could Vickery handle No2 Ruck job - year 1.

[Dyer Disciple]

<whoosh>

:rofl

 

[TuesdayswithTerry]

Rule out Vickery.....

Heard he will be long gone before our pick.

Did not hear him on SEN but a mate said he spoke really well.

Absolutely shattered if my sources are on the money........which they generally are.

I was speaking to a recruiter from one of the AFL Clubs and he is of the opinion Vickery will most likely get to Richmond at Pick 8. He was fairly certain Port are going a midfielder at pick 4 and the clubs between Port and us won't take him.

 

[Col.E.Kurtz]

I was speaking to a recruiter from one of the AFL Clubs and he is of the opinion Vickery will most likely get to Richmond at Pick 8. He was fairly certain Port are going a midfielder at pick 4 and the clubs between Port and us won't take him.

Good gossip TWT,

I can see a bit of sense in it, given Port have needs basically everywhere pick 4 is a high pick to spend on the second best ruck prospect in the draft. Spending 1st rounders on rucks is always a so-so proposition, but the opportunity cost is much lower at 8 than 4.

 

[TigerMasochist]

Good gossip TWT,

I can see a bit of sense in it, given Port have needs basically everywhere pick 4 is a high pick to spend on the second best ruck prospect in the draft. Spending 1st rounders on rucks is always a so-so proposition, but the opportunity cost is much lower at 8 than 4.

T.V. isn't just a ruck prospect, nor is he necessarily the second best ruck prospect.
Have already said the only time I watched the kids was the U18 final so I can't claim any broad knowledge at all, but. If you go on the basis of this series and the final being the showcase for the future players, then T.V. stood up loud and proud.
He started forward, flogged his opponent, marked and goaled consistently while playing there. He also chased and tackled well for such a tall player.
The periods he spent in the ruck he beat Natanui, not with leap and spring but with positioning and timing at the contest.
Now I may well have been suffering from a warm fuzzy afterglow from the match but I likened his type of game to a Spider Everitt.
There's one other player I can recall of recent times who also appeared equally at home either at key forward or ruck and that was the big fish Paul Salmon.
Is T.V. going to be anywhere near as good as either of these two players?? Who the hell knows, I certainly am only opinionating ;D.
He appeared to me in the peak game of the U18s year to have all the attributes required to play both positions comfortably, what develops from there depends on him and the club that drafts him.
Compared to the other kids that played in the game I'd put Rich before him and be happy to have a shiny big new high def T.V. at Tigerland.

 

[Col.E.Kurtz]

T.V. isn't just a ruck prospect, nor is he necessarily the second best ruck prospect.
Have already said the only time I watched the kids was the U18 final so I can't claim any broad knowledge at all, but. If you go on the basis of this series and the final being the showcase for the future players, then T.V. stood up loud and proud.
He started forward, flogged his opponent, marked and goaled consistently while playing there. He also chased and tackled well for such a tall player.
The periods he spent in the ruck he beat Natanui, not with leap and spring but with positioning and timing at the contest.
Now I may well have been suffering from a warm fuzzy afterglow from the match but I likened his type of game to a Spider Everitt.
There's one other player I can recall of recent times who also appeared equally at home either at key forward or ruck and that was the big fish Paul Salmon.
Is T.V. going to be anywhere near as good as either of these two players?? Who the hell knows, I certainly am only opinionating ;D.
He appeared to me in the peak game of the U18s year to have all the attributes required to play both positions comfortably, what develops from there depends on him and the club that drafts him.
Compared to the other kids that played in the game I'd put Rich before him and be happy to have a shiny big new high def T.V. at Tigerland.

I know like most good prospects he has played a number of positions, but generally when 200+cm players hit the AFL they will eventually develop into rucks who part time elsewhere. Like Salmon and Otto, very talented guys who can play forward but if you had to say the primary position in the AFL when they matured it would be ruck.

 

[Dyer Disciple]

Good gossip TWT,

I can see a bit of sense in it, given Port have needs basically everywhere pick 4 is a high pick to spend on the second best ruck prospect in the draft. Spending 1st rounders on rucks is always a so-so proposition, but the opportunity cost is much lower at 8 than 4.

