The unvacced

[Ghost of 29]

Hey Ghost, i appreciate you have probably been too busy to answer, but can you share the evidence you have for this statement. I've been telling people this is fact, but they keep questioning my sauce, and I hate being one of those stupid people who just say "i saw it on the internet".

Yeah first week back at work, thought I had better head down bum up!!
His presser was reported widely and you can find it on the interweb.
I see Pfizer is begin trial phase of updated vaccine which is great. The point which gets lost on all this is mRNA is specifically designed for a specific strain of virus in this case all current mRNA’s are based on the Alpha which is 4 and if the news today of another variant is correct 5 variants old. I still fail to under how questioning how a drug is performing based on the basic data is such a bad thing, it should be the way a normal democratic society functions.
Sadly this whole thing has become so political, even raising simple questions is now off limits.

 

[HR]

yeah I don't get it

I don't get it either Antman.
It's 2022 FFS people.
But it looks like if you only use sources of information from Facebook you will learn that it's all just big pharma conspiracy crap.
The one stat that matters is the hospitalisations and death rates.
Good luck with any natural immunity theory for a disease that's not playing by natural rules.

 

[Born_a_Tiger78]

That's not a source, that's an unsubstantiated assertion.

It is also bollocks.

If you look at the new infections per 100,000 in the last 7 days Israel is high but Australia is well down in the 70s of most cases per 100,000. 4th jab in Israel would not be that high yet, I think they were starting with those who are more vulnerable.

As for the assertion above that you are more likely to get COVID if vaccinated, it just flies in the face of all the evidence and, of course, comes with no source.

If vaccinations are so bad how come the proportion of those in hospital struggling to survive COVID is far higher than the proportion of the population which is unvaccinated?

I really see little point in spreading this rubbish, what do you hope to achieve by doing this?

DS

People that are vaccinated are probably more likely to get tested in response to a runny nose or scratchy throat. Those that are un-vaccinated, I assume, would be less likely to test until they need some proper medical help.

I can see where the "statistics" that joker provided have been derived from. But, they're a load of crap.

 

[AngryAnt]

The Muslim GWS AFLW player who refused to play in the pride round.

I'm referring to the whole of Sir's politcal manifesto

 

[AngryAnt]

Yeah first week back at work, thought I had better head down bum up!!
His presser was reported widely and you can find it on the interweb.
I see Pfizer is begin trial phase of updated vaccine which is great. The point which gets lost on all this is mRNA is specifically designed for a specific strain of virus in this case all current mRNA’s are based on the Alpha which is 4 and if the news today of another variant is correct 5 variants old. I still fail to under how questioning how a drug is performing based on the basic data is such a bad thing, it should be the way a normal democratic society functions.
Sadly this whole thing has become so political, even raising simple questions is now off limits.

yes, but all means ask questions based on data around vaccine efficacy

It's the selective misquoting and other forms of gaslighting and misinformation that I object to.

 

[Ruby]

It probably doesn't help that you spell source "sauce" .... but hey .... who am I to judge?

The CEO interview is readily available through multiple platforms. It's a very simple admission and should be deeply concerning that MSM have failed to report it (think Hunter Biden!)

It's kind of irrelevant.

Dictator WA revealed the very information in his recent media conference that double dose Pfizer efficacy against Omicron is a mere 4%. Interesting that overseas they are now discovering it's actually negative (eg if you are double vaccinated you actually are more likely to catch Omicron than non-vaccinated persons using natural immunity).

But don't let the truth get in the way of the narrative.

Don't forget "arbeit macht frei!"

And most importantly - do your own research. Try DuckDuckGo and stay well clear of MSM/ Google / Twitter / censored platforms.

I'm sure you must all be wondering when they will deport the GWS AFLW player for inciting straight people against the LGQFTW......... community!

Sadly - most of you won't get that!

I am not interested in engaging in a discussion about vaccination with someone who clearly does not believe in the benefits both individually and collectively of vaccination. I am not sure why you don’t believe. Whether its for religious reasons, or you are contrarian, or are entertained by conspiracy theories. Each person is entitled to their own opinion. However, you are not entitled to make up your own facts and pedal them as truths. So when you refer to mainstream media and ‘Hunter Biden’ to support your opinion as ‘fact’ you are doing what you criticise others for.

I did not know anything about the Hunter Biden allegations. Someone said the same thing to me in an argument last year (saying I should learn the truth about Hunter Biden and Joe Biden). They had learned the truth from some internet source that they quoted as gospel. So, not knowing anything about the Hunter Biden story, I read the US Senate Report on the allegations. Its about 80 pages. If you haven’t read it yet, I suggest you do. The link is below. Its a Republican Senate Committee report, so logically it is partisan and critical of the Bidens. It found NO link between Joe Biden and US foreign policy favourtism of Ukraine (which was the initial view of the Republican critics of Biden). Read it yourself.

