
As for the talls (not ruckmen) as a whole, this is a different year to last year. There are an abundance of options and ranking them with certainty is a very difficult task IMO. But I'd love to hear anyone's thoughts if they had an explanation as to why there is a clear pecking order. You want a baby (born later in the year) with athleticism and flashes of brilliance IMO. There's a lot of love for Balta (23/10/99) on the other thread and much like Naish he is prone to doing some seriously stupid *smile* but his best is extremely glamourous. Unusually so for a tall. We might be provided with an opportunity to jump on him at a great price. In other words, we might get to have our cake and eat it too. I've been surprised at the lack of love for Naughton on the other thread, but he's got outstanding credentials at our picks. Serious exposure to senior football and some distinguished performances at every level. That's a bloke born in November, PREnders. I think he's certainly the more conservative option but admire those declaring Balta superior and see the upside with him. But I think Naughton's credentials are extremely impressive, particularly at our position in the draft. In any case, we are short on talls and ideally we'll jag a good one, I just don't want us passing on a gun slider.
Smoking Aces said:
If this happens I will be popping the champagne, steal of the century. The heart thing sounds highly dubious to me, no way the AFL would rubber stamp a ticking time bomb. Stephenson has grown this season like few in the draft pool, just keeps adding to his already impressive game.
Gypsy__Jazz said:
I've analysed Naughton's game thoroughly but I just can't see how he edges out Sam Taylor who has been equally impressive at senior level. Taylor also has better reach and is quicker. Naughton has a marginally better tank but that gap will be closed in due course. But here's the real kicker, Naughton's ball drop is worse than Ryan Garthwaite, he has largely worked within his limitations by short passing with little oncoming traffic but that will break down when the speed picks up and when he's forced to kick long. The player who he reminds me of quite ironically is my namesake, Mr Paul Bulluss, the classic diamond in the rough who epitomised our time in the basement, serviceable but flawed. Certainly not worth a first rounder and a player who will likely find a place in a starting 22 but one who will struggle to become an elite defender. Kicking is the hardest thing to correct, biometric reprogramming is for the most part baloney, probably on par with teaching a player to kick on their non-preferred.
The romance is nice but I don't really care what his surname is. We've been down this road before.
Just pick the best available. If that's Patrick then so be it.
Just pick the best available. If that's Patrick then so be it.
bullus_hit said:
It's hard to imagine the world in which Naughton takes the kick ins, Bully. But the obsession with immaculate kicks got us Lennon and Corey Ellis. Brandon too I suppose, even he was sold as an elite kick but he's only ever been adequate and remains that at AFL level. But we are talking about a tall here. I don't mind the idea that we should only be trying to draft talls who we can envisage developing incredible offensive game to go with their defensive game and vice versa, but while I wouldn't be game to pull the trigger on Naughton early in this draft, I think others might think similarly. You have put a clear ceiling on him and believe his kicking ability overrides his strengths. It isn't incomprehensible that he slides and his credentials are outstanding at our draft positions.
Critically, Naughton can get the ball back, so he isn't completely bereft of offensive game. Intercepts are gold in modern times. That strength can't be undersold. While I agree that kicking is certainly not destined to be a virtue, I'm not ruling out improvement of his strengths. And good footballers are the best candidates to manage a limitation at the highest level or even eradicate it. The November birth month is compelling for a bloke with his attributes and clear form.