Couldn't agree more, well said.

It's why i was saying a few weeks back i am confident again Vickery may fall to us. As much as Port needs a ruck, their midfield is far from A grade, now or on future talent. Though if they could get a Hartlett or Rich they would be flying.

And yes, well done TWT, may just be a chinese whisper but a feel good one. ;D

 

[TigerMasochist]

Centre spread in todays Hun lists T.V. as being ideal for Ports first pick, their mids are reasonable and they lack young talls.
Has us also lacking young talls but with our later pick it's come on down Corey......................... oops I mean Shaun Mc Kernan, quick, agile, courageous and versatile.
Damn! A cheap and nasty version of the top line wide screen high def T.V. Curses foiled again.

 

[BrisTiger24]

I reckon Port think they have a decent midfield (overrated?? More than likely).

The only way they won't choose Vickery is if Freo choose Hill over Rich as I don't think Port will pass by Rich.

 

[TuesdayswithTerry]

I reckon Port think they have a decent midfield (overrated?? More than likely).

The only way they won't choose Vickery is if Freo choose Hill over Rich as I don't think Port will pass by Rich.

My mate was of the opinion that if Rich is available at 4, Port wouldn't necessarily go him, but they will go a midfielder. I presume they must be tossing up between Hartlett & Rich (that is if Freo go Hill), otherwise they'll go Hartlett. There is some chance Rich could go to Essendon at 5.

 

[Col.E.Kurtz]

I reckon Port think they have a decent midfield (overrated?? More than likely).

I think they are too, their midfield stars are statistics bandits but if you look underneath the surface it isn't so flash.

Last year they had the best ruck duo in the AFL who dominated at tapouts yet more often than not they lost the clearances in games.
How do you lost clearances after dominating hitouts? Bad midfield work.

Having said that they are fairly young in the midfield other than Peter Burgoyne, so it's not a pressing need for them.

 

[davidrodan]

Both T.V. and Hartlett sound good and would be happy with either

If they are both gone then I would prolly rather Ziebell and Swift over McKernan
In saying that McKernan would still be a good pick and fill a need but for me it is

1. Vickery
2. Hartlett
3. Ziebell/Swift (leaning towards Swift ATM)
4. McKernan/Trengove (leaning towards Trengove ATM)

 

[Dyer Disciple]

I suspect Port's in a bit of a pressure cooker at the moment and will go the best midfielder at Pick 4 who will hopefully be able to contribute significantly straight away as opposed to a tall who odds would be much greater of not being ready in their first year to have as much impact.

I'm not saying they will go a midfielder just because of this, but i do think Williams is under a lot more pressure than those of us out of S.A understand. Maybe jayfox or someone in S.A could confirm. Stupid? Yes, but I do think Williams influences recruiting more than some coaches.

For mine, it would be madness for Port to overlook Vickery, but I do think their midfield is overrated and I suspect they know it. Depth wise you need to be able to get through the midfield quality the likes of Geelong, Hawthorn, Carlton, and the West Coasts and Brisbane's had of old. Not just have a few guns like Adelaide, St Kilda, Bulldogs, Collingwood etc keep getting found out by.

They can justify picking a midfielder over Vickery in some (and many on here's eyes) as saying we went for quality over position. Especially if you are of the school that so many are, of taking quality mid/KP's and gambling on getting rucks late. I would disagree myself, he's just as good I believe as any other player available at Pick 4 (and he's got a lot more strings to his bow than a speculative ruck ).

 

[Tigers of Old]

Actually, Vickery's screening results were disappointing.
He seems to be lacking in a couple of really key areas.

What are the key areas he seems to be lacking in Phanto?

Vickery is a difficult one. I really like the look of the lad because on the face of it he appears to be everything that we lack.
Big, strong ruck who can mark overhead and go forward..but that is at jnr level and I do have concerns about how reliable junior form in ruckmen transgresses to AFL level. I'd imagine that the stats aren't very favourable. So it makes you hesitate a touch.

The other thing re Vickery is that he has done an ACL and whilst he's seemingly recovered very well from it, after his draft camp results so has Tom Swift who looks potentially like an absolute ripper to me after seeing his vision recently.