I know I am not going to change your view of the world. But appreciate that it is ‘your view’ of the world and spurious and made up nonsense won’t make it fact.

https://www.hsgac.senate.gov/download/hsgac-finance-report

For those that don’t want to read an 87 page report, and don’t distrust mainstream media … here is a link to the New York Times report.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/23/...johnson.amp.html?referringSource=articleShare

 

[TigerMasochist]

That's the thing - if you support a minority religious group you can't then pick and choose what aspect of their religion you support. Who knows what Houli would have done if put in this position and how the club would handle it if he refused to wear a pride jumper.

Already know how Issy got treated when he followed his religious beliefs n made comments deemed unacceptable by those in charge. Bash would probably side step making any form of public comment on the matter, but his religious beliefs wouldn't allow him to promote the pride matter.

People should simply be allowed to live n let live and find their own quiet balance in these areas. This constant Govt, Corporate push to publicly force everyone into actively promoting things that their upbringing n beliefs don't accept is farcical and non inclusive.

 

[Ghost of 29]

yes, but all means ask questions based on data around vaccine efficacy

It's the selective misquoting and other forms of gaslighting and misinformation that I object to.

Okay, one basic question many now ask is that with so many positive cases around the world with people who are vaxxed, isn’t it a logical assumption that the current Alpha vaxx isn’t stopping transmission or infection which to my eye it’s not. The hospitalisation claim I am dubious about but will defer to CDCs most recent findings.
And you make out the gaslighting is only coming from one direction. I would say it’s coming mostly from the Govt and it’s defenders.
And the term “misinformation” really means I don’t like your opinion.
I do find it funny how wedded some people are to this vaccine and feel they need to defend it at all costs.
Out.

 

[HKTigerB]

The simple numbers every government should use to fight anti-vaccine misinformation

Here is a relatively simple way of giving people important context about the number of vaccinated people who are affected by Covid

www.theguardian.com

 

[Brodders17]

I'm sure you must all be wondering when they will deport the GWS AFLW player for inciting straight people against the LGQFTW......... community!

Where would an Australian born Australian citizen be deported to?

The CEO interview is readily available through multiple platforms. It's a very simple admission and should be deeply concerning that MSM have failed to report it (think Hunter Biden!)

Can you share one link? In my limited searching i cannot find the quote.

 

[tigersnake]

The simple numbers every government should use to fight anti-vaccine misinformation

Here is a relatively simple way of giving people important context about the number of vaccinated people who are affected by Covid

www.theguardian.com

compelling stuff, stuff rational thinkers already knew, but well presented. Thing is, the anti-vaxxers will either a) ignore it, b) dismiss it as MSM big pharma propaganda, or c) fail to comprehend it and just explain it away with false or half truthy, out of context, obfuscated distractified crap.

You cannot reason with anti vaxxer conspiracy theorists. Its just not possible. You demolish one of their *smile* assertions with facts and logic, they just pretend it didn't happen and move on to the next *smile* internet fake rumour. And they will do that all day, all year. And this stuff takes time, we have lives to lead.

 

[AngryAnt]

Okay, one basic question many now ask is that with so many positive cases around the world with people who are vaxxed, isn’t it a logical assumption that the current Alpha vaxx isn’t stopping transmission or infection which to my eye it’s not. The hospitalisation claim I am dubious about but will defer to CDCs most recent findings.
And you make out the gaslighting is only coming from one direction. I would say it’s coming mostly from the Govt and it’s defenders.
And the term “misinformation” really means I don’t like your opinion.
I do find it funny how wedded some people are to this vaccine and feel they need to defend it at all costs.
Out.

Vaccines are not perfect and few ever have been. It's pretty clear that the virus still transmits often even between vaccinated people, almost certainly less than for unvaxxed people, but yes, it does. What is clear is that ICU patient rates and death rates are many orders of magnitude higher for unvaxxed people. Given the increased transmission of Omicron relative to Delta (which was much more transmissible than Alpha) try imagining the public situation right now if we had no vaccines.

Noting that we would be in a much worse situation right now without our imperfect vaccines is not being wedded to vaccines or defending government policies around this, it's just a recognition of data. Of course in the antivaxxer mind any concession that vaccines help means you are a government or big pharma shill, or "sheeple" or something. There is space to acknowledge the massive benefits of vaccines and still criticise elements of government policy, or big pharma practices but I guess in your mind you are either all in on vaccines AND government or you are a freedom loving critical thinker who has successfully resisted brain-washing or whatever.

The gaslighting comment refers particularly to your allegation of what the Pfizer CEO said - which is misinformation. He said two shots in the past are less effective, but boosters do increase protection markedly. You still have not conceded this point. That's gaslighting Ghost. That's misinformation, not because "I don't agree with your opinion", but because it's wrong. Provably wrong. Factually wrong.

 

[AngryAnt]

Where would an Australian born Australian citizen be deported to?


Can you share one link? In my limited searching i cannot find the quote.

I doubt Sir has even watched the interview, he's just repeating what he read on facebook or an antivax telegram group.

Here's the link to actual interview, relevant section starts at about 1:00. It's in the context of vaccine effectiveness against the (then) new Omicron variant.

From the transcript.

01:36

and we know that um the three the two
doses of a vaccine offer very limited
protection if any the three doses with a
booster
they offer reasonable protection against
hospitalization and deaths

He goes on to say that they are working on a more specifically Omicron tailored vaccine which should be available in March this year.

More discussion of the interview and how it blew up into an antivaxxer trope here.

Fact Check: Pfizer CEO Did NOT Say Two Doses Of Vaccine Offer Very Little Protection Against COVID-19 | Lead Stories

Did the CEO of Pfizer say that two doses of the vaccine offer very little protection against COVID-19? No, that's...

leadstories.com

Man I'm looking forward to getting all those cheques from Pfizer for being their shill any day now, new pergola would be nice

 

[MD Jazz]

Okay, one basic question many now ask is that with so many positive cases around the world with people who are vaxxed, isn’t it a logical assumption that the current Alpha vaxx isn’t stopping transmission or infection which to my eye it’s not. The hospitalisation claim I am dubious about but will defer to CDCs most recent findings.
And you make out the gaslighting is only coming from one direction. I would say it’s coming mostly from the Govt and it’s defenders.
And the term “misinformation” really means I don’t like your opinion.
I do find it funny how wedded some people are to this vaccine and feel they need to defend it at all costs.
Out.

One only has to have a basic understanding of maths to realise vaccines work. Just look at hospitalisations/ICU admissions by vaccination status. And then realise how over-represented the unvacced are in hospitalisations & ICU admissions.

You make these sly assertions (eg "the hospitalisation claim I am dubious about", "only a vague claim that it reduces severe cases/hospitalisation", "some reduction of severity or hospitalisation") with absolutely nothing to back them up and then claim some sort of superior intellectual position?

Talk about mis-information, you should be Out for spouting such indefensible nonsense.

 

[Baloo]

Israel,4jabs
Australia top 3 most vaccinated country.
Both top 3 per 100,000 most infections.

Thats not sauce. That's just dribble.

 

[Ghost of 29]

One only has to have a basic understanding of maths to realise vaccines work. Just look at hospitalisations/ICU admissions by vaccination status. And then realise how over-represented the unvacced are in hospitalisations & ICU admissions.

You make these sly assertions (eg "the hospitalisation claim I am dubious about", "only a vague claim that it reduces severe cases/hospitalisation", "some reduction of severity or hospitalisation") with absolutely nothing to back them up and then claim some sort of superior intellectual position?

Talk about mis-information, you should be Out for spouting such indefensible nonsense.

What you want to cancel me? Do you play the Soviet National anthem each morning?? And love your personal attack re the superior intellect when I claimed no such position, but if it makes u feel better in defending the vaxx go for it.
I’m dubious about all of it because it’s become 100% political especially in the US and it flowed through to Aus, which is sad because it is another sign of the degradation of our society into something closer to that of GO’s 1984.
Anyway you write about hospitalisation etc.. but don’t address my main point of transmission/infection. If it does one and not the other then it becomes a personal health issue rather than a public health issue.

 

[Baloo]

What's 100% political?
The simple fact is that vaccines never promised to prevent infection or transmission. They always significantly lowered the rates.

To now claim Pfizer doesnt prevent infection or transmission of Omicron is just another twisted statement being used by the Anti-vaxxers. It didn't prevent infection or transmission of any of the varients, but it significantly reduces the rate of infection and transmission.

The ratio of vaxxed vs unvaxxed in hospitals proves the vaccines work very well, but not, and never did, 100%

 

[DavidSSS]

What you want to cancel me? Do you play the Soviet National anthem each morning?? And love your personal attack re the superior intellect when I claimed no such position, , but if it makes u feel better in defending the vaxx go for it.
I’m dubious about all of it because it’s become 100% political especially in the US and it flowed through to Aus, which is sad because it is another sign of the degradation of our society into something closer to that of GO’s 1984.
Anyway you write about hospitalisation etc.. but don’t address my main point of transmission/infection. If it does one and not the other then it becomes a personal health issue rather than a public health issue.

Wow, nice response full of facts, verifiable data and well researched science . . . oh wait . . . just a pile of assertions, woe is me complaints and strange references to a country which has not existed for decades.

I would say nice try but it isn't, just pathetic.

No, we don't want to cancel you at all, no-one except you has made any reference to "cancel" anyone. But this is typical, so-called cancel culture is an attempt to portray those peddling unsubstantiated rubbish as somehow being the victim.

What we want is for a number of people to stop peddling lies, misrepresenting what is actually being said (eg: deliberately equating stop transmission with reduce transmission) and engage with the facts.

DS

 

[mrposhman]

Israel,4jabs
Australia top 3 most vaccinated country.
Both top 3 per 100,000 most infections.

How are we going with deaths per 100,000?

 

[AngryAnt]

Anyway you write about hospitalisation etc.. but don’t address my main point of transmission/infection. If it does one and not the other then it becomes a personal health issue rather than a public health issue.

I addressed it, and also addressed your disinformation around the Pfizer CEO.