Hamish Hartlett too has some folks raving although on the limited snippets I have seen I don't think his disposal looks as solid as Swift's, it would be a difficult choice between those two for mine. Interestingly in a recent interview I read too that Hartlett thought his disposal was his weakness.

Hartlett/Swift/Vickery?

I don't envy Francis & Craig's job this year.
Doesn't look clear cut at all and much will be dictated on their decision as to who goes early.

 

[Leysy Days]

Hartlett's kicking will be close to if not elite to leysy's eye ToO. Least of any worries with him.

Good points you make re: Vickery. Gee, its an interesting draft this year.

 

[Tigers of Old]

Hartlett's kicking will be close to if not elite to leysy's eye ToO. Least of any worries with him.

I trust your judgement if you have seen plenty but I was referring to what little I have seen of Hartlett which is vision from the Champs. He didn't hit too many targets that day. However like I have said before highlight reels can work both ways and it's treacherous territory to form a judgement from them.

It was interesting what Hartlett had to say here about his weaknesses during the carnival.

http://www.afl.com.au/News/NEWSARTICLE/tabid/208/Default.aspx?newsId=69335

 

[Leysy Days]

Cheers for that ToO. Good stuff.

Sure they're important, but even championship games can be overrated at times ILO. Its only 3-4 games in a season that a player can be in or out of form. Its just that everyone sees them rather than the other 20 or so games of the season.

Cotchin who had a pretty average carnival is a perfect case in point

On Hartlett, the pertinant point for leysy is "Usually I like to think they’re one of my strengths, my skills".

Which people know leysy also thinks is true.

 

[Tigers of Old]

Cheers for that ToO. Good stuff.

No worries, there's actually some very interesting interviews from most of the potential drafteees on the AFL site.

On Hartlett, the pertinant point for leysy is "Usually I like to think they’re one of my strengths, my skills".

Which people know leysy also thinks is true.

Well he still won AA honors for the champs so perhaps he is just being ultra hard on himself and the journo that wrote the interview obviously rates him if you read the intro.
However some of those comments concern me a touch because as we well know even the silkiest of skilled footballers can fall apart under the added pressure of elite football. Like all jnr draftees he's no guarantee of making it at AFL level. Be interesting to see where he ends up.

 

[Scoop]

Hartlett's kicking will be close to if not elite to leysy's eye ToO. Least of any worries with him.

Good points you make re: Vickery. Gee, its an interesting draft this year.

I agree with Hartlett, he just moves like a footballer. Not the same as Cotchin but he is a footballer in the modern era, in the 90's or the 80's. He is a footballer who could play in any era.

Great points on Vickery ToO. I have ever only been so so on Vickery as our pick. Not againist it completley but not able to get right behind the pick. Would I take a risk on a ruckman at 8? Maybe. Would I take a risk on a ruckman who had a knee problem? Not a chance. Those two things are what have worried me but I only just put it together.
I would take the risk on Swift. I still think Ziebell will be a very good AFL footballer but the jungle drums tell me that won't happen so I am righ now leaning towards Hartlett/Swift and a prayer that Rich is somehow on the board.

 

[Dyer Disciple]

Great points on Vickery ToO. I have ever only been so so on Vickery as our pick. Not againist it completley but not able to get right behind the pick. Would I take a risk on a ruckman at 8? Maybe. Would I take a risk on a ruckman who had a knee problem? Not a chance. Those two things are what have worried me but I only just put it together.
I would take the risk on Swift. I still think Ziebell will be a very good AFL footballer but the jungle drums tell me that won't happen so I am righ now leaning towards Hartlett/Swift and a prayer that Rich is somehow on the board.

Disagree on Vickery. He shows a lot more than just a kid who developed earlier than other kids. He's gotten over his knee just fine and showed some super impressive character while doing it.

I have no doubt he will be a elite starting ruckman. We need one badly, so Pick 8 is a no-brainer for me.

 

[Tigers of Old]

I have no doubt he will be a elite starting ruckman.

No doubt he'll be elite? Big call.
If that's the case DD he should be going at pick 1